Can you be Christian, and support the existance of the state? (6 Viewers)

[Planck]

Mate I think its pretty obvious from your recent posts here that you are hostile towards Christianity.

So if Christian teachings that have worked well for centuries are to be rejected, what alternative moral code can you put forward to guide us? Especially since you reject the state, how then shall we ensure that people behave in a decent and civilized manner?

I know a fair few Atheists who are pro-life in the Catholic sense (With the exception of the issues with Homosexuality).

 

[Planck]

So how do you decide which morals to believe in.

Without the guidance of the bible an atheist could easily claim that their "personal" moral code states that they should rape children.

Yet the incidences of Christians performing this evil deed seem to outstrip even the most strident relativist atheists...

 

[Iron]

Yeah just stick to natural law and you cant avoid Rome, pagans

 

[Planck]

I would rather be brutally executed by your supposedly benevolent god than forfeit my intellectual and moral integrity in submission to your dogmatic, authoritarian fantasy.

Get fucked.

I really like this post. Like a whole bunch. Everyone rep it.

 

[jmakowiak]

I can do everythign through Him

who gives me strength

Philippians 4:13

know any crippled christians who i can ask to walk?​

 

[froth4maths]

know any crippled christians who i can ask to walk?​

You were born about 2000 years late but you can still read about an instance of this happening.

John 5:1-9:

Some time later, Jesus went up to Jerusalem for a feast of the Jews. 2Now there is in Jerusalem near the Sheep Gate a pool, which in Aramaic is called Bethesda and which is surrounded by five covered colonnades. 3Here a great number of disabled people used to lie—the blind, the lame, the paralyzed. 5One who was there had been an invalid for thirty-eight years. 6When Jesus saw him lying there and learned that he had been in this condition for a long time, he asked him, "Do you want to get well?"

7"Sir," the invalid replied, "I have no one to help me into the pool when the water is stirred. While I am trying to get in, someone else goes down ahead of me." 8Then Jesus said to him, "Get up! Pick up your mat and walk." 9At once the man was cured; he picked up his mat and walked.

 

[Cookie182]

LOL

Well supposedly True Christians should give you the contents of their wallet-
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"Give to everyone that asketh thee; and from him that taketh away thy goods ask not again." Luke 6:30

"Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away." Matt. 5:42

This sums it up:

"But love your enemies, and do them good, and lend never despairing; and your reward shall be great, and ye shall be Sons of the Most High: for he is kind toward the unthankful and evil."
(Luke 6:35)
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A True Christian loves moral absolutes and would never question the eternal word of the Bible. If you meet one, ask them to show you their wallet. If their is money inside ask them can you have it. Don't take their cards (theft). This should be the utlimate test of their Christianity!

If they refuse, are they questioning the word of the great book?

*Although the moral atheist such as myself would never think of actually doing such a disgusting thing, yet for those with less of a conscious, it is a good test of a "true" Christian.

Asking them to survive drinking poison is always interesting too...the Bible is very clear on that one:

"And these signs shall accompany them that believe: in my name they shall cast out demons, they shall speak with new tongues. They shall take up serpents and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall in no wise hurt them; they shall lay their hands on the sick, and they shall recover." Mark 16:17-18

You could also ask them to heal someone who has cancer...whether they have ever "cast out demons" (lol)...fought with great snakes (such a Harry Potter reference you Bible authors!)...can they speak in "tongues"??

I'm simply quoting the good book here...

 

[Cookie182]

Having a bit of trouble interpreting Luke 14:26

"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be my disciple."

Seems a little self-centered on Jesus's part...

My question is:

Your a devout Christian and have been captured by Islamic terrorists. Your friend is about to be beheaded in front of you unless you publicly deny Christ. Is Jesus saying choose him?

 

[Iron]

Your question is hardly as challenging as the quote from Luke (or even related). Death is conquered.

 

[luv2luvurmama]

One time i got a detention, and i started crying. I asked god for help. Jesus told me to grow dick, so i did. I grew one on my head. Thats why everyone calls me a dickhead now.

 

[*TRUE*]

Having a bit of trouble interpreting Luke 14:26

"If anyone comes to me and does not hate his father and mother, his wife and children, his brothers and sisters—yes, even his own life—he cannot be my disciple."

Seems a little self-centered on Jesus's part...

My question is:

Your a devout Christian and have been captured by Islamic terrorists. Your friend is about to be beheaded in front of you unless you publicly deny Christ. Is Jesus saying choose him?

