2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Rudd? (3 Viewers)

[hazaar]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

He is the sly master of politics.

He can manipulate even the most damning political situation to his advantage.

It also helps to know you've got the country's media on side, i.e. packer and murdoch.

Over the years howard has built an elaborate defamation apparatus and a vast array of successful buzz-phrases, things lapped up by the media. There is most definately a reciprocal relationship between the howard gov. and the media, effectively underscoring the irrefutable functionality of commercial media entities in their handling of adverse political situations.
He'll always get away with it wheter he's guilty or not!

 

[frog12986]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Subsidised LPG conversions, massive tax cuts, migration bills...

oh, and the Prime Minister on Cronulla- "I would never condemn people for being proud of the Australian flag".

The PM is populist when necessary, often to allay concerns over less-popular policies.

Nonetheless, whether for ideological or vaidated reasons, Howard along with Hawke and Keating, has made decisions, which although unpopular are implemented to address deficiencies in certain policy areas.

Of course Howard has initiated populist agenda's in certain instances, however these have, on the whole, been the minor policy areas (excluding tax cuts). Beastly takes the populist approach on every single issue, and presents an alternative that is haphazard and merely reactive.

I'd like to know exactly how Beastly intends to keep the Australian economy productive in a circumstance where demand for labour will far exceed supply. His unionised rhetoric of collective bargaining is an easy option that doesnt address the issues that will arise. Flexibility, individual contracts/bargaining and the like, are all necessary to keep an undersupplied economy productive, particularly in a global market.

Lets see..
Beastly - Ratify Kyoto, abolish AWA's, abolish workchoices.. all pointless and destructive, but easy options to adopt in the political arena..

 

[EA36]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Howard, Beazley, Howard, Beazley. There is always argument about who is better. People say that Howard has been a crap politician with the introduction of such policies as the GST and the new IR reforms. But let me tell you that all of those reforms have come good and economically and fantastic policies. you can't say that John Howard doesn't know how to run an economy, because you just can't fault the man economically. On the other side his socialist poicies create the real problems. So for the economic growth of the economy, he gets a huge tick, for the economic development of all citizens, he gets a mild dash. Beazley doesn't know how to run an economy, he was a good defence minister once, but wouldn't know anything about actually running a healthy economy. All of these policies he says tht he will just get rid of is the stupidous thing I have ever heard. On the other hand, he is socially better than Howard, but with this, he wants to increase wages growth and stuff like that which will cause a lot of Australian jobs to be outsourced overseas because we will be just too expensive. So I think people vote howard because the alternative is crap.

 

[ihavenothing]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

We are suffering outsourcing anyway with call centres going to India and the like. All Howard wants is a legalized form of slavery because he wants us to be more lazy, bringing in immigrant robot workers from China and Asian to fill in the gaps.

 

[trev_2541]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Labor all the way, a staunch unionist I am and so i will vote accrodingly, unlike most people i wont be swept off mi feet by howards latest minimum wage increase utter bullshit 2 convince society that workchoices was a good idea

 

[ihavenothing]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Good, get rid of Joanna Gash she is an asinine cow and screamed at my mother for letting me and my sister run around Ranelagh House (that she co-owned at the time) when we were five and seven years old.

 

[derrida]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

I suppose I lean mostly toward apathy - I do not want another Howard government in any form, but Labor is rather uninspiring. If pressed to vote, which I will be, I'll probably go for a lesser party candidate that leans closer to Labor's politics but isn't Labor.

I definitely want the Senate to be re-arranged - sif have the government control it.

Same as you. Thats why I vote Green and preference Democrat, lower and upperhouse.... the two party option is too uninspiring, and we can't have Labor or Liberal win upperhouse control.

I am also somewhat apathetic to parliamentary politics..... things change on the streets my friend! Infact, its the only way things have "really" changed!

 

[derrida]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

But let me tell you that all of those reforms have come good and economically and fantastic policies. you can't say that John Howard doesn't know how to run an economy, because you just can't fault the man economically.

err.. this is labors problem... they don't take john howard on on his economic policies.

