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Thread: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

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    Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Do you guys think that maths should be compulsory for HSC Students? Personally I do considering the use of mathematics daily in our lives and the simple fact that so many people cannot do simple calculations in their head. I also feel they should revise the syllabus and make general maths more challenging (I dont know what the new syllabus is and whether its more challenging than the current). There is often arguments that people (Normally english/humanities students) make that some people are not natural at maths which i find bs. I remember I was terrible in yr 7 & 8 but then once i found out the importance i started appreciating it and am doing pretty well now and enjoy it the most! I just feel that rather than people not being natural they never put effort in it and appreciate the beauty which surrounds it. The truth is that I can say the same thing with English on how its compulsory when im so unnatural at it. I still have to do it. I think they should introduce a system in which Math and English are compulsory in year 11 and you can pick from 4 other subjects to a total of 12 units (more if extension subjects are chosen). And then in year 12 you have an option to drop one of the compulsory subjects from math or english or you can keep both if you like.


    What do you guys think about the whole discussion on this?!

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Quote Originally Posted by cherryboi View Post
    Do you guys think that maths should be compulsory for HSC Students? Personally I do considering the use of mathematics daily in our lives and the simple fact that so many people cannot do simple calculations in their head. I also feel they should revise the syllabus and make general maths more challenging (I dont know what the new syllabus is and whether its more challenging than the current). There is often arguments that people (Normally english/humanities students) make that some people are not natural at maths which i find bs. I remember I was terrible in yr 7 & 8 but then once i found out the importance i started appreciating it and am doing pretty well now and enjoy it the most! I just feel that rather than people not being natural they never put effort in it and appreciate the beauty which surrounds it. The truth is that I can say the same thing with English on how its compulsory when im so unnatural at it. I still have to do it. I think they should introduce a system in which Math and English are compulsory in year 11 and you can pick from 4 other subjects to a total of 12 units (more if extension subjects are chosen). And then in year 12 you have an option to drop one of the compulsory subjects from math or english or you can keep both if you like.


    What do you guys think about the whole discussion on this?!
    I agree that you raise a very important point about the insidious creep of innumeracy amongst ordinary people. However, simply making maths compulsory in Years 11 and 12 is akin to locking the barn door after the horse has bolted. Even year 9 and 10 maths is more than sufficient to get by in ordinary life (heck, you do parabolas and logarithms in Year 10!). The problem is that many students' skills and motivation in maths has declined so much by this point that any further exposure to the subject is of minimal benefit.

    The root of the issue, in my opinion, stems from insufficient grounding in the fundamentals of mathematics at the primary school and early secondary (Years 7-8) level. Better teaching practices and higher expectations of students from the outset may better 'prime' them to view maths in a positive light, increasing the prospects of them (meaningfully) retaining the subject in Years 11/12 and beyond.

    As for English being compulsory (as opposed to any other subject), I understand this is because the scaling process used by NESA works better if there is a subject that all students in the cohort sit together. Students' performances in English can then be used to compare the strengths of other subjects' candidatures, allowing NESA to determine which subjects should 'scale' better than others.
    Last edited by laodeming; 14 Nov 2017 at 11:43 PM.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Quote Originally Posted by laodeming View Post
    As for English being compulsory (as opposed to any other subject), I understand this is because the scaling process used by NESA works better if there is a subject that all students in the cohort sit together. Students' performances in English can then be used to compare the strengths of other subjects' candidatures, allowing NESA to determine which subjects should 'scale' better than others.
    I don't think this argument would explain why English needs to be made compulsory, but rather that some particular subject should be compulsory (for scaling purposes).

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Ha dude if only english wasn't compulsory. I suck so much at it
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    This is an interesting topic
    Last edited by highshill; 15 Nov 2017 at 7:45 PM.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    In saying that its important to make some level of mathematics compulsory, I also believe that some level of English also should be compulsory in year 11 at least. Both subjects are equally important to society, but my argument is rather on why isn't maths compulsory rather than a Mathematics vs English debate. Ive also heard the argument on a science subject being compulsory which I think happens in Western Australia?! not sure exactly. But there is no way I believe that a science subject should be compulsory! waste of time if your not interested or thinking of advancing in the scientific fields at university levels.

