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Is war ever justified? (1 Viewer)

Is war ever justified?


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SnowFox

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How would one stop a individual who is hell bent on killing everyone not part of a certain group?
 

Big Boss

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Without violence, the English would not been able to have seized Terra Nullius and established the territory we call today Australia.

To all you nay sayers, WWII. Imagine if the allies had chosen 'not' to go and defend Europe because it was against their morals. War is a sad yet inevitable part of our world.
This man is speaking the truth that many cannot handle.
War will be inevitable and everyone must be ready to defend themselves and fight at a moment's notice.
One must fight to live and live to fight, you are free when you die.
 

Serius

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How would one stop a individual who is hell bent on killing everyone not part of a certain group?
...assasination, convince them that its not worth it by crippling their country with trade sanctions, sabotage, turn members of his cabinet, spy on him, general subterfuge to discredit him and remove him from power.

WW2 wouldnt have happened if the allies had cleaned up properly after WW1.
 

katie tully

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Lately we haven't had a justifiable reason to go to war. Our perception of war is different from that of our grandfathers, and media (news, videos, pictures) have changed all of this for us.

Was our involvement in WW2 justified? Yes. Was the declaration of war against the Germans etc justified? Yes. I can't really think of any wars since that can be completely justified, Vietnam being an example.

That said, I think regardless of what you think of war, we should still have the utmost respect for our troops who are currently serving. It would sicken me to see a repeat of the reception troops received after Nam.
 

Iron

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Poor reception of troops was sort of following terribly excellent reports showing brutal tactics employed against Vietnamese civilians due to the immense difficulty in discerning actual enemies. This was when people could see the horrors unfolding on television in their living room for the first time. It must have been pretty shocking and difficult for society to accept that we seemed to be the bad guys -esp after we'd had good reason to believe that in WW2 we saved the world etc- and a negative reaction against the troops seemed like a fair response - 'not in my name' etc

To put it in the modern context, I doubt that we'd be throwing too many parades for prision wardens returning from Iraq etc (tho prez obama wussed out on a full investigation of torture)
 

AlleyCat

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i have very little respect for troops.
fair enough if a country has conscription, but to voluntarily train yourself up to go kill people is something i cannot get behind.

at the same time, i think the treatment of soldiers returning from vietnam was horrible on a human level, i dont think anyone deserves that.

i dont think anyone deserves to die either however.

...and yes. i know i have rose coloured glasses on. i'm not naive at all, i realise the state of the world. but i cannot resign myself to the "necessity" of warfare, no matter what.
 

Iron

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What?

Theyre almost always defending life, damnit. When theyre not doing that, like they were in Vietnam and probably Iraq, sure they lose public respect. They dont have some fascist blank check of public support. There are checks!

But son, we live in a world that has walls. And those walls have to be guarded by men with guns. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Lt. Weinberg? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Santiago and you curse the Marines. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know: that Santiago's death, while tragic, probably saved lives. And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, saves lives...You don't want the truth. Because deep down, in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that wall. You need me on that wall.
We use words like honor, code, loyalty...we use these words as the backbone to a life spent defending something. You use 'em as a punchline. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very freedom I provide, then questions the manner in which I provide it! I'd rather you just said thank you and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you pick up a weapon and stand a post. Either way, I don't give a damn what you think you're entitled to!
 

Garygaz

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He can't, it's against his religion.

And to answer the original question, yes but we go to war without justification so often these days, and the very nature of war is evolving so quickly, that it's difficult to really figure out what could a justify war in modern times.
North Korea could justify a war, it's proven that sanctions and diplomacy don't always work. When Kim Jong dies and a new, unknown and potentially crazy as bat shit dictator comes in, pre-emptive strikes, in my eyes, would be justified.
 

Smile_Time351

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whatever dude. i dont support the troops.
Shit 'dude', you just got presented with one of the greatest speeches in film history, one that has rational people reeling in awe, with a new found respect for our (to use a cliche) gallant troops, assuming they didn't already, and your response is: 'whatever dude'? COME ON! if you're going to be a fucking pacifist then at least support your argument with some thing solid!

No one's asking you to pick up a weapon (except maybe Jessob and/or Iron) and fight, just show some fucking respect for those who do. Just a thought.
 

Big Boss

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Soldiers should be treated with utmost respect.
A person must find their own reason to fight and soldiers have taken up that opportunity to do so.
They fight as brave men who could fall the very next day to protect the weak cowards within that nation that form its civilians and government so they can live another day in gluttony.
 

AlleyCat

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Shit 'dude', you just got presented with one of the greatest speeches in film history, one that has rational people reeling in awe, with a new found respect for our (to use a cliche) gallant troops, assuming they didn't already, and your response is: 'whatever dude'? COME ON! if you're going to be a fucking pacifist then at least support your argument with some thing solid!

No one's asking you to pick up a weapon (except maybe Jessob and/or Iron) and fight, just show some fucking respect for those who do. Just a thought.
oh i'm sorry.
was i supposed to take my panties off at the end of that delicious bowl of copypasta?

EDIT: why should i respect people who are diametrically opposed to my belief system.
i dont think war is justified because i dont like killing and i believe in diplomacy.

i could try and google a movie that will have you "reeling in awe" but i'd rather express what i believe in short, easy to understand sentences.

I dont support the troops.
killing is wrong in any form.
don't agree with me, fine. obvsly most of the world is on your side.
 
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Empyrean444

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. i'm not naive at all, i realise the state of the world. but i cannot resign myself to the "necessity" of warfare, no matter what.
But there is little point in having a non-naive understanding if you then follow a naive set of values.
 

Iron

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War is a continuation of politics by other means
Clausewitz

Diplomacy has its merits, but also its limits. You cant talk your way out of everything
 

AlleyCat

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But there is little point in having a non-naive understanding if you then follow a naive set of values.
i dont think my values are naive. idealistic, but not naive.

iron i get what you are saying about diplomacy having its limits, i just dont think we've ever reached those limits.

going to war, even to save innocents, causes so much more pain and suffering than it alleviates. i just think there are better ways.
 

Iron

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That's true. I think Jefferson said something like that... war doesnt correct wrong-doings but multiplies them, or something.
 

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