As someone studying Economics and Political Economy, i can tell you that john howards economic policies are atrocious.

Yes! The economy HAS grown! But what does this mean? It means more money coming across our borders from overseas. But it means very little if this money is just cementing the power of an elite, and money is being cut continuosly from higher education and being put into the defence force (generates more money for industry there)

The fact is, although more money has enterd our borders, Inequality is growing.

The richest 10% in australia earn 15 times more than the bottom 10%! It has grown under howard. Is this good economic policy? Hell no!

You cannot have inequality. The idea of some People being born poor while others rich is a fundamental injustice. Every child is born equal.

The group with the best economic policy is the Greens, its economic policy that doesn't look at how this years financial profits are going, but rather, how we will be better off in a decade. The Professor of Political Economy at sydney uni is involved in drafting their economic policy. You can do far worse than vote green if you believe in equality over profits.

 

[BlackDragon]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

i cannot BELIEVE labor is winning in this poll. this is ridiculous.

 

[rickem]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Meh, even if labor is winning this poll, it doesn't mean that thats the general thoughts of australians. Might be an inaccurate sample space, but then again it could be more accurate than you think. After all, johny H has been there, what, 10 years? Maybe we need a change.

 

[rickem]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

And check this out, the liberal party has been very popular over the years for a long time, but labor has only been in office for a short time at several different times.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Minister_of_Australia#Graphical_timeline

 

[tigerian]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

I like John Howard's vision for Australia.

maybe Beazley's is better but as yet I dont know what it is.

 

[BlackDragon]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

it will be a tragedy if labor gets in. you can't beat the attack of howard, costello, downer and abbott. kim beazley and his front bench have a weak policy stance and i seriously worry for our nation's economic well being. howard has been so strong and taken our economy into a real golden age of growth. beazely is just an opportunistic weak man. his policies won't get us anywhere. for instance, i agree that we need to act strongly and rapidly about climate change, but signing kyoto will do almost nothing. we need technological change and a worldwide effort to slow it down.

to summarize, i'm worried about labor. they are not a good political party.

DO NOT VOTE FOR LABOR.

 

[wheredanton]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Lets see..
Beastly - Ratify Kyoto, abolish AWA's, abolish workchoices.. all pointless and destructive, but easy options to adopt in the political arena..

From a legal POV work choices needs to be ripped up. From what I've been told the workchoices legislation is a big bloody awful mess. It was written in parts by different groups of people each of which had different styles.

When employment lawyers have trouble working out the legislation it generally indicates that it's a confused mess. And from my limited experience of it it very much seems to be a confused mess.

As for Big Kim. He is big on rhetoric but in reality he will keep AWA's and probably much of work choices. In keeping with political tradition it will probably be renamed. He will probably ratify Kyoto as a symbolic gesture regardless (its international law anyways, it's all symbolic).

 

[ElendilPeredhil]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Although I dont have Franchise in australia, I support John Howard, he is simply good. His economic policy is good, his foreign policy of supporting US, UK and Israel and his policy on immigration, nuclear and terrorism are few reasons he should stay in office. KIm Beazeley? ughh that pig. He should slim down first before thinking about the Prime Minister post.

Shut-up. The fact the Howard is a friend of Bush doesn't make him a great Aussie PM. What exactly do you think is going to change if Beazley gets into power? Do you really think he's going to stop talking to America- maybe invade? Grow up.

I hate that in a forum about politics cheap shots are fired about appearance.
Who gives a crap if Beazley is fat? Give the man a break, he has actually lost a lot of weight recently if you'll notice.
I don't go on anti-howard tirades consisting of "J.H mispronounced 'Jones' and he should shave his eyebrows if he wants to be PM"


And this, because it needs to be quoted.

