And you thought UWS wasn't good (2 Viewers)

[spillargroove]

We know as UWS students, there's a few bad points about it. But our uni is much better when you consider reading this:

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/05/11/news/france.php

In particular:

There are 32,000 students at the Nanterre campus of the University of Paris, but no student center, no bookstore, no yearbook, no student-run newspaper, no sports stadium, no freshman orientation, no corporate recruiting system.

The 480,000-volume central library is open only 10 hours a day, closed on Sundays and holidays. Only thirty of the library's 100 computers have Internet access.

The campus cafeterias close after lunch. Professors often do not have office hours; many do not have offices. Some classrooms are so overcrowded that at exam time, many students have to find seats elsewhere. By late afternoon every day, the campus is largely empty

 

[LaraB]

We know as UWS students, there's a few bad points about it. But our uni is much better when you consider reading this:

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/05/11/news/france.php

In particular:

lol if you know about the way the french education system runs you'd understand why it's like that...

The entire french education system as a whole is pretty well worse off than here...

 

[Optophobia]

UWS is only considered 'not good' by way of teenager's opinions. In many aspects, it is one of the best in Australia.

People see the low UAI cut offs and think that this must correlate with it being a crap university. Not true; it simple has more CSP positions than other universities.

where there might be 30 positions for law at UNSW (taking only the best 30 people for that course) there might be 3000 positions at UWS, which of course equates to a lower UAI cut off being held by the university: It's not because its a crap university and no one wants to go there. In fact, its the opposite. More people attend UWS than any other university in NSW.

 

[LaraB]

UWS is only considered 'not good' by way of teenager's opinions. In many aspects, it is one of the best in Australia.

People see the low UAI cut offs and think that this must correlate with it being a crap university. Not true; it simple has more CSP positions than other universities.

where there might be 30 positions for law at UNSW (taking only the best 30 people for that course) there might be 3000 positions at UWS, which of course equates to a lower UAI cut off being held by the university: It's not because its a crap university and no one wants to go there. In fact, its the opposite. More people attend UWS than any other university in NSW.

lol we know that.... spillargroove was just pointing out that there are places that are 1000 times worse than the image that people have of uws so even if admin fucks us around and classes are big, it's no where near as shit as people bitch and whinge that it is... at least we have the stuff there, i'd rather it be slow and 'unfriendly' than not there at all...

 

[spillargroove]

Optophobia, as Lara said I was not trying to point out the reasons why UWS is not a good University or the typical stereostypes associated with the institution. Since I go to UWS, I have a much better appreciation for the University and it is not as bad as most people think. Finding the article on the Intl Tribune was just a fun way to notice that even though many people who think UWS isn't good (and haven't been to it) will see it is even better than other Universities overseas.

I didn't want to politically try and point out the differences in French University history. Just looking at the main facts is enough to like UWS.

 

[hiphophooray123]

ive gone to UWS, its not as bad as people make it out to be, but its still pretty shit. USYD is much better

 

[santaslayer]

this is comparing apples tp oranges. u're actually comparing education systems rather than universities.

 

[LaraB]

this is comparing apples tp oranges. u're actually comparing education systems rather than universities.

No it's not..

spillargroove compared the universities facilities, or lack thereof..

I simply said it's not surprising since the french education system isn't exactly highly regarded...

That doesn't mean that you cannot copmare the 2 because regardless of the specific education system, the facilities and the like are similar in french unis as here, or at least, the ones that they're meant to be offering

Again as usual - i love how these threads are the only ones that attract the attention of non-uws students...

 

[Jiga]

UWS is only considered 'not good' by way of teenager's opinions. In many aspects, it is one of the best in Australia.

People see the low UAI cut offs and think that this must correlate with it being a crap university. Not true; it simple has more CSP positions than other universities.

I disagree. I remember one of my tutors even saying that it was classified as being one of the crappiest! Now this occurs because of the low UAI, as a result any dumbarse gets into the uni, which means you dont have the quality of students that a place like USYD does with only people with high UAI's getting in.... so if a employer off face value was to choose, using common sense, hes gonna want the person with less 'risk' so he goes with the USYD person. But in real life this isnt neccesarily the case, other factors determine it but that is one logic. Its as simple as that though. And this has been made worse cos in the year I came to UWS, 2005, they let even more people in because they were struggling financially from 2004 where they didnt let enough people in! So UWS isnt getting any better Im afraid.

 

[LaraB]

I disagree. I remember one of my tutors even saying that it was classified as being one of the crappiest! Now this occurs because of the low UAI, as a result any dumbarse gets into the uni, which means you dont have the quality of students that a place like USYD does with only people with high UAI's getting in.... so if a employer off face value was to choose, using common sense, hes gonna want the person with less 'risk' so he goes with the USYD person. But in real life this isnt neccesarily the case, other factors determine it but that is one logic. Its as simple as that though. And this has been made worse cos in the year I came to UWS, 2005, they let even more people in because they were struggling financially from 2004 where they didnt let enough people in! So UWS isnt getting any better Im afraid.

