Actuarial Studies - Curtin or UNSW (1 Viewer)

[wolfspirit]

Hi guys, I'm a prospective international undergraduate student that's looking to pursue actuarial studies in Australia. It is my goal to ultimately clear all the exams to qualify as a full fledged actuary, and I'm well aware of the high attrition rate that this course is notorious for.


Right now I've been granted two options.


The first, is a Bachelor of Science (Actuarial Science) through Curtin University, a 3 year programme that costs $75,000 in total.


The second option is UNSW, through their Bachelor of Commerce (Majoring in AS) but the route is slightly longer. I would have to first attend their foundation programme. However, instead of the typical year long course, I would go through their transition programme, which lasts 4 months and clear it to gain direct admission commencing in 2013. This route would take me a total of 3.5 years, and in comparison, an additional $35,000 in course fees compared to Curtin. (Well actually, in 2013 they are introducing the Bachelor of Actuarial Science course itself, but this is not too relevant for now.)


If you were in my shoes which would you choose? Would you rather save the time and money and clear the degree in Curtin as soon as possible? Or do you feel that the extra time and money invested will pay off, due to UNSW's better reputation as a Go8 university? Besides the better reputation can anyone vouch for the difference in quality of the two universities? Would being in UNSW be better route overall in case I 'dropped out' of the Actuarial Science programme? What are your thoughts on starting out in Curtin, then transferring to UNSW after the first semester/year if I do well enough? As someone who hasn't touched Mathematics for about 6 years now, would you recommend the foundation programme to get back in the flow of things first?


Btw, I know MacQ in particular is great for Actuarial studies, but my grades weren't good enough to gain direct entry. So don't bother suggesting the other Universities like ANU, UoMelb into the discussion!

A lot of questions but this is a pretty huge decision. Not to mention that the difference in fees does not take to account accommodation and interest from loans. Please help!
​

 

[khorne]

I had no idea curtin was even accepted by the IAA. You should check that you can get part 1 credits from them.

If you can, go there.

If you can't, go UNSW.

Either way, you will have to do 4 years (honours in actuarial) if you can maximum exemptions for parts 1 and 2.

Have you thought about how you will find a job? There are so many graduates, and no where near enough places in Aus for them all. You can't go on with your P3s until you have 2 years of relevant work experience, so it's something to consider.

EDIT: just read you haven't touched maths for 6 years

what are your previous maths experiences?

I'd be hesitant about this decision.

 

[Mature Lamb]

Haven't touched maths for 6 years? All you will be doing is maths (mostly statistics).

 

[wolfspirit]

I had no idea curtin was even accepted by the IAA. You should check that you can get part 1 credits from them.

Its listed on their website that they are accredited by the IAA. Apparently Monash has also gotten accreditation, at least for part 1. AFAIK, they do not offer Part II accreditation, so I'd have to go elsewhere. I guess this means I'd be able to do my Honours at a more reputable University? I'm still curious about how much the employer cares about the Uni versus the # of exams cleared.

Either way, you will have to do 4 years (honours in actuarial) if you can maximum exemptions for parts 1 and 2.

My intention is to start work after clearing Part I. I've heard its a viable option to balance both work and study.

Have you thought about how you will find a job? There are so many graduates, and no where near enough places in Aus for them all. You can't go on with your P3s until you have 2 years of relevant work experience, so it's something to consider.

TBH, I haven't given it much thought, but I'm willing to fly to where ever I'm needed. Though that might not be possible due to different accreditations in another countries right?

I do need to start paying back my school loans ASAP. It's also "rumoured" that this profession is expected to grow over the next 5 years...

EDIT: just read you haven't touched maths for 6 years

what are your previous maths experiences?

I'd be hesitant about this decision.

I went to Junior college and did C-Maths during the GCE 'A' Levels and scored an A. Not sure what level that translates to in the Australian curriculum / rest of the world though. At least in school, Maths was always the subject that I could do well in with good guidance and sufficient practice. It was the only subject I could walk out of the examination hall feeling really confident about.

Yeah I've been out of school for 6 years. After Junior College I had to serve 2 mandatory years in the Military. I did an Advanced Diploma in Communications, then ran a business for 2 years. I'm now looking to go back to school... I feel like anything else but a professional degree would be a waste of time at this point, thus making this a pretty interesting choice. During the time out of school I found Poker and kind of fell in love with odds, statistics and risk managment.