I would hope that I would have the courage to refuse to deny Christ. (remember Matthew 10 :33)
Importantly, God has an eternal and all encompassing perspective. What we see of his plans, and what we understand of our own lives is so limited, this is why we need to trust Him.
In the case of martyrdom the bible reminds us " Do not be afraid of those that kill the body but cannot kill the soul. Rather, be afraid of the one who can destroy both soul and body in hell.Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground, apart from the will of your Father. Even the very hairs on your head are all numbered. So don't be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows." (Matthew 10 :28 -31)

 

[murphyad]

Importantly, God has an eternal and all encompassing perspective. What we see of his plans, and what we understand of our own lives is so limited, this is why we need to trust Him.

No way hosay am I trusting some sadistic creep who treats human lives like pawns on a chessboard.

Hitler too had an all-encompassing plan and encouraging the populace to blindly follow his credos did not do anyone any good.

btw I do not mean to suggest that God = Hitler but simply that slightly more critical thought may be in order.

In the case of martyrdom......

Martyrdom is the most dangerous idea ever perpetrated against mankind.

Also I don't mean to be rude, but can we please move beyond Bible Recital Class?

 

[*TRUE*]

No way hosay am I trusting some sadistic creep who treats human lives like pawns on a chessboard.

Hitler too had an all-encompassing plan and encouraging the populace to blindly follow his credos did not do anyone any good.

btw I do not mean to suggest that God = Hitler but simply that slightly more critical thought may be in order.



Martyrdom is the most dangerous idea ever perpetrated against mankind.

Also I don't mean to be rude, but can we please move beyond Bible Recital Class?

It's entirely up to you whom you trust.
Question : why are 'human lives' so special? Why are they so important? What makes you so deserving as an individual that your own (temporary) comfort and pleasure come first in a 'grand scheme'?
Also, I'd say that your belief that God is a 'sadistic creep' is due to your own limited perspective and understanding.

 

[Iron]

Murphyad, we are created for bliss, but life isnt meant to be easy. Christ proved this on the cross. The point of bad things happening and suffering existing is not the fact of the occurence and the anger at a supposedly unjust God, but rather our response to it. How do we react in deeds to such things?
Throwing your arms up and saying God's a bastard and there is no meaning is fundamentally a failure to enact your love for others, which is beyond a simple, personal 'good feeling' and involving a serious determination to take responsibility for the world by taking up the Cross

 

[ad infinitum]

Who saw Hitchens verbally violate the fuckwits on Q&A. I think its approaching the point where belief in god will be simply to embarrassing to profess in public.

 

[Iron]

He had a few funny lines and humiliated a teenage girl, but it was a stalemate at best. He even seemed to express that he's not even militaristic about it 'in private'. He didnt cut thru the stable, reasonable figures of the srs Catholic and Muslim at all though

 

[ad infinitum]

He had a few funny lines and humiliated a teenage girl, but it was a stalemate at best. He even seemed to express that he's not even militaristic about it 'in private'. He didnt cut thru the stable, reasonable figures of the srs Catholic and Muslim at all though

I asked if anyone had watched Q&A,
You do not count as a person; your a catholic spam bot playing up..

 

[jmakowiak]

You were born about 2000 years late but you can still read about an instance of this happening.

No way, really? the bible describing a miracle? No, that's not what I was getting at at all. All I was saying is that the statement "I can do anything through christ who gives me strength" is false, because, uh... no, you can't. Nothing short of miraculous, anyway, and we all know how believable miracles are

 

[Cookie182]

I asked if anyone had watched Q&A,
You do not count as a person; your a catholic spam bot playing up..

That bitch at the end.

Let's ship her off to Iran dressed like that...

Hitchens ftw

 

[xeuyrawp]

The point is, the bible is very clear on the subject.

Having read much of the Bible in its original languages, I would really have to say that it is clear on no subject.

There are of course contradictions between both Testaments; but even books and chapters of books are at odds with each other. To suggest that it is somehow very clear on any subject would probably be more ridiculous than suggesting that it's very factual. But hey, don't believe me; believe the fact that various Christian denominations have been essentially at war with each other over something as simple as Christology. Luckily they have the Bible to turn to, because it's so clear, right?

edit:

I think its approaching the point where belief in god will be simply to embarrassing to profess in public.

Yeah, because people seem to be becoming more intelligent, especially in the densely-populated religious countries, rite?!