B Applied Finance with B of Economics (1 Viewer)

[williamc]

I am currently a year 12 student thinking of taking this double degree at Macquarie. I have got a few questions.

1) I have heard that App Fin involves hard maths and considering i am only an above average 2unit math student would i struggle?
2) Would the double degree have any advantage for me, when i am hoping to see a job at RBA, stock broking, government, or an economic analyst? What advantages would it possess over just a B of Economics?
3) What is the workload and content like?
4) It is hard to get a job out of uni in one of those areas? How are the job propects in the economic industry.

 

[Luke!]

1) No, you'll be fine with the maths in App.Fin.

2) I think the App.Fin degree would help with stock broking and economic analysis. Although they are both complimentary degrees in a lot of ways, I think all the economic theory you'll learn in the B.Ec will be well served by the more 'grounded' and practical view of markets you'll get from the B.App.Fin.

3) B.Ec with B.App.Fin would be a fairly heavy workload. Nothing you can't handle if you're an organised person. I find the content of the economics and applied finance units to be much more interesting than anything else I have encountered so far (Law, Statistics, Accounting, etc.).

4) Your App.Fin degree would allow you to become a CFA (Chartered Financial Analyst). So it's not too hard to get work if you're a good App.Fin student. Economics is another story. If you do really well, you could get into the RBA, otherwise economists work in government formulating policies, and for trade unions. You could even work as an economic journalist. I even know of some B.Ec students working as quantitive analysts.

 

[williamc]

Thanks alot, a final question.

How are you assessed? Is it like in class tests and a final or presentations and a final.

 

[Luke!]

The assessment structure changes depending on the unit. Assessment in a typical commerce unit might look something like this...

Tutorial Attendance and Participation------5%
Mid-semester Assignment--------------------10%
Mid-semester Exam----------------------------25%
Final Exam---------------------------------------60%

But as I said, it depends on the unit; some units have two mid-semester exams, some require short reports or assignments, et cetera. Generally, the final exam is always the most important and is always worth at least 50% of your total assessment for a unit.

 

[williamc]

Thanks again, sorry but one final question.

What is the difference in FNN04 - Applied Finance + Economics and FNN05 - Applied Finance and Econometrics? In content, difficulity, and how it affects future job prospects. Assuming they are majors, do you pick them after you are enrolled in the course, or when you apply through UAC?

Thanks.

 

[P_Dilemma]

Just the economics and econometrics, is all. Search it up and have a look.

BTW, be forewarned that you need a minimum # of credit points of 96, that's 4 years of full timetables, or longer if you don't plan to do 12CP per semester. I'm doing Economics right now, and i'm wondering whether to transfer to just App.Fin or App.Fin+Ec after my first semester, as long as i get a GPA of 2.25+. Doing both seems long and tiresome, so i duno, someone convince us?

-P_D

 

[Luke!]

Econometrics is the application of statistics to economic data. I did ECON141- Introductory Econometrics... it's boring stuff in my opinion.

P_Dilemma, do this; transfer to App.Fin+Ec. and fill your semester entirely with App.Fin units... if you like App.Fin better, then you can just drop the Ec. degree and you haven't wasted any extra time doing any Ec. units.

I'm doing a four year double-degree, and this is how I justify it: 'An extra year for an extra degree'. Think about it in those terms and it definitely seems worthwhile.

 

[williamc]

Thanks alot Luke, now that i know that i can now focus on getting that 87 UAI. I'll just aim for 90 to be sure i guess.

 

[P_Dilemma]

eh, sure, but 12CP per semester seems so tough. I mean, i haven't been here for even ONE semester and i thing 12CP is hard work. I'm thinking i need some more time off.

Although, i'll give you points for your "an extra year for an extra degree". May be more rewarding in the long run.

And i'm wondering how i'll get 96 CP in total at the end of 4 years. Do i have to do loads of 400 level units, or max out my 100's and do a few extra 200's and 300's?

