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Thread: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    I'm not sure if this is true but someone told me that in James Ruse, they place the rankings of every student in Senior Year? Specifically Preliminary and HSC? In a school like mine, the top students would be more inclined to mock or pity the lower students.... But in JR, the students all help each other regardless of whether you're ranked top, middle or bottom and they just all want to improve as a cohort. If this is true, I can see why James Ruse performs amazingly as a cohort, even though bottom students are pressured into escaping that rank as much as possible, I think it's nice to know that the top students don't possess a sort of superiority attitude and have a kind of ' don't talk to me ' personality. (If this is actually true or not can someone tell me lol)
    Last edited by Frostguard; 14 Aug 2017 at 12:43 AM.

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by Frostguard View Post
    If this is true, I can see why James Ruse performs amazingly as a cohort
    Given the median ATAR is reported to be 99.15, it's probably true.

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by integral95 View Post
    Yes not all selective schools would produce really difficult exams, some schools deliberately make the exams a bit easier compared to other schools so that the gap between each student is extremely low, thus when your internal marks are calculated after the HSC, the students would attain similar marks despite the difference in rankings.

    Heard about this from an NSB a few years ago lol.
    My school just submits everyone close together anyway even if the gap is far
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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by _Anonymous View Post
    What is the style of teaching that gets them Band 6's more often than a student in a comprehensive school? What's being taught there which isn't being taught in a comprehensive school (narrow it down to G&T class)? For example, several different G&T stream students I know from various schools tell me they finish a section of a topic each lesson (hence they do an exercise for homework after each lesson). What's the difference in Selective schools; do they do several different sections of a topic in each lesson and do several different exercises for homework?
    Let's say there's an exam paper that is 50% easy questions, 30% above average questions, 10% hard questions, and 10% difficult questions. I would say most schools would teach to that 50%, some schools teach to the next 30-40%, and very few schools teach to that top 10-20%. The top 10% difficulty is what is being given at top schools for most questions, not just 10% of questions. There may not be any special "style" of teaching but the questions given may demand a higher level of understanding and they will be taught at a faster pace.

    Not every school teaches to a Band 6 level because the students are simply not capable of understanding to that level. Not every question in say Fitzpatrick or Cambridge is doable by most students. There are some very abstract and challenging questions that challenge even the top students. Those are the questions that are being attempted in selective schools.

    It might also be hard for G&T class students to gain a sense of perspective as to the level of difficulty of their assessments. Even their teachers may not have an accurate sense of perspective of what the selective schools are giving for assessments.

    Read this as well: Transitioning to a New School in Y11 and Impact of Ranking

    Quote Originally Posted by _Anonymous View Post
    I had a look at the Ruse Year 10 half-yearly and compared it to ours and I could see there was a significant difference in difficulty (mainly since the content they tested on were stuff we haven't learnt yet which lead me to assume they probs do several different sections of a topic in a day or they probs did a lot of it in Year 9). But I then compared our half-yearly with Sydney Tech's and there wasn't too much of a change in difficulty (some questions there seemed harder and also had some content we haven't learnt yet), but it wasn't as hard as Ruse's test (but I can't make an assumption based on 1 test).
    Like you observed, more topics are being covered, so there is a higher demand to be on top of all the content. I'd say the difference will be magnified when it comes to the HSC.

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by pikachu975 View Post
    My school just submits everyone close together anyway even if the gap is far
    For moderated internal marks the cohort will share from the same total amount of marks, so doing that benefits the lower ranked at the expense of the higher ranked.

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by A1P View Post
    For moderated internal marks the cohort will share from the same total amount of marks, so doing that benefits the lower ranked at the expense of the higher ranked.
    If you're first then this doesn't affect you right?
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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by pikachu975 View Post
    If you're first then this doesn't affect you right?
    You're right it doesn't affect first & last ranked.

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by D94 View Post
    Let's say there's an exam paper that is 50% easy questions, 30% above average questions, 10% hard questions, and 10% difficult questions. I would say most schools would teach to that 50%, some schools teach to the next 30-40%, and very few schools teach to that top 10-20%. The top 10% difficulty is what is being given at top schools for most questions, not just 10% of questions.
    Could you define what would be an easy paper compared to an above average and so on? Some students may find Year 10 5.3 easy whilst others may think it's hard. Would you consider Year 10 5.3 is 'easy-above average' level (meaning schools in the 40 and below range would do it) and consider some prelim content in Year 10 to be 'hard' and 'difficult'?

    Some others have also said stuff about "Advanced Year 10 5.3", what's the difference between that and normal 5.3? Our school uses the Cambridge textbook, so would that count as "Advanced 5.3"?

