MedVision ad

BOSTES 4U conspiracy?? (2 Viewers)

Joined
Feb 16, 2014
Messages
2,258
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
2007 paper was nice!

Question 8 - the n sided polygon thingy, looks like a scary question but pretty straightforward
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
Messages
2,258
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
Why was it flawed/dodgy?
Sounds familiar...
I think mreditor was referring to the solutions to this question

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=$&space;Show&space;that&space;if&space;\sqrt{n&plus;\frac{1}{4}}>&space;k&space;-&space;\frac{1}{2}$&space;\&space;$then&space;the&space;integers&space;n&space;and&space;k&space;satisfy&space;\sqrt{n}>&space;k&space;-\frac{1}{2}" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?$&space;Show&space;that&space;if&space;\sqrt{n&plus;\frac{1}{4}}>&space;k&space;-&space;\frac{1}{2}$&space;\&space;$then&space;the&space;integers&space;n&space;and&space;k&space;satisfy&space;\sqrt{n}>&space;k&space;-\frac{1}{2}" title="$ Show that if \sqrt{n+\frac{1}{4}}> k - \frac{1}{2}$ \ $then the integers n and k satisfy \sqrt{n}> k -\frac{1}{2}" /></a>

When you square both sides you get

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=n>k(k-1)" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?n>k(k-1)" title="n>k(k-1)" /></a>

Solutions add 1 to the RHS without explaining why (the dodgy part I assume). I was told by friends and a teacher that difference in the two integers in an equality must be greater than 1 or something, hence adding one to the RHS doesn't change the inequality. LHS still > RHS. So that means 1/4 can be added and won't change the inequality.

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=n>&space;k(k-1)&plus;1&space;\\&space;\therefore&space;n>&space;k(k-1)&plus;\frac{1}{4}\\&space;n>&space;(k-\frac{1}{2})^{2}&space;\\\\&space;\therefore&space;\sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?n>&space;k(k-1)&plus;1&space;\\&space;\therefore&space;n>&space;k(k-1)&plus;\frac{1}{4}\\&space;n>&space;(k-\frac{1}{2})^{2}&space;\\\\&space;\therefore&space;\sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" title="n> k(k-1)+1 \\ \therefore n> k(k-1)+\frac{1}{4}\\ n> (k-\frac{1}{2})^{2} \\\\ \therefore \sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" /></a>
 

RealiseNothing

what is that?It is Cowpea
Joined
Jul 10, 2011
Messages
4,591
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2013
I think mreditor was referring to the solutions to this question

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=$&space;Show&space;that&space;if&space;\sqrt{n+\frac{1}{4}}>&space;k&space;-&space;\frac{1}{2}$&space;\&space;$then&space;the&space;integers&space;n&space;and&space;k&space;satisfy&space;\sqrt{n}>&space;k&space;-\frac{1}{2}" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?$&space;Show&space;that&space;if&space;\sqrt{n+\frac{1}{4}}>&space;k&space;-&space;\frac{1}{2}$&space;\&space;$then&space;the&space;integers&space;n&space;and&space;k&space;satisfy&space;\sqrt{n}>&space;k&space;-\frac{1}{2}" title="$ Show that if \sqrt{n+\frac{1}{4}}> k - \frac{1}{2}$ \ $then the integers n and k satisfy \sqrt{n}> k -\frac{1}{2}" /></a>

When you square both sides you get

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=n>k(k-1)" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?n>k(k-1)" title="n>k(k-1)" /></a>

Solutions add 1 to the RHS without explaining why (the dodgy part I assume). I was told by friends and a teacher that difference in the two integers in an equality must be greater than 1 or something, hence adding one to the RHS doesn't change the inequality. LHS still > RHS. So that means 1/4 can be added and won't change the inequality.

<a href="http://www.codecogs.com/eqnedit.php?latex=n>&space;k(k-1)+1&space;\\&space;\therefore&space;n>&space;k(k-1)+\frac{1}{4}\\&space;n>&space;(k-\frac{1}{2})^{2}&space;\\\\&space;\therefore&space;\sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" target="_blank"><img src="http://latex.codecogs.com/gif.latex?n>&space;k(k-1)+1&space;\\&space;\therefore&space;n>&space;k(k-1)+\frac{1}{4}\\&space;n>&space;(k-\frac{1}{2})^{2}&space;\\\\&space;\therefore&space;\sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" title="n> k(k-1)+1 \\ \therefore n> k(k-1)+\frac{1}{4}\\ n> (k-\frac{1}{2})^{2} \\\\ \therefore \sqrt{n}>(k-\frac{1}{2})" /></a>
Well isn't that obvious?



then obviously



I don't really see how the question is dodgy, it's completely valid (all four parts).
 
Joined
Feb 16, 2014
Messages
2,258
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
Well isn't that obvious?



then obviously



I don't really see how the question is dodgy, it's completely valid (all four parts).
Yeah i know, however you don't know what n and k is in this case.
n can be 5 and k can be 4.99 (just for example) and then it wouldn't work, however with inequalities the difference between the two integers is greater than 1.

--------------------------
This is what I think editor found dodgy because solutions didn't explain why the 1 could be added -

imo, q16 was straightforward, but I can see that part of the question confusing a lot of people
 
Last edited:

RealiseNothing

what is that?It is Cowpea
Joined
Jul 10, 2011
Messages
4,591
Location
Sydney
Gender
Male
HSC
2013
Yeah i know, however you don't know what n and k is in this case.
n can be 5 and k can be 4.99 (just for example) and then it wouldn't work, however with inequalities the difference between the two integers is greater than 1.

--------------------------
This is what I think editor found dodgy because solutions didn't explain why the 1 could be added -

imo, q16 was straightforward, but I can see that part of the question confusing a lot of people
It tells you that n and k are integers though so you don't really have to worry about cases like the example you gave.
 

Luckytree

New Member
Joined
Jul 2, 2014
Messages
20
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
I think the reasoning was that 1 could be added on the right side so that it can be the equality sign/and inequality sign, because n and k differ at least 1, where n is greater or equal to k and also n,k are integers
and then the equality sign disappears because you took out 3/4

But i think you needed to have the equality/and inequality sign when you added by 1
 

harrypotterfan

Active Member
Joined
Nov 5, 2012
Messages
77
Gender
Female
HSC
2014
Yeah i know, however you don't know what n and k is in this case.
n can be 5 and k can be 4.99 (just for example) and then it wouldn't work, however with inequalities the difference between the two integers is greater than 1.

--------------------------
This is what I think editor found dodgy because solutions didn't explain why the 1 could be added -

imo, q16 was straightforward, but I can see that part of the question confusing a lot of people
Are you serious? It was such an easy question... I literally did the whole thing in like 2 minutes LOL
 

mreditor16

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 4, 2014
Messages
3,169
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
RN and FA16, that wasn't the dodgy part. dw about it guys. :)
 

dan964

what
Joined
Jun 3, 2014
Messages
3,479
Location
South of here
Gender
Male
HSC
2014
Uni Grad
2019
Just did about half of 2005, man that paper took long. Then again I only spent 2 hr 15 on it, and got up to Q6.
Why is there always a question proving cos 36 and cos 72, they have popped up at least 3 times. At least twice in the past 8 years. I like those question.


#I love a good induction question. The one in 2005 was good, but I did it shiftly by using a reduction formula as a shortcut, and saying I have proven this statement to be true using this means.

#I love a good resisted motion question, especially in 3U. Those a=kv or a=kv^2 questions are so methodical.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 2)

Top