Here's my plan for now (IF I transfer):
Yr 1 - 8x100 (24CP)
Yr 2 - 2x200 (as per the App.Fin requirements) (8CP) + 2x100 (6CP)
Yr 3 - 5x300 (as per the App.Fin requirements) (15CP)

that's 43 CP in total. if i just want to do App.Fin, i need to find 25CP worth of 200-300 lvl units as electives, and i've maxed out my 100s. And if i want to add Ec to the equation, that's a 4th year, + 28 MORE CP i have to find to do. Help!!!

-P_D

 

[Luke!]

Yeah, 12CP per semester is a lot, especially in the App.Fin + Ec. double degree. I'm doing 13CP this semester and I feel it is probably too much.

You always have the option of doing 9CP per semester and doing two units in summer school. Keep that in mind.

As for getting the 96CP you need for the double degree... you shouldn't be doing any 400 level units at all... max out your 100s, do the minimum amount of 300s, and fill the remainder with 200s. That's the easiest way to do it.

Sit down and plan out your degree. Make a schedule of what units you'll do in what semesters, making sure they're all in order to satisfy prerequisites. Once you have your cores sorted out into a good order, read up in the handbook about electives and pick which ones you like and put them in the remaining spots.

Just don't drop your Ec. degree yet. Transfer into the double, and just work towards completing the App.Fin degree if you want. If towards the end of the App.Fin degree you feel like you wanna do the extra year, just do all the Ec. units in your fourth year. Just because you're enrolled in a double degree doesn't mean you need to complete them simulataneously. You can just work towards finishing one, and drop the other whenever you want.

 

[williamc]

I take it you max out your 100's to do the most you can of the easist work? And do the minimum of the 300's as it is the most difficult?

 

[havy]

generally ppl perceive 300lvl units are harder than 200lvl and 100lvl, but there are quite a few exceptions such as econ335, busl350 etc.

 

[Dimsimmer]

How many people every year do B App Fin/B Ec. I can hardly find anyone who does this degree combination. A lot of people seem to be doing B Com - Accg.

 

[rhynodfox]

Hi,

I am currently in 4th year of my Bachelor of Applied Finance with Bachelor of Economics (Honours) majoring in Econometrics *bloody mouthul isn't it

I have really enjoyed the degree and would like to dispell a myth of "uni economics is just a continuation of HSC economics ... (if indeed it is still existent) - Uni economics is very different to year 11 and 12 HSC economics! There are more graphs and models (great stuff).

I have chosen to take 4 mathematics subjects, but this is very abnormal (I'm very weird in that I find mathematics very enjoyable/easy and indeed was seriously thinking about completing a Bachlor of Science in Advanced Maths with Physics...) and the actual course (Ba App Fin / Ba Eco) does not require you to do any such mathematics, so you shouldn't worry about all that. Furthermore, a typical finance lecturer when faced with a difficult mathematics problem will go something like this:

"so you define the variables as follows, do some stuff, and then get this formula" - hahaha! the "do some stuff" element was probably 2 or 3 years worth of matrix algebra and vector calculus, so much for rigorous derivation!!!

anyway, apologies for my ranting ways.

You will be faced with some very enjoyable subjects (most probably not in first year as everything is an "introduction to so-and-so" and there is not much interesting stuff). However, when you hit third year, and you get to choose some electives, bring it on baby! ECON356 - History of Economic Thought (fantastic lecturer - Cambridge PhD qualification under his belt!), ECON335 - Economics of Financial Institutions (lecturer is the nicest bloke you'll ever meet and is my honours co-ordinator) and ACCG252 - Porfolio management (you can fiddle with a massive spreadsheet and pretend you have a few billion dollars under management and check out how good your are!) and ACCG329 - Security Pricing and Hedging was also a blast.