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    1. People in selective schools are generally able to learn and grasp concepts more efficiently and are able to learn faster in general. (There are outliers of course, especially for my school which hovers around rank 20-30)

    2. A lot of people get tutoring (it's usually either for maths/english/science).
    GENERALLY a person who has received tutoring will perform better than if they had not done so. Therefore, tutoring becomes the standard as you are inherently disadvantaging yourself if you do not recieve tutoring EVEN if you're naturally smart already. (RIP me an overachiever too poor for tutoring)

    Personally i don't think it's the teaching. I've had my fair share of mediocre teachers. There are also a myriad of teaching styles; some teachers are very disciplinary (which is much more conducive to achieving more because it forces the people always distracted to listen. ALTHOUGH, there might be less of these 'distracted' people in higher ranked selective schools) whilst others teachers are more laid back (usually encourages laziness though and only the self-disciplined shine through).

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by _Anonymous View Post
    Could you define what would be an easy paper compared to an above average and so on? Some students may find Year 10 5.3 easy whilst others may think it's hard. Would you consider Year 10 5.3 is 'easy-above average' level (meaning schools in the 40 and below range would do it) and consider some prelim content in Year 10 to be 'hard' and 'difficult'?

    Some others have also said stuff about "Advanced Year 10 5.3", what's the difference between that and normal 5.3? Our school uses the Cambridge textbook, so would that count as "Advanced 5.3"?
    I don't think it's too much of a big deal-at our school we didn't even know we were doing '5.3' and yr10 maths carried on absolutely nothing to the what we did in yr11 anyways
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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by _Anonymous View Post
    Right, but the printouts they give you; do you find them easy? What I'm trying to get is what level of difficulty the content they teach at Ruse is like. Are you currently doing Prelim content in Year 10 since you guys do learn content a Year advanced? Regardless, do your teachers print notes and hand them each lesson and assign you tasks (i.e. your teacher expects you to already know the content) to complete each period or do you guys still learn Year 10 5.3 content in class and write notes down and then get assigned H/W?
    To be honest, I'm actually not sure what you mean by "Year 10 5.3 content". We just go by the school syllabus - I'm assuming there's at least the basics of prelim content included in there.
    The printouts really depend; some of the questions can be challenging but still do-able. My teacher goes through the syllabus in class, writes info on the board (we copy down) and then, we get homework. However, since I'm in the top class, quite a substantial number of lessons are spent on enrichment instead (something extra my class does on the side).

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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by Meltingmelon View Post
    Coming from a top 10-20 ss, I think it's the students, competitive environment and tutoring tbh


    From doing trial papers of the top 10 schools, the exams are definitely harder in comparison to the hsc.


    Teachers are eh. Some faculties have amazing teachers while others have not-so amazing teachers. In terms of content, everything is probably the same (we all follow the same syllabus anyways). The tutoring aspect is from the mentality of catching up to others I suppose?? From all the competition, parents and students may feel the necessity for tutoring. I find tutoring helps develop an early understanding of content and acts as a foundation, which is then retaught at school and strengthened. Also pushes students to do work since tutor = $$. Friends who don't do tutoring are very hardworking, many of them do several activities inside and outside of school while balancing school work.
    Yes I was reading through this whole thread and I was looking for someone to mention this.

    This teachers aren't actually all that great, its more that the students are able to pick up on things faster than a comprehensive school, so less time is wasted on catering to individual's needs. Yes you may get some teachers who are more qualified (Eg, PhD), but that doesn't mean they are necessarily a good teacher. Especially in the humanities sides, the teachers tend to be the same as average schools (given my experience going to a top 200 school to top 20 school). Tutoring is definitely meant to get ahead of the game. Most of these students are capable of getting high band 5s without extra help, but do tutoring so they can get well into band 6, which in turn gets 99+. Tutoring takes 8-10 hours each week, especially for the STEM kids.

    With the 10.3 Advanced Course, Selective Schools in year 9 and 10 will ONLY do that course, whereas comprehensive schools will have all streams, with separate teachers administering different levels. Also English from years 7-10 tends to use 'harder texts' (i.e., Great Gatsby, The Lord of the Flies) as compared to comprehensive schools who may use simpler more easier to understand texts like Holes.
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    Re: Difference between Selective HS and the rest

    Quote Originally Posted by WildestDreams View Post
    Yes I was reading through this whole thread and I was looking for someone to mention this.

    This teachers aren't actually all that great, its more that the students are able to pick up on things faster than a comprehensive school, so less time is wasted on catering to individual's needs. Yes you may get some teachers who are more qualified (Eg, PhD), but that doesn't mean they are necessarily a good teacher. Especially in the humanities sides, the teachers tend to be the same as average schools (given my experience going to a top 200 school to top 20 school). Tutoring is definitely meant to get ahead of the game. Most of these students are capable of getting high band 5s without extra help, but do tutoring so they can get well into band 6, which in turn gets 99+. Tutoring takes 8-10 hours each week, especially for the STEM kids.

    With the 10.3 Advanced Course, Selective Schools in year 9 and 10 will ONLY do that course, whereas comprehensive schools will have all streams, with separate teachers administering different levels. Also English from years 7-10 tends to use 'harder texts' (i.e., Great Gatsby, The Lord of the Flies) as compared to comprehensive schools who may use simpler more easier to understand texts like Holes.
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    Baulkham Hills '16

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