On Wednesday, Labor asked Howard about interest rates four times, and each time Howard gave the same answer. He called the peak mortgage rate under Labor in 1989 "the notorious 17 per cent", "the dizzy heights of 17 per cent", and "the bitterly remembered heights of 17 per cent". Say what you like, Howard seemed to be saying with a dogged imperturbability of which Nigel would be proud, but yours went to 17.

So yesterday, Labor's treasury spokesman, Wayne Swan, reminded Howard that interest rates had hit 21 per cent in 1982 under the then Liberal treasurer, John Howard. It was the first time that the Opposition had used this on Howard.

Quote:
Kim Beazley said this week. "We have been waiting for this for a long time - it's finally reached the point where interest rates repayments on mortgages are more burdensome than in 1989."

How can this be so, with the average mortgage today about 7.8 per cent, compared to the notorious 17 per cent? Because today's buyers struggle with such huge mortgages that even though interest rates are much lower today, the proportion of their incomes that goes towards servicing them is larger.

As Labor crowed this week, it took an average 7 per cent of household incomes to meet mortgage interest repayments in the Hawke-Keating years, but since the last election it has hit 7.9 per cent.

 

[frog12986]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

How can this be so, with the average mortgage today about 7.8 per cent, compared to the notorious 17 per cent? Because today's buyers struggle with such huge mortgages that even though interest rates are much lower today, the proportion of their incomes that goes towards servicing them is larger.

As Labor crowed this week, it took an average 7 per cent of household incomes to meet mortgage interest repayments in the Hawke-Keating years, but since the last election it has hit 7.9 per cent.

You can actually thank thank the financial deregulation by the Labor Party for the predicament that now exists. Whilst interest rates are much lower than in the time of the ALP, the increased ability to obtain exorbitant loans has created a situation in the housing market whereby housing prices, and hence the percentage of household incomes to meet mortgage interest repayments, are dictated by institutional willingness to laon exacerbated levels of capital..

The housing market has turned into a situation whereby the winner of an auction, will be the person who can afford to borrow the most amount of money. Not the doing of low interest rates, or the Howard Government, but rather the deregulation of banks and financial institutions that provide individuals with the needed capital..

 

[wheredanton]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Not the doing of low interest rates, or the Howard Government, but rather the deregulation of banks and financial institutions that provide individuals with the needed capital..

Are you somehow suggesting that the Liberal government, if it had been in power during the late 80s and early 90s would not have done what the ALP did?

 

[frog12986]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

Are you somehow suggesting that the Liberal government, if it had been in power during the late 80s and early 90s would not have done what the ALP did?

I don't believe I said that. However, my point is that Labor is attributing a economic situation to the actions of the current government, when it is closely tied to their microeconomic reforms. For some reason, they seem to take credit for the reforms when a positive arises, yet it doesn't fall into the contemplation zone when a negative results..

Financial deregulation was needed, and has subsequently increased the capacity of the economy immensely. However, a natural consequence of such reform is that individuals will be borrowing amounts that are far beyond their means and hence owe a greater proportion of income to mortage repayments. Surely the policy formulators at the time would have foreseen such a situation, particularly when interest rates returned to relatively acceptable levels..

 

[wheredanton]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

I don't believe I said that. However, my point is that Labor is attributing a economic situation to the actions of the current government, when it is closely tied to their microeconomic reforms. For some reason, they seem to take credit for the reforms when a positive arises, yet it doesn't fall into the contemplation zone when a negative results...

It's called political expediency. John Howard and political leaders of every ilk engage in it all the time.

John Howard takes credit for low interest rates but now, as interest rates rise, it isn't his party's fault but a part of a natural interest rate cycle. Same difference.

The ALP is having a go at John Howard now because of his nonsensical promise that 'interests rates under a Liberal government will always be lower than they are under an ALP government' and the inference, it seems, that many took that interest rates wouldn't rise [significantly or would remain sustainably low] under the Liberal government. This hasn't happened.

 

[ihavenothing]

Re: 2007 Federal Election - Coalition or Labor/Howard or Beazley?

It's just another of the lies along with the children overboard used to bring the Howard government back every time.