Poll: do you believe in god?

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Thread: Does God exist?

  1. #1251
    -_- HotShot's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by katie_tully
    Dear lord, this thread makes me cry.



    What...the hell... That doesn't even make any sense? What has radiation sources got to do with the theory of the Big Bang? How can you dismiss the possibility of the Big Bang, but then go on to say the radiation could have been there before hand?
    i think it works the other way, i dismissed the theory of the big bang, which means that either somethin else caused radiation in the universe, or that radiation was always there.

    Remember the big bang did not create the universe, rather the big bang lets say arranged all the rocks in the universe. dependin on ur definition of 'universe' of course.

    oh katie, hate me all u want, ( i have a feeling everyone hates me).
    Ian Chappell


    Every time Watson claims a victim, Australian players converge and the congratulatory ceremony leads you to assume he's performed a minor miracle and dismissed Sachin Tendulkar and Brian Lara with the same delivery

  2. #1252
    katie_tully
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    Re: Does God exist?

    You have no fucking idea what the big bang consisted of, I would appreciate it if you went and educated yourself, or just ceased making cockfag statements all the time.

  3. #1253
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by katie_tully
    You have no fucking idea what the big bang consisted of, I would appreciate it if you went and educated yourself, or just ceased making cockfag statements all the time.
    it basically consisted of all the small rocks into one big rock, which then explodes making small rocks and pushing them away.

    weird analogy, i have a feeling scientists will figure out something different that may still mean that big bang did occur, but it probably didnt create the universe.
    Ian Chappell


    Every time Watson claims a victim, Australian players converge and the congratulatory ceremony leads you to assume he's performed a minor miracle and dismissed Sachin Tendulkar and Brian Lara with the same delivery

  4. #1254
    katie_tully
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    Re: Does God exist?

    http://cosmology.berkeley.edu/Educat...ng_Primer.html
    http://cmb.physics.wisc.edu/tutorial/bigbang.html
    http://liftoff.msfc.nasa.gov/academy...se/b_bang.html

    Just do us a favour and read them.

    lolercoaster at this website. http://www.ucg.org/booklets/GE/index.htm

    Many people who believe in God's existence feel compelled to defend their point of view in irrational ways. They hurt their cause by doing so. In like manner, many who believe there is no God refuse to give the evidence of His existence a fair hearing. In both instances, shallow prejudice is the real enemy.
    Point taken.

    However they ruin that nice little satement with the following.

    Natural selection, the blind, unconscious, automatic process which Darwin discovered, and which we now know is the explanation for the existence and apparently purposeful form of all life, has no purpose in mind. It has no mind and no mind's eye. It does not plan for the future. It has no vision, nor foresight, no sight at all. If it can be said to play the role of watchmaker in nature, it is the blind watchmaker" (1986, p. 5, emphasis in original).

    However, to avoid accepting uncomfortable evidence of God's existence, he reasons, "Biology is the study of complicated things that give the appearance of having been designed for a purpose" (Dawkins, p. 1, emphasis added).

    While admitting that living things give the appearance of purposeful design, Professor Dawkins does not consider the obvious—that, if they appear to have been designed, maybe they were designed.
    They are taking the hard work of Darwin and other scientists, and are trying to use it for their own agenda. Appearing to be designed is a crock of shit, especially if he had bothered to write a paragraph on microbiology, and about the inner workings of all eukaryotes.

    Professor Dawkins' backhanded acknowledgment that living organisms "overwhelmingly impress us with the appearance of design as if by a master watchmaker," as he put it (p. 21), is not dismissed so lightly by many other scientists. They see the overwhelming presence of intricate design in the universe as a powerful indicator of an intelligent Designer.
    Makes me sick. They have no proof of an Intelligent Designer, so instead they twist the words of scientists to make it seem like they too agree with the prospect of "intelligent design".

    Is our complex universe really the work of a blind watchmaker, as some contend? Is that what we view about us every day? Is life on earth simply the product of chance, with no purpose and planning, no control or consequences?
    This is the basic argument of Creationists. They cannot seem to accept that perhaps the Earth is just a coincidence, and that maybe there is no other purpose for life except to "live". Why does a dog lick its arse? Because that is its purpose in life, or because it wants to have a clean butt?
    Gaaah. I cannot believe some people are so ready to accept this baseless shit, so that they may have meaning in their lives.

