Why I burned my 'Proof of Aboriginality'

[Selador]

A great read on the 'aboriginal industry' and affirmative action from an insiders perspective.

http://www.abc.net.au/unleashed/4281772.html

After a career spent in jobs reserved for Indigenous Australians, Kerryn Pholi has had enough of being a "professional Aborigine". Far from closing the gap, she now believes these strategies are racist.

[soloooooo]

Far from closing the gap, she now believes these strategies are racist

As do most Australians.

[Lolsmith]

Racism isn't the issue and arguing it is childish. The issue with this sort of initiative is that it doesn't necessarily accomplish what it sets out to do. It can in a very narrow scope; a person of Aboriginal descent is employed. The problem with this being that what do people now view of the minority? Do employers now assume that it is essential that this group of people *need* affirmative action in order to be able to be employed? Do people who gain employment actually gain skills that they can apply to other work? Does affirmative action like this exacerbate or help create a culture of entitlement?

[Debauchee]

she now believes these strategies are racist.[/I][/B]

do nothing to help aborigines

racist

enact policies to help aborigines

racist

[fortyfortyforty]

Is there any evidence that affirmative action works? It just seems they're talking about people who couldn't make the cut but were just placed there. If you did affirmative action for other groups, e.g. putting people with down syndrome in engineering work, or putting physically weak people in physically demanding labour positions, are they going to suddenly become good at these jobs?

[soloooooo]

In all fairness though, the woman in the article is not what most people would recognise as Aboriginal. If you seen her in the street you would say she is Caucasian.

[townie]

In all fairness though, the woman in the article is not what most people would recognise as Aboriginal. If you seen her in the street you would say she is Caucasian.

Maybe not but Aboriginality isn't based on whether somebody "looks" Aboriginal

PS
I don't agree with affirmative action for any group (although I think there are sometimes often legitimate reasons for 'identified' positions, e.g. The ABS employs Indigenous Engagement Officers, who liase with the aboriginal community on statistical issues, and rightly or wrong some aboriginal people just won't talk or listen to a non-aboriginal - obligatory my own views not those of the ABS)

[moll.]

Maybe not but Aboriginality isn't based on whether somebody "looks" Aboriginal

PS
I don't agree with affirmative action for any group (although I think there are sometimes often legitimate reasons for 'identified' positions, e.g. The ABS employs Indigenous Engagement Officers, who liase with the aboriginal community on statistical issues, and rightly or wrong some aboriginal people just won't talk or listen to a non-aboriginal - obligatory my own views not those of the ABS)

Racial discrimination in employment is acceptable to me if part of the employment is inherently racial; eg Chinese waiter in Chinese restaurant. So yeah, agreed. But what I don't like is all the government funds and social policies explicitly targeted towards Aborigines on the grounds of "making up for past wrongs". Those past wrongs have made them poor, so why not just target their poverty, rather than their genetics? There are shitloads of poor white people too, who might need additional help getting employed or getting a scholarship for uni, yet we ignore them because there is a culture that somehow they're less worthy than poor Aborigines, despite the only difference being minor genetics. Poverty isn't monopolised by the Aboriginal community.

[hayabusaboston]

do nothing to help aborigines

racist

enact policies to help aborigines

racist

I was once told by an aborigine on the street:

"EH FUCK YOU WHITE CUNT! YOO FUCKIN RACIST CUNTS YOU WHITE FUCKIN CUNTS GO FUCK YOURSELVES"

He was inebriated of course.

I was just walking past with my bro and this aboriginal man felt the need to swear his head off at us. Wtf.

[lpower3]

Although I agree with the reason she burnt her proof of aboriginality, I think it's still a pretty disrespectful act on her part.

Wherever you're from; Asia, South America, or Alice Springs, you should always respect your heritage, regardless of the positives that are from this heritage. My family are the typical white Australians, who emigrated in the mid-1800s from Inverness in Scotland, and despite me having only a minimal level of Scottish heritage, I would still respect that till the day i died.
Now while she may only think of her heritage as a burden that will always hang over her head, the fact of the matter is that this heritage is what makes you.

[funkshen]

Racial discrimination in employment is acceptable to me if part of the employment is inherently racial; eg Chinese waiter in Chinese restaurant.

So the Bavarian Beer Cafe should be allowed to hire Bavarians only?

[Garygaz]

or sluts with big tits

[lpower3]

or sluts with big tits

only this

[Debauchee]

Maybe not but Aboriginality isn't based on whether somebody "looks" Aboriginal

If someone doesn't look aboriginal 99 times out 100 its because they're mostly not aboriginal. Aborigines who are mostly European have much better socio-economic outcomes than mostly-aboriginal aborigines and so extending race-based welfare and employment privileges to them is dumb.

[Debauchee]

Racial discrimination in employment is acceptable to me if part of the employment is inherently racial; eg Chinese waiter in Chinese restaurant. So yeah, agreed. But what I don't like is all the government funds and social policies explicitly targeted towards Aborigines on the grounds of "making up for past wrongs". Those past wrongs have made them poor, so why not just target their poverty, rather than their genetics? There are shitloads of poor white people too, who might need additional help getting employed or getting a scholarship for uni, yet we ignore them because there is a culture that somehow they're less worthy than poor Aborigines, despite the only difference being minor genetics. Poverty isn't monopolised by the Aboriginal community.

If aborigines are poor because of "past wrongs", why are white australians poor?