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Honestly I think if a subject should be compulsory, it's maths. Improves your problem solving and perseverance (on the hard questions) whereas english is just testing your memory + how well you can bs according to the question.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    yes please make maths compulsory
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Does anyone know the reasoning for why they chose to make English compulsory instead of another subject?
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Quote Originally Posted by frog1944 View Post
    Does anyone know the reasoning for why they chose to make English compulsory instead of another subject?
    I think it's bc english is about expressing your ideas and evaluating useless texts as well as proposing arguments which (somehow) is supposed to benefit you in everyday society and tbh if they were going to do this they should make it more "logical" as opposed to basing it off novels, poems as well as useless Shakesperean texts

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Quote Originally Posted by cherryboi View Post
    I think they should introduce a system in which Math and English are compulsory in year 11 and you can pick from 4 other subjects to a total of 12 units (more if extension subjects are chosen). And then in year 12 you have an option to drop one of the compulsory subjects from math or english or you can keep both if you like.
    Do this and I'd have dropped English in Year 12. At the moment the only advantage of English that I can think of is that it makes you think and sort of might inspire creativity or creative thinking. Anyway at least I now never have to do the English subject again.
    Last edited by silverdawn565; 17 Nov 2017 at 12:39 PM.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Quote Originally Posted by Jaxxnuts View Post
    I think it's bc english is about expressing your ideas and evaluating useless texts as well as proposing arguments which (somehow) is supposed to benefit you in everyday society and tbh if they were going to do this they should make it more "logical" as opposed to basing it off novels, poems as well as useless Shakesperean texts
    Interestingly enough, this is equivalent to the argument used by students as to why maths subjects are worthless and should be non-compulsory early on.

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    Personally, I do think English should be compulsory, as understanding how something is communicated is actually quite important. Though the courses should be fixed so essays are take-home assignments, and not tests of how much you can memorise.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Maths should be compulsory and must be passed, but not necessarily be counted to your ATAR.
    English, ideally for me, is not to be compulsory, but I can live with it if it doesn't have to count to my ATAR.

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    This makes good sense. This will reduce the innumeracy but not screw up lives of english/humaniteis people. Also, I lile the idea of having an option to drop english after year 12. I mean, english is only about how well i can BS. But if u think about it, if it has been bs’ed, then there isn’t much point... I understand for year 10 level, can live with it for Year 11, but would not appreciate it onwards. As a full on STEM student, your system would be the most appropriate.

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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    Well, although mathematics certainly has its uses it is not for everyone. I think making it compulsory is too excessive.

    As for English, I do understand both sides of this argument. I don't find it to be a 'useless' subject, but take-home exams and essays are nicer than a huge closed book test. There should also be emphasis on the logical side of English- grammar, structure, syntax, spelling, flow, etc. Combined with creative prose and interesting texts, there is a chance for students to express themselves, improve their speech and gain more confidence in how they deal with the English language.

    I think the HSC needs a massive overhaul- too much rote learning.
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    Re: Making Maths Compulsory for HSC students

    I do think Maths needs to be made compulsory.


    The only problem with this is some people with learning deficiencies which arent suited to learning maths.


    However, maths is very crucial because it teaches problem solving skills and critical thinking. Of course this mainly picks up after 3u, but still its much more relevant in Maths then most other subjects. These are skills which arent really taught in the current modern day education system. Rote learning is favoured and critical analysis is rarely relevant.



    These are pretty much the same reasons I dont find English useless (which was by far my favourite subject in the HSC because I did things I enjoyed in school, minus the rote learning aspect of exams). Obviously English exams dont test this whatsoever. However, English is another subject that teaches the value of critical analysis. This is probably controversial, but I'd much rather english tested maybe 2 essays with an extra 30 minutes then 3, but with short texts provided for you to analyse on the spot. Thats much more applicable to real life situations and being actually useful rather than fucking your hand off writing 7 x 3 pages of essays in 2 hours.

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