  5. #1255
    -_- HotShot's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    some scientists say that the possibility of a similar planet to earth is almost certain in the galaxy, what do u think?

    do u think there other humans on other planets? or is it just not possible? the probability of getting the conditions for humans to live is too low?

    there is nothing to prove, that god doesnt exist at the same we cant prove that he does. or if we do none will believe it.(miracles and stuff)

    The following is a list of various religious interpretations of the Big Bang theory:

    * A number of Christian churches, the Roman Catholic Church in particular, have accepted the Big Bang as a possible description of the origin of the universe, interpreting it to allow for a philosophical first cause. Pope Pius XII was an enthusiastic proponent of the Big Bang even before the theory was scientifically well established.
    * Some students of Kabbalah, deism and other non-anthropomorphic faiths concord with the Big Bang theory, for example connecting it with the theory of "divine retraction" (tzimtzum) as explained by the Jewish scholar Moses Maimonides.
    * Some modern Islamic scholars believe that the Qur'an parallels the Big Bang in its account of creation, described as follows: "Do not the unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together as one unit of creation, before We clove them asunder?" (Ch:21,Ver:30). The claim has also been made that the Qur'an describes an expanding universe: "The heaven, We have built it with power. And verily, We are expanding it." (Ch:51,Ver:47). Parallels with the Big Crunch and an oscillating universe have also been suggested: "On the day when We will roll up the heavens like the rolling up of the scroll for writings, as We originated the first creation, (so) We shall reproduce it; a promise (binding on Us); surely We will bring it about." (Ch:21,Ver:104).
    * Certain theistic branches of Hinduism, such as in Vaishnavism, conceive of a theory of creation with similarities to the theory of the Big Bang. The Hindu mythos, narrated for example in the third book of the Bhagavata Purana (primarily, chapters 10 and 26), describes a primordial state which bursts forth as the Great Vishnu glances over it, transforming into the active state of the sum-total of matter ("prakriti"). Other forms of Hinduism assert a universe without beginning or end.
    * Buddhism has a concept of a universe that has no creation event, but instead goes through infinitely repeated cycles of expansion, stability, contraction, and quiescence. The Big Bang, however, is not seen to be in conflict with this since there are ways to conceive an eternal universe within the paradigm. A number of popular Zen philosophers were intrigued, in particular, by the concept of the oscillating universe.
    Last edited by HotShot; 30 Mar 2006 at 10:54 AM.
    Ian Chappell


    Every time Watson claims a victim, Australian players converge and the congratulatory ceremony leads you to assume he's performed a minor miracle and dismissed Sachin Tendulkar and Brian Lara with the same delivery

  6. #1256
    katie_tully
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Excellent, so you can copy and paste biblical exerts that correlate with the theory of the big bang.

    Which proves what? That the big bang occured, or that God exists?

    Neither. But I know what we have evidence for, and it ain't no intelligent creator.

  7. #1257
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    there is nothing to prove, that god doesnt exist at the same we cant prove that he does. or if we do none will believe it.(miracles and stuff)
    But I've dealt with this 1000 times man.... even tho, we can't ultimately prove god does or does not exist, currently, based on the information we have, there is no reason to believe in God HOWEVER there is reason not to believe in God. Now, even if this turns out... ultimately to be false, it does not matter, because based on the facts we had on hand, based on the logic best understood at our time, we were correct and it was provisionally true that there was no god.

    For instance... if we wanted to prove that the santa claus myth isn't real, what would we do? Perhaps we'd try to first prove that reindeer don't fly... now to do this we might push them off a building... now how many should we push before we reasonably conclude that reindeer can't fly? We can't push them ALL so there's always some uncertainty, maybe the reindeer we didn't push CAN fly! I mean even if the ones we didn't push can fly, at the time, if we said they couldn't... we'd be provisionally correct, even if ultimately some reindeer can fly.

    So as you can clearly see, whether something is ultimately proven or not, we are creatures of induction and it makes logical sense.


    Edit:

    As for your religious quotes pointing to corrolations between what a religion has said, and the big bang theory - who cares. I know that there are many more reputable scholars who have translated these texts that could tell us exactly what those verses mean (in their pure form) and give it some historic point of reference, but I don't know. All I can say is that they're very vague and could mean anything, so the fact that these verses have only been intepreted to mean what you say they mean, after the fact, then they're essentially very shonky to prove any sort of predictive power. I mean, you are doing what the nostradamians do, they apply entirely new meanings to things, then bank on the fact that very few people will bother to understand the true history behind it.
    Last edited by Not-That-Bright; 30 Mar 2006 at 12:59 PM.
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  8. #1258
    katie_tully
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    Re: Does God exist?

    <3 @ u 2

  9. #1259
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Natural selection, the blind, unconscious, automatic process which Darwin discovered, and which we now know is the explanation for the existence and apparently purposeful form of all life, has no purpose in mind.
    See this is a very tricky statement and you can tell they wrote it to be so... because essentially I agree with them, but at the same time see they say it had no 'purpose in mind', however purpose was created. See all things, have evolved for survival, and that is the key guiding factor.
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  10. #1260
    katie_tully
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    Re: Does God exist?