The point of the initial post was that people should stop exagerating and making out as if attending UWS will ruin your life because there are others that are far far worse... That point is correct because the uni the article was about is far far worse... There is no need to turn into the usual bullshit - ie non-uws students having some strange attraction to ONLY posts that refer to uni quality and turning it into a "my uni's better than yours" childish argument.

How can you say "but in real life this isn't the case" but then say "it's as simple as that though"... that's like saying "it doesn't really happen in real life, but hey, it happens in real life"

Both you and Octophobia are wrong in your comments. It is not as simple as people see low UAI cut offs and think it's shit... nor is the usual bullshit of "employers think uws is dodgy so will hire a usyd student" true.

 

[kami]

No it's not..

spillargroove compared the universities facilities, or lack thereof..

I simply said it's not surprising since the french education system isn't exactly highly regarded...

Regarded by who? And in what?

That doesn't mean that you cannot copmare the 2 because regardless of the specific education system, the facilities and the like are similar in french unis as here, or at least, the ones that they're meant to be offering

Again as usual - i love how these threads are the only ones that attract the attention of non-uws students...

Um, they are different. The french words for uni don't even translate direct into the english meaning because the words are different. Here, uni is as much a social and communal thing with facilities attached[like bookstores, newsagents, post offices, food courts etc.]. In France, it doesn't mean any of that, university just means a place of higher education - most of the things they'd be 'missing out on' would probably come from other areas instead. It truly is like comparing apples & oranges.

 

[LaraB]

Regarded by who? And in what?


Um, they are different. The french words for uni don't even translate direct into the english meaning because the words are different. Here, uni is as much a social and communal thing with facilities attached[like bookstores, newsagents, post offices, food courts etc.]. In France, it doesn't mean any of that, university just means a place of higher education - most of the things they'd be 'missing out on' would probably come from other areas instead. It truly is like comparing apples & oranges.

Regarded by academic professionals... Even the teachers at Alliance Francais bag out the uni's and they're meant to be encouraging you to believe that it's good... A lot of them when i was there were tertiary level teachers who were here on long term exchange/holidays and they were always going on about how the french education system has had a lot of catching up to do in terms of methodology and allocation of funds and equal treatment of different 'social classes'.

Did you even read the article? Since when are shops to buy your textbooks, staff not having offices, classroom without enough seats and tables, orientation to get to know where you need to go to class, toilets and bathrooms in your on-campus "home", careers resources, cafeterias so you don't starve during the day, student centres to pay fees etc not vital parts of uni that aren't asociated with the 'social' aspects? The only things you can argue wouldn't be relevant if it was true that frecnh unis have no concern whatsoever for socialising (which isn't true) are the student newspaper or sports stadium.. wow a 2 whole things
How is that comparing apples and oranges? 2 things out of many more doesn't mean its a different issue....

Ps - the french word for "university" = universitaire or université (depending on context) and means more or less "higher education institution"... um..yeh.. that's so different from the english definition They even divide higher/tertiary education into groups like we do - by this i mean, Tafes compared to "community college" compared to Uni etc. Just about every language doesn't translate direectly into English because, duh, it's a different language that doesn't mean that the word is not the "equivalent" so that's a really lame reason to claim they are different... The French exchange/international students i know all say they love sydney unis coz it's like back home... although they were at some of the less dodgy unis...

 

[Jiga]

The point of the initial post was that people should stop exagerating and making out as if attending UWS will ruin your life because there are others that are far far worse... That point is correct because the uni the article was about is far far worse... There is no need to turn into the usual bullshit - ie non-uws students having some strange attraction to ONLY posts that refer to uni quality and turning it into a "my uni's better than yours" childish argument.

Ummmm I go to UWS

Give me some AUSTRALIAN examples and I will agree, you cant compare UWS to another international uni because their whole education system is shyte. And Im not saying UWS is that crap, your still gonna get a job, but there is no denying there are disadvanatages attached to be at this uni!

How can you say "but in real life this isn't the case" but then say "it's as simple as that though"... that's like saying "it doesn't really happen in real life, but hey, it happens in real life"

I should have said it isnt 'ALWAYS' the case

Both you and Octophobia are wrong in your comments. It is not as simple as people see low UAI cut offs and think it's shit... nor is the usual bullshit of "employers think uws is dodgy so will hire a usyd student" true.

