Doing Revenge Tragedy.. POST HERE.. Chuck Some Ideas Around... (1 Viewer)

rific

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zenger69 said:
so your saying Hamlet and The Revenger's Tragedy were written during the same time period?

Except i don't think thats right
Revenger's Tragedy was written in 1606 (I'm pretty sure) and Hamlet was written in/around1601. So reasonably close in time, most of the revenge tragedy plays people study were written between 1590's (1587 was when Kyd's 'The Spanish Tragedy was written, and is generally regarded as the first of the period as far as I know, well, at the very least it had a lot of firsts in it) and the 1620's. There are, of course, exceptions, but that was the really popular time for revenge tragedy and so most of the popular plays come from that 30ish years.

Incidentally, The Spanish Tragedy is a great read for a related text, lot's of intrigue, symbolism and contextual significance. For anyone who's read or seen it, how good is the humour in Pendringano's death scene? Priceless...

Oh, last thing, if anyone still has problems understanding Revenger's Tragedy, try to get to a performance, though I don't know of any currently on unfortunately, but it will help you see the whole picture and will highlight some of the humorous parts.
 

2rko

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revengers tragedy was written in 1607 .. hamlet in 1602 .. both dates are debatable
 

zenger69

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but doesn't Hamlet belong to Elizabethan Tragedy whilst The Revenger's Tragedy belongs to Jacobean tragedy.


oh well....... i'll get have some bok choy..... and think about it.
 

Suga_baibe

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Hamlet

On the subject of Hamlet as a related text. Although it is undoublty wonderful and blah blah, BUT it wouldn't be a related text I'd choose to do. Since its soo popular, so many people are using it, which means that its become somewhat of a cliche. One of the criteria for EXT I is originality, I just can't see how original someone could get with Hamlet. So I've chosen to explore a greater range of text, which I find, have greater depth. Plus, I refer contempory texts alot more, since its so much easier to relate to, and cuts out all the extra context research.

RT as a whole tho, has proven to be alot more interesting that I thought. After doing a few assesments, and actually understanding the genre, its quite lovable. Very deep and philosophical.
 

rific

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zenger69 said:
but doesn't Hamlet belong to Elizabethan Tragedy whilst The Revenger's Tragedy belongs to Jacobean tragedy.


oh well....... i'll get have some bok choy..... and think about it.
They are generally classifed simply as revenge tragedy, while Revenger's Tragedy I think is technically part of the Jacobean period (can't remember the exact dates, but it sounds right), and while it definitely attacks Jacobean ideals and looks back to the glory days of Elizabeth, it's not normally called a Jacobean tragedy, same with Hamlet and the Elizabethan period.

It's great to hear that some one else likes RT, Suga_baibe, I can see why you'd call it deep and philosophical, but I prefer it for its humour - it really is a very funny play, stacked with irony, innuendo, parody and, ofcourse, farce. I'm smiling just thinking about it...
 

Suga_baibe

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Rific, I think you got me wrong. By RT I mean revenge tragedy as the genre. And as for the play TRT (the revengers tragedy), I personally find it quite, retarded. I am definitly not a fame of melodrama, or idiots. Or prehaps I'm missing the point?

RT on the other hand, raises alot of points on human nature, desire, and weakness. I enjoy the catharsis the genre brings.

If only it was more practical in reality. I'd sure like to take out a gun, or a sword, and kill some bitches that have brought harm to my honour. =D
 

rific

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lol, yup, misunderstood entirely.

The genre as a whole is interesting, but I am still a huge fan of the play, if you're all sick of the melodrama, try considering the characters as real people, what would you do if you really had been severely wronged and the only way to get justice is to kill the wrong-er? Would you be able to just go, yep, righto, sharpen the ol' sword, perform a dance routine and stab him and his buddies at the end? Or would you have to build yourself up to it by justifying your actions and planning each stage? - Nobody answer that, either answer would be a little disturbing :p

Yeah, I know I won't convert anyone, I just love the play, I mean really, any play with character names like Lussurioso and Supervacuo is bound to be a winner...
 

