Aborigines 'don't know rape is illegal' (2 Viewers)

[Serius]

even if you dont understand rape legally of course you know it is wrong. it should be no excuse

did you even read this thread?

i direct you to this post http://community.boredofstudies.org/showpost.php?p=3482964&postcount=30
where i said this

quick question for you, say you pick up a girl at a bar who has had a few drinks, go back to your place and have censensual sex in the missionary position, is that rape? our government has recently passed legislation saying it is, but i dont see any moral drama there and i would definetely not call it rape.

sometimes the issue of what is consensual sex and what is not can be very clouded and incredibly difficult to determine, one wrong move and you are now a rapist. Is it so inconceivable that a bunch of rurals living in the middle of nowhere have difficulty understanding the law on this controversial issue?

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

Honestly, dragging up this "well it doesn't matter whether they knew it was illegal, they should have known it was wrong because rape is bad" argument is really dumb imo. Because you're failing to understand the whole basic point of the article, which is pointing to the fact that these people are living totally outside any cultural framework that we would identify with. WE see rape as morally reprehensible and legislate against it. That kind of thinking is all well and good but you can't just go and apply it to a bunch of people to whom the logic is invisible. Think about it this way - you go to another country and get arrested for, say, eating an orange. You wouldn't understand what the hell is going on, and even if someone tried to explain to you why you're in trouble, you probably wouldn't understand totally. Because it's just an orange to you. And yeah, I know that's a really simplistic analogy but it's better than saying that the Aboriginals should just know that xyz is wrong. They shouldn't necessarily.

 

[Iron]

YOure saying they have no conscience? They are totally blind to fear and pain in others?
Nonsense.
These things are universal. They have the same 'logic' as any other human

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

YOure saying they have no conscience? They are totally blind to fear and pain in others?
Nonsense.
These things are universal. They have the same 'logic' as any other human

No, I'm not saying that. I'm saying that they don't understand our legal system at all. They don't understand our concept of illegality. Read what serius said. They might very well know that they're causing someone pain and fear but without understanding that they can be prosecuted for doing it...there are plenty of things that you can do to another person which cause them displeasure which are not illegal.

 

[boris]

I don't buy that they do not understand illegality or that they can be prosecuted for causing people harm.

Even if they don't comprehend our legal system, they fear and respect their own tribal systems and they understand they're in deep shit if they do something wrong by it.

No woman, regardless of whether her society agrees with rape, should have to endure it.

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

I don't buy that they do not understand illegality or that they can be prosecuted for causing people harm.

Even if they don't comprehend our legal system, they fear and respect their own tribal systems and they understand they're in deep shit if they do something wrong by it.

No woman, regardless of whether her society agrees with rape, should have to endure it.

oh yeah I know. I'm not trying to justify rape here. I'm just talking about the fact that they don't understand our concept of justice, so if their own society doesn't do anything about rape and they don't get our perspective on it then in their eyes they're not doing anything wrong. The article didn't mention what the tribal punishment for rape is or anything and the guy they interviewed didn't mention it occuring.

 

[Iron]

IM saying that our concept of justice, standard of fairness, the golden rule - whatever - is universal. Anyone would know that rape is inherently wrong because they would not like it done to them - regardless of tribal custom.
Legally, I could do all sorts of things to hurt you, but I can still see that would be wrong.
Morality is not just what the law says

 

[boris]

If you can commit rape (and more than once), chances are you're a sociopath so you're not bound by a conscience or by morality like the rest of us.

 

[^CoSMic DoRiS^^]

IM saying that our concept of justice, standard of fairness, the golden rule - whatever - is universal. Anyone would know that rape is inherently wrong because they would not like it done to them - regardless of tribal custom.
Legally, I could do all sorts of things to hurt you, but I can still see that would be wrong.
Morality is not just what the law says

I agree with you, but that's not really what the article or thread is about. Personally I find the idea that they don't know it's illegal pretty hard to swallow but I understand why when you think about the fact that they really do live completely separate from 'white fella' society. Their knowledge that it's wrong isn't really the issue, it's their failure to understand our legal system and how it deals with what we've decided is a heinous crime (which it is, don't get me wrong there). I think we should be talking about what we need to do to educate them about it, because they might live separately from us but it's the same country with the same laws. Am I making sense?

 

[boris]

And side note, it'd be morally and legally wrong of me to sucker punch you in the face...but fuck it'd be funny.

 

[Iron]

I agree with you, but that's not really what the article or thread is about. Personally I find the idea that they don't know it's illegal pretty hard to swallow but I understand why when you think about the fact that they really do live completely separate from 'white fella' society. Their knowledge that it's wrong isn't really the issue, it's their failure to understand our legal system and how it deals with what we've decided is a heinous crime (which it is, don't get me wrong there). I think we should be talking about what we need to do to educate them about it, because they might live separately from us but it's the same country with the same laws. Am I making sense?

Yes. I think the real issue is status of women. They may have the same universal standard of fairness, but apply it more selectively (i.e. to other men). Women are second class citizens most everywhere. Is female inferiority universal? Certainly not in a sophisticated society like ours, but in the tribal setting...

 

[Sammy-Blue]

This thread is the greatest thing I have ever read.

 

[chicky_pie]

Gosh I just wish all Aborigines would shut the fuck up and all rot in Redfern, today at the city there's one was screaming(drunk) Aborigine at everyone and whining how Santa Clause is black and no white man or China man can take over his 'race'.

Doomed race.


/ends rant.