Its also worth noting that I did Computing in JC, and I have a general interest towards all things technical about computers and wouldn't mind staring at a spreadsheet.

I'm hoping that this professional degree will compliment my other strengths in writing and creativity as well.

Your frank thoughts are much appreciated on this topic!

 

[khorne]

My intention is to start work after clearing Part I. I've heard its a viable option to balance both work and study.

TBH, I haven't given it much thought, but I'm willing to fly to where ever I'm needed. Though that might not be possible due to different accreditations in another countries right?
I do need to start paying back my school loans ASAP. It's also "rumoured" that this profession is expected to grow over the next 5 years...

Your frank thoughts are much appreciated on this topic!

For your intention, while that might be yours, it won't be your employers. Jobs for actuaries are few and far between (most seeking FIAAs), and jobs that offer study leave are even fewer. Competition is really fierce.

The two major centres for actuaries are melbourne and sydney, I doubt there would be much work elsewhere.

The rumour for growth is more so because the IAA is doing fierce advertising and lobbying to employ its fellows in non-standard actuarial roles. What that really means if a role which an actuary can do but was not designed to do. They're trying to maintain a high level of A and F IAA employment (for obvious reasons). How effective this is, how good the returns on work and such are to be debated. Look into it. I don't think there's as much growth in the industry as there is new graduates.

As for paying them back, I can't see you making an easy 100k return anytime soon. Unless you're really top stuff (and that is very hard to be, given the calibre of some students), employment and starting wage will be high. Couple that with the courses/exams you need to pay to sit, and living expenses, and really, I can't see you paying that off easily. Consider if you really want to spend that much money on a degree with little guarantee in Australia. In my eyes, unless you have it in cash and are willing to part with it, it's simply not worth it.

 

[Omnipotence]

I heard UNSW will offer actuarial stand-alone for 3 yrs.

 

[wolfspirit]

The rumour for growth is more so because the IAA is doing fierce advertising and lobbying to employ its fellows in non-standard actuarial roles. What that really means if a role which an actuary can do but was not designed to do. They're trying to maintain a high level of A and F IAA employment (for obvious reasons). How effective this is, how good the returns on work and such are to be debated. Look into it. I don't think there's as much growth in the industry as there is new graduates.

Yeah I've heard of this other side of the rumour as well. It only makes sense that the IAA would try to market their own industry.

As for paying them back, I can't see you making an easy 100k return anytime soon. Unless you're really top stuff (and that is very hard to be, given the calibre of some students), employment and starting wage will be high. Couple that with the courses/exams you need to pay to sit, and living expenses, and really, I can't see you paying that off easily. Consider if you really want to spend that much money on a degree with little guarantee in Australia. In my eyes, unless you have it in cash and are willing to part with it, it's simply not worth it.

Well, I don't exactly plan to pay back the 100k "easily" by any means. I've done the math and plan to pay it off in 10 years. That requires me getting a job immediately post-graduation, in addition to hitting a minimum a starting wage of around 3k+ to make it work (incl. accommodation)... Hopefully from there growing upwards (fairly exponentially) so I don't end up with $0 in savings in my bank by the time I hit my thirties.

Might I know where you're getting your information from though?

I heard UNSW will offer actuarial stand-alone for 3 yrs.

Yes that is true. I've contacted the ASB directly with enquiries, they're supposed to contact me back regarding my provisional offer to the Bachelor of Commerce, since that programme will have its major removed in 2013.

 

[khorne]

Might I know where you're getting your information from though?

I know a few peeps in the industry and concern myself with matters of finance.

I highly doubt your salary expectations will be met but.

 

[wolfspirit]

Well thanks Khorne. I've gotten in touch with the department heads as well and hopefully they can shed some light on these concerns you've brought up

 

[nutting]

Are you local or an International student? There's so any Australian universities offering Actuarial science degrees ! Why limited yourself to Curtin or UNSW...

 

[Newbie]

oi wolfspirit - dont fk around, if you are going to be in 150k debt anyway, choose UNSW.

and are you expecting to make "3k+" a week? the answer is no.

overall this is a bad plan, heres your math, i assume you are 24, 4 years on a degree makes you 28. another 10 years to pay back? means your 38 before you clear your debts? life is over by then