Yeesian

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general chat

hey, im just new to this whole site and have read a few of the postings, the movie (revenger;s tragedy) is really good for a plot overview, yeh so if ur lost it realy helps consolidate things in ur head. Secondly, apparently different forms of texts analysed well will rate better than ur usual film or song kinda thing, i know its already been mentioned but just try and get ur hands on another play or comic or quote or something that u can really get into (as much as possible).
 

mz_purfect

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Since u guys are on the topic of RT's melodrama, I must admit that whenver i think of that play, even a year later, it just cracks me up. Alll those melodramatically absurd scenes were just downright funny. I think I even said a couple of jokes about it in my essay. Lol particulalry the part where the duke KISSES a skeleton! like far out man! AS IF! rofl...and how paradoxical is that? Like in actuality, Vindice actually fulfils the wishes of the Duke to kiss his betrothed!
Do the 05ers find that absolutely ludicrous?

On a serious note tho, TRT is a parody of the RT genre. Its supposed to mock the 'serious' conventions of the genre...
 

roseangel

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zenger69 said:
My only problem is that I have no understanding of The Revenger's Tradegy and does anyone know whether or not I could get an audio version of it.
I wouldn't worry. I had no understanding of it either. I didn't even read it. I didn't even read anything about it. All I knew was the main character's name, which I have subsequently forgotten. Then I used it in my exam and got 90. Go figure.

As for suggestions, examiner's notes from most years suggest NOT using Hamlet, Road to Perdition, Braveheart or Gladiator (I'm fairly sure they were the texts. You can look them up yourself if you really want, I guess). Anyway, they're far too common and unless you're Super Ultra Mega English Student 3000, someone's going to do them better than you. I'd recommend finding obscure texts that the markers will be new to. At least then you'll be a nice change for them and they might be nice to you. There's a list in one of these forum threads of possible texts.

Other than that, know genre really well. After all, that's what the question is on. You need to write about Revenge Tragedy as a subset of genre.
 

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hamlet/revenger's tragedy

Just in case anyone's confused - sure Hamlet and The Revenger's Tragedy were written only about 5 years apart, but they reflect very different social contexts. You can't just lump them both into the 'zenith' of revenge tragedy and expect that they'll have similar contextual influences.

(Your teachers should be giving you info on the context of each text you do - but for Hamlet and other found texts, a quick search on google (or wherever) will give you plenty of background.)

Basically, Hamlet was written in the Elizabethan period, a time of reasonable social stability and entrenched social hierarchies in England. The Revenger's Tragedy was written in the Jacobean period, when there was a widespread public perception that the monarchy and court was corrupt, social mobility was increasing, new scientific discoveries were being made, etc. Essentially this was a time of flux and people were looking back with nostalgia to the 'glory days' (I think someone mentioned this) of the Elizabethan period.

This is important when you consider the contextual influences on the text - Middleton/Tourneur is writing a critique of the ruling class and social conditions of the time. The Duke is a loose metaphor for James I, someone in a position of power who is completely corrupt. Vindice makes a few comments like "wash their hands and come up gentlemen" and "nine coaches waiting - hurry, hurry, hurry" (sorry - too tired to find the exact wordings). This shows the author's dissatisfaction at the present social state, cleverly disguised and removed to Italy so he doesn't appear guilty of treason and get his head chopped off. (Think about shows like 'The Glass House' today - it's used as a vehicle to criticise the government but it's unlikely Wil Anderson would ever be sued for defamation.) By contrast in most of Shakespeare's work, including Hamlet, and Macbeth, and etc, the worst crime/sin someone can commit is to kill the king - Claudius' murder of King Hamlet is the trigger for (Prince) Hamlet's whole journey.

The film version of The Revenger's Tragedy is called Revengers Tragedy (no apostrophe) and was directed by Alex Cox. It's good to see if you don't understand the play, but make sure you know who all the brothers are before you watch it, because it doesn't really explain them very well. Alex Cox has done interviews where he talks about exactly the same things I've been saying here (and which were really useful in shaping my perception - intertextuality not plagiarism!!) and comments on how different the Jacobean period was to the Elizabethan period, and the similarities between the Jacobean period and today, accounting for the play's enduring popularity and film's relevance to a modern audience. Again try google.

Sorry if I sound really ranting and didactic! I just hope this clears things up for anyone who might have been thinking that because the two plays were written 5 years apart they have the same social context. They don't.
 

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