The econometrics subjects (econ141, econ232, econ233, econ333, econ332, econ361 - see the handbook for further details at www.handbook.mq.edu.au and navigate from there) are also fantastic as there are small class sizes and you can come up with your own economic hypotheses (eg. is rampant inflation the cause of high unemployment in country A?) and test it using the various techniques they give you - very practical when you get out in the workforce.

But my favourite subject of all time would have to be ECON309 - Industrial Organisation - essentially it is the theory of contracts and the professor (einstein haircut, truly obscure in all his ways!) is extremely humourous and hard working. You'll get a massive booklet to read with everything from "The Economist" articles, New York Times, LA Times, SMH etc all discussing various current issues. This will revolutionalise your way of thinking and you will go from being 1/10th of an economist to 1/2 of an economist, that's my experience anyway. By the way, it is my opinion that one can never be a true economist, it is assymptotic.

Well if you've read to this point, i'm impressed, apologies for getting carried away, my point is, if you have a genuine desire to study economics which probably requires an inquisitive mind and a will not to settle for crappy explanations by politicians but to rather delve deep into economic analysis, with perhaps having positive externalities on society at large, do this course!

Cheers,
Ryan.

P.S. investment banks and other high flying financial institutions will demand you (there is a concomittant low supply of decent economists) so as you will know, your price will be bid up, so you can start making plans as to what kind of "big boys toys" you would like to purchase.

 

[Dimsimmer]

Hey Rhynodfox,

I was wondering if there are plenty of different jobs with an economics degree or is it just being an economist. Ive done ECON110 and i didnt really enjoy it, does it get any better afterwards cause im thinking about transferring to something like Acturial Studies and App Fin instead.

 

[rhynodfox]

Thanks for your reply and the answer is yes, there are a myriad of employment opportunities for someone with a framed economics degree on their wall.

Investment banking, asset management, market regulation, treasury, etc ...

Economics is a way of thinking, upon completion of an economics degree (with a decent GPA to reflect you've actually learnt what has been taught - that is, not the common phrase "P's get degree's") you'll have a view of the world that is different to those of others, whether they be philosophers, psychologists, doctors, engineers, builders, etc ... This is an attractive asset for many companies as they highly value diversity.

Also, you will acquire many technical skills to help you along the way and if you get good grades in an economic degree, it just shows you "have good DNA to work with" (that is - intelligence) - as a fellow at Deutsche Bank recently told me. Most employers seek smart people, and that gives them 10% capacity to complete the job, the other 90% comes from experience and more importantly, on-the-job training.

Ideally - I would advise you to complete a double-degree (eco + fin, eco + acst, eco + law, eco + accg, or one of the above combinations/permutations - maybe take a few maths electives as well - i'm biased with this point though - lol). Or, alternatively, complete Eco (hons) as this will give you an edge when you start applying to work.

ECON110 is boring (in comparison to fascinating 3rd year subjects), it gives you the bread and butter (along with ECON111, ECON141, ECON210), so you can be forgiven for wanting to abandon ship, you'll also notice it was fairly different to HSC economics, lots more models, equations etc.

Don't give up my friend, if you enjoy thinking about how the world works, why people do as they do, critique politicians economic claims, seek to help people less fortunate that one's self, being an economist will enable you to do so (a greater capacity anyway). If you don't enjoy economics and are doing it for the money, i would encourage you to enrol in a music degree (if you passion is music), joing the surfing tour (if your passion is surfing) or joing the army (if you want to blow stuff up) - you get my point.

To conclude these ramblings:

- it does get better. Much, much better (esp. econ309, econ311, econ356 )
- there are lots of jobs and employers seeking people with eco degrees that will not necessarily involve you sitting around doing economics models all day long
- consider adding (as opposed to transferring) app fin or acst to your current studies (and perhaps even hons - albeit this is a way off for you - also seek academic advice from the good old very friendly staff at E4A levels 4&5)

Hope this helps,
Cheers,
Ryan.