[Memento-mori]

If someone doesn't look aboriginal 99 times out 100 its because they're mostly not aboriginal. Aborigines who are mostly European have much better socio-economic outcomes than mostly-aboriginal aborigines and so extending race-based welfare and employment privileges to them is dumb.

This.

I've held the belief for long that Aboriginal Australians are often singled out, portrayed as 'dumb' and needing the white man's help. I hate it with a fiery passion when high schools and universities go on about their 'generous' bureseries and scholarships in their booklets. It takes more planning and more indepth research and analysis to stop the low socio-economic lifestyles. The areas in which they live in are usually in desperate need of health care nurses and doctors, social workers and more applied health workers as well as education resources. Simply taking a person out for "employment" doesn't solve any problems at all. Being Aboriginal is so often portrayed as some kind of disability, it's sickening.

The stereotype of an Aboriginal male teenager who suffers from over or under nutrition, who doesn't go to school, has an awful addiction- is portrayed as trash in the Australian eyes. But if he is whiter or is white, the pity he would get.

[SnowFox]

If someone doesn't look aboriginal 99 times out 100 its because they're mostly not aboriginal. Aborigines who are mostly European have much better socio-economic outcomes than mostly-aboriginal aborigines and so extending race-based welfare and employment privileges to them is dumb.

Socio-economics is only a small part. Genetic diseases still crop up and diabetes is a huge risk.

[townie]

If someone doesn't look aboriginal 99 times out 100 its because they're mostly not aboriginal. Aborigines who are mostly European have much better socio-economic outcomes than mostly-aboriginal aborigines and so extending race-based welfare and employment privileges to them is dumb.

Again, just because somebody isn't "mostly" aboriginal doesn't mean they can't claim aboriginal heritage, or claim to be aboriginal. If somebody has one Irish grandparent they can still claim Irish heritage, or may even choose to identify as Irish, even though it's only 1/4 of their background.

What does cause a problem is when you extend benefits solely on the basis of aboriginality. As I think I've argued before in some thread I think the system needs a re-think. Welfare should be extended to those who are from a low socioeconomic background or who otherwise need assistance, regardless of race, if it so happens that most of that money happens to then go to people who are aboriginal, then so be it, but aboriginality shouldn't be the requirement, current living standards should be.

[Lolsmith]

Although I agree with the reason she burnt her proof of aboriginality, I think it's still a pretty disrespectful act on her part.

Wherever you're from; Asia, South America, or Alice Springs, you should always respect your heritage, regardless of the positives that are from this heritage. My family are the typical white Australians, who emigrated in the mid-1800s from Inverness in Scotland, and despite me having only a minimal level of Scottish heritage, I would still respect that till the day i died.
Now while she may only think of her heritage as a burden that will always hang over her head, the fact of the matter is that this heritage is what makes you.

This means absolutely nothing. Heritage has nothing to do with "what makes you" outside of genetics.

[Debauchee]

Again, just because somebody isn't "mostly" aboriginal doesn't mean they can't claim aboriginal heritage, or claim to be aboriginal. If somebody has one Irish grandparent they can still claim Irish heritage, or may even choose to identify as Irish, even though it's only 1/4 of their background.

yes but this is literally irrelevant in regards to receiving welfare

[townie]

yes but this is literally irrelevant in regards to receiving welfare

Isn't that the point I made in the next sentence? I'm confused as to what your argument with my statement is?

[Lentern]

This.

I've held the belief for long that Aboriginal Australians are often singled out, portrayed as 'dumb' and needing the white man's help. I hate it with a fiery passion when high schools and universities go on about their 'generous' bureseries and scholarships in their booklets. It takes more planning and more indepth research and analysis to stop the low socio-economic lifestyles. The areas in which they live in are usually in desperate need of health care nurses and doctors, social workers and more applied health workers as well as education resources. Simply taking a person out for "employment" doesn't solve any problems at all. Being Aboriginal is so often portrayed as some kind of disability, it's sickening.

The stereotype of an Aboriginal male teenager who suffers from over or under nutrition, who doesn't go to school, has an awful addiction- is portrayed as trash in the Australian eyes. But if he is whiter or is white, the pity he would get.

Are you honestly saying that you don't think there has been, and there is continuing, substantial research and strategic policy development in "closing the gap" policies?

[Memento-mori]

Are you honestly saying that you don't think there has been, and there is continuing, substantial research and strategic policy development in "closing the gap" policies?

I'm not attacking the government's response to it, I'm attacking the average Australian's response to it. And even with the government, this problem has existed for over 40 years and its still not solved. My point I was trying to make was this: Taking someone out of their Aboriginal community, with either ''employment'' or some scholarship isn't doing much at all. It's a 'band aid' solution.

Australians tend to have a habit of talking up things, advertising, promoting, ''increasing awareness'' even though nothing effective is being done...

[soloooooo]

Taking someone out of their Aboriginal community, with either ''employment'' or some scholarship isn't doing much at all. It's a 'band aid' solution.

It is not a band aid solution, it IS the solution.

Letting them remain in their remote communities and throwing billions of dollars at them in these remote places is the band aid solution that doesn't work.

[Lentern]

I'm not attacking the government's response to it, I'm attacking the average Australian's response to it. And even with the government, this problem has existed for over 40 years and its still not solved. My point I was trying to make was this: Taking someone out of their Aboriginal community, with either ''employment'' or some scholarship isn't doing much at all. It's a 'band aid' solution.

Australians tend to have a habit of talking up things, advertising, promoting, ''increasing awareness'' even though nothing effective is being done...

You don't think these scholarship programs were in part formulated on the basis of government and academic research?