    I am hearting both of you. Except hot-shot. But there is no cute ascii image for a dagger.

  11. #1261
    Executive Member davin's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    i think it works the other way, i dismissed the theory of the big bang, which means that either somethin else caused radiation in the universe, or that radiation was always there.
    Remember the big bang did not create the universe, rather the big bang lets say arranged all the rocks in the universe. dependin on ur definition of 'universe' of course.
    oh katie, hate me all u want, ( i have a feeling everyone hates me).

    universe is at this point basicly defined as everything we're aware of.
    now, as for your comment about radiation, radiation doesn't "just exist", it does have to have some source of some nature to radiate from. now, you've proven that you have no idea what the cosmic background radiationo is whatsoever, so i'll sum up quickly. basicly, there is a background radiation that has been detected in the entire universe. when looking in any direction, ignoring occasional closer features, the radiation is almost exactly the same. the wavelength it is at, corresponds exactly for the shift in the spectrum that had been calculated from the first light in the universe, which took place a little bit into the life of the universe, when, basicly, the universe first became transparent. the values for what wavelength it would be came out of a lot of what we know about chemistry.
    the existance of the radiation, and at what wavelength it would be found, was predicted a good 10 or 20 years before it was actually detected. Note that the wavelength was predicted, not just "oh, theyre's something in the background", it was a specific prediction based on theory, and it was supported by evidence

  12. #1262
    cheese hater stalk_if_u_dare's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by webby234

    ARGUMENT FROM SMUGNESS
    (1) God exists.
    (2) I don't give a crap whether you believe it or not; I have better things to do than to try to convince you morons.
    (3) Therefore, God exists.

    i like that reasoning. I believe he exists...thats all i have to say.


    as anyone seen the HitchHiker's Guide To the Galaxy reasoning about the yellow fish & the logic of God's exsitince (cant spell)?? funny
    University of Canberra
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  13. #1263
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Stalk_if_u_dare, u know that the guy who wrote the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy is actually a highly noted sceptic and atheist? :P
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  14. #1264
    cheese hater stalk_if_u_dare's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Not-That-Bright
    Stalk_if_u_dare, u know that the guy who wrote the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy is actually a highly noted sceptic and atheist? :P
    yeah i know...doesnt mean cos im a christian i protest against it. i just love the "Oh, I never thought of that" & disappears in a puff of thought "Oh, that was easy" said man...etc etc
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  15. #1265
    Ecclesiastical Die-Hard Iron's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Not-That-Bright
    Stalk_if_u_dare, u know that the guy who wrote the hitchhiker's guide to the galaxy is actually a highly noted sceptic and atheist? :P
    Salmon of Doubt demolished my god

  16. #1266
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    of course you shouldn't protest, I just thought i'd point it out cuz he's very witty, I love this video lecture i got of him and richard dawkins (and some others), he was really creative with the way he explained the origins of religion, really funny guy. The world is less not having him
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  17. #1267
    cheese hater stalk_if_u_dare's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Iron
    Salmon of Doubt demolished my god
    Hi Iron! :wave:
    i bet if gateway would have a fit if they read this thread

    Mr Brew yelled at me cos i questioned about the Big Bang when i was in yr5
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  18. #1268
    cheese hater stalk_if_u_dare's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by Not-That-Bright
    of course you shouldn't protest, I just thought i'd point it out cuz he's very witty, I love this video lecture i got of him and richard dawkins (and some others), he was really creative with the way he explained the origins of religion, really funny guy. The world is less not having him
    tis such a shame he's not with us....he might have made the movie better
    University of Canberra
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  19. #1269
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Oh yea, the movie was utter shit - i walked out on it :/
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  20. #1270
    Executive Member davin's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    the BBC's miniseries version was way better. They should've just released that
    "The best kind of revenge is, not to be like unto them."

  21. #1271
    Banned Lundy's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    I have his autograph. Booyah.

  22. #1272
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Quote Originally Posted by katie_tully
    I am hearting both of you. Except hot-shot. But there is no cute ascii image for a dagger.

    tats nice, its o nly a dagger that ur were intending. i have had all sorts of other stuff.....

    but anyway.
    Ian Chappell


    Every time Watson claims a victim, Australian players converge and the congratulatory ceremony leads you to assume he's performed a minor miracle and dismissed Sachin Tendulkar and Brian Lara with the same delivery

  23. #1273
    Senior Member gerhard's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    hey christians, whats the best version of the bible for reading (ie not for academic purposes, so exclude new standand revised and its ilk). king james?

  24. #1274
    Andrew Quah
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    Re: Does God exist?

    LOL KING JAMES Foo!
    I am a homosexual guys, in case you didnt know. Sorry

  25. #1275
    Cadet Nodice's Avatar
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    Re: Does God exist?

    Yes.

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