It all adds to the poor repuatation, which is only getting worse. Letting in poorer students means that the standards at the uni decrease, there are suggestions that a high distinction at UWS is like a credit in some cases at USYD.... thats because its easier to get better marks here with the bell curve n all if your an above average student up against complete dumb shits who shouldnt be at uni! So when employees see someone from UWS with a credit average competing for a job up against someone from USYD with a credit average.... who would you choose? Common sense. Doesnt mean your screwed if you go to UWS, but if you really want to be successful, your gonna hav to be doing better than credit average whereas at USYD this wouldnt b the case.

EDIT: And Im not gonna get into an argument over this cos i really dont give a shit about it. If you think there is no disadvantage in going to UWS then you are kidding yourself.

 

[LaraB]

blah blah blah blah

Whatever you reckon... its all just the same old boring, predictable, overly simplistic bs.

I stil find it hilarious that people think that there is a solid, prescriptive bell curve applied to every unit and school and college in the uni.. what a load of crap.

I wasn't 'accusing' you of being a non-uws student. It was a general comment about how these discussions always start getting into the "my uni's better than yours" crap and, coincidentally are the ONLY discussions flooded by non-uws students... and comments like yours just support the bs.

 

[LaraB]

I don't think we ever get anywhere with these threads... I am however of the opinion that we should have universities with good reputations - or none at all.

nice theory but wouldn't work in practice UWS is in its first decade-ish... USyd n UNSW n UTS etc didn't have "good reps" by that stage in their development - would you have proposed that they be shut down after such a short time since they didn't have a 'good rep'?... such a silly proposition...

 

[Jiga]

nice theory but wouldn't work in practice UWS is in its first decade-ish... USyd n UNSW n UTS etc didn't have "good reps" by that stage in their development - would you have proposed that they be shut down after such a short time since they didn't have a 'good rep'?... such a silly proposition...

So you admit UWS has a poor reputation? Good to hear

 

[LaraB]

So you admit UWS has a poor reputation? Good to hear

Hooray for missing the point...

This is exactly my point - people like you just ignore everything else that is said, totally miss the point, carry on like "OMG you said something's is bad about your uni?!" and turn it into a "ur so inferior" argument.

The initial post had nothing to do with any of this so i don't see why everything always turns into a "Why sydney is better than UWS" argument. It's stupid.

 

[santaslayer]

No it's not..

spillargroove compared the universities facilities, or lack thereof..

I simply said it's not surprising since the french education system isn't exactly highly regarded...

That doesn't mean that you cannot copmare the 2 because regardless of the specific education system, the facilities and the like are similar in french unis as here, or at least, the ones that they're meant to be offering

Again as usual - i love how these threads are the only ones that attract the attention of non-uws students...

university experience is probably different in other countries. why must he/she compare one with another when they are non comparable? why didn't he simply compare an african uni or the uni at jakarta? that would make uws seem kingshit. comparison of such a kind is useless, uninformative, and unwise.

also, what u said has no bearing or concern on what i typed. i dont need u to reiterate what u said. my statement was not a reaction to whatever u jibbered about.


these threads attract non-uwsers because:

1) thread creator is trying to justify the worth of uws when it does not have to. it is an ok uni. ppl have their own value of the uni.

2) thread title.

3) usually ppl read thru a lot of other uni threads. they only post because they feel it is worthwhile. not posting does not mean they were not reading.



again as usual- i love it how certain uws ppl get all defensive once a non-uws person posts.

 

[santaslayer]

Hooray for missing the point...

This is exactly my point - people like you just ignore everything else that is said, totally miss the point, carry on like "OMG you said something's is bad about your uni?!" and turn it into a "ur so inferior" argument.

The initial post had nothing to do with any of this so i don't see why everything always turns into a "Why sydney is better than UWS" argument. It's stupid.

ppl like u get overly defensive...




it was a shit example...

compare charles sturt with uws...something australian...not a fucking international uni...

 

[LaraB]

ppl like u get overly defensive...




it was a shit example...

compare charles sturt with uws...something australian...not a fucking international uni...

what is your problem?? Attack the person who posted the example then you moron!

Besides - the presence of furniture, toilets, staff offices and a student centre IS a comparison that can be made internationally... Go compare it with Jakarta? - yeah top idea. Let's stupidly exagerate to prove a point

So what - we can't compare internationally? So you're telling me you don't think Harvard is a better uni than say... Aus Catholic Uni? or UTS? or Macquarie? or just about every institution in Australia or anywhere in the southern hemisphere? because "you can't compare internationally, only within Australia?"... What a load of nonsense

As i said - blah blah blah... As usual - you blame your rants on people being "defensive"- no one would need to say positive things about uws if you got over your need to come in here with the sole purpose of "proving" that you and your uni are better than anyone or anything involved with UWS.