Concrete Poetry and EE2

[Asubmarine]

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Beginning of this year I went to an EE2 day where we spoke to a head marker blah blah etc.
Basically were told to avoid concrete poetry as it was a "lower order" skill. I was never planning on using concretism as I thought that it was just synonymous with the cliched real shape poem.
However through some wider reading concretism is more about the "spacialization" of language.

Now the question is do we believe that the BOS disregards all concretism as an irrelevant skill or is it just the stereotypical poems shaped like stupid shit like a knife or whatever that the BOS is opposed to?

take a look at Mallarme or AUgusto De campos for serious examples I
guess "http://www.poetryintranslation.com/PITBR/French/MallarmeUnCoupdeDes.htm"

/how the fuck do you do a link? haha

[alex.leon]

Tsup, Subdogs.

Hmm, well, an 08'er on this site called frezbo got 50/50, and they used concretism quite extensively. Also, isn't one of the poetry items in like the 07 Showcase full of shape poems..?

[Asubmarine]

hows it going man? how're ur exams looking?

Yeah i've seen a few past showcasers that used shape poetry. The girl that used to be on these forums that got in a couple of years ago did it pretty extensively in her Sylvia Plath thing.

I guess i'm just curious as to whether the markers disregard all efforts to arrange wording more effectively, just marking the content. Or if they take it into consideration as well.

Also was pretty keen to just start more conversation in the poetry forums. It's always dead haha

[alex.leon]

eckh, exams. paper 1 went alright, I thought. essay question was tops. as always I pondered the creative too much, had to remind myself I wasn't writing a poem (although, I sort of wrote a prose poem...long story. Let's just hope it does well)

Hmm, shape poetry does have an awful primary-school kind of stigma to it. I guess it's because it can be so shallow and...superficial. I like the whole 'spacialization' of language though. Those were the kind of things that I did initial research on, then kind of gave up and went for traditional straight down the line kinda stuff.

Noone is EVER on the poetry forums!!

[Asubmarine]

sounds like the exam went pretty alright for you. I'm just wasting time getting ready for tomorrow's haha.

Tackling the more abstract ideas on concretism is probably beyond the average hsc student anyway. So i'd say the comments I heard were likely intended to disuade people from copying "cool" stuff out of the showcases.

I think there's alot of lurkers on the poetry forums but just few that post. Will be interesting to see the 2010ers come through sooner or later.

[JuiceofOhio]

Heyyy,

I'm doing poetry for my 2010 major work, well at least I plan to.

I'm essentially going in with little/no poetic experience, but I guess that's kind of the idea yeah? and yeahh ive been looking at concrete poetry, it really takes my fancy, we have our first lesson tomorrow morning

A question for you who did poetry for x2, what work can i be doing like now, at the very start?

Also, I am fascinated by philosophy, different ideas, etc. and I was hoping to be able to explore things like Solipsism and Determinism within my poetry, firstly will that work and secondly, don't suppose you know any examples of poems or poetry which has explored those kinds of ideas?

Thanks so much, and sorry, i know little about poetry except that I want to learn

[Asubmarine]

Hey juice.
I think everyone goes into ext2 poetry with rather limited experience. The extent to which poetry gets covered in high school is pretty abysmal really, even in extension. So this is probably one of the best ways for you to learn. I know it's the reason I did x2.

The best thing you can do is really try to educate yourself about where poetry has been in the past and where it's going now. I found it very difficult to find where I should be starting from. People will tell you to read showcase, but imo it's abit of a superficial way of getting into it. It's also very difficult to seperate the good works in it from the not so good.

If you're interested in suggested reading/research, i'm happy to PM you with ideas. but it all depends on how in depth you want to go..

[JuiceofOhio]

Thanks heaps for the reply

That's reassuring, seems at current I'm the only one in my class planning on doing poetry.

Thanks for the starting ideas, I'll do a bit of research...

And I will take you up on the PM offer, I'm especially after some suggested reading, any ideas or anything you may have I'm also open to.

Is your 09 major work posted in the 09 showcase thread? I'd like to have a read, see what you did etc...

EDIT: dont worry haha i found it, i've actually skimmed this a few times

[alex.leon]

Originally Posted by JuiceofOhio

Thanks heaps for the reply

That's reassuring, seems at current I'm the only one in my class planning on doing poetry.

Thanks for the starting ideas, I'll do a bit of research...

And I will take you up on the PM offer, I'm especially after some suggested reading, any ideas or anything you may have I'm also open to.

Is your 09 major work posted in the 09 showcase thread? I'd like to have a read, see what you did etc...

EDIT: dont worry haha i found it, i've actually skimmed this a few times

Hooray for poetry! You're very brave.

My best advice is to start conceptualising straight away. I think you really want to have that done by the end of the first term, or at least have some kind of idea that has already developed. It will really, really help you in the long run.

As for not having any poetic experience, I was exactly in the same boat this time last year. Had never written poetry before. You sound really willing to learn which is the best quality you can have. Just go to the library and read. Read, read read.

Here's a great website: poetry craft and theory: creation, analysis and improvement.

Of course, it depends on what you'll actually be doing poetry-wise. If you're going to write an Odyssey-style epic poem, that's probably not a great site- but I found it really helpful in giving me a quick summary of what poetry IS.

Good luck, and all the best for the future. I hope to see you MW in BoS showcase next year!

[JuiceofOhio]

Geee,

thanks heaps, I'm so happy i picked poetry now because so far I have received so much insight and help, that site right there I've just been browsing and the workshop section looks like exactly what I'm after.

All advice taken, thanks lots!

Oh and alex I've been a bit of a lurker for some time now and I read your poetry suite in the showcase thread and I loved it.

And I agree with some above statements, let's make the poetry forum more active

[alex.leon]

Originally Posted by JuiceofOhio

Geee,

thanks heaps, I'm so happy i picked poetry now because so far I have received so much insight and help, that site right there I've just been browsing and the workshop section looks like exactly what I'm after.

All advice taken, thanks lots!

Oh and alex I've been a bit of a lurker for some time now and I read your poetry suite in the showcase thread and I loved it.

And I agree with some above statements, let's make the poetry forum more active

Always happy to help, just like Asubmarine, feel free to PM me about anything.

Oh, and thankyou I'm glad you enjoyed it!