Does God exist? (15 Viewers)

[Scorch]

Nar, i reckon;

A like, meeting of people with the same ideas as scorch. Get some cigarettes and wine and a nice park. Sounds enlightening.

Wow. I'm some kind of God around here ...

ermm what about agnostics?

Honestly they're really totally the same thing.

 

[Karlmarx]

well, ill need to disprove you too! haha.


I'm trying to help the cause. you articulate what i try to get across! AHHH


Ive made 70 posts here today.

 

[Scorch]

well, ill need to disprove you too! haha.


I'm trying to help the cause. you articulate what i try to get across! AHHH


Ive made 70 posts here today.

Religious suffering is, at one and the same time, the expression of real suffering and a protest against real suffering. Religion is the sigh of the oppressed creature, the heart of a heartless world, and the soul of soulless conditions. It is the opium of the people.

The abolition of religion as the illusory happiness of the people is the demand for their real happiness. To call on them to give up their illusions about their condition is to call on them to give up a condition that requires illusions. The criticism of religion is, therefore, in embryo, the criticism of that vale of tears of which religion is the halo.

Criticism has plucked the imaginary flowers on the chain not in order that man shall continue to bear that chain without fantasy or consolation, but so that he shall throw off the chain and pluck the living flower. The criticism of religion disillusions man, so that he will think, act, and fashion his reality like a man who has discarded his illusions and regained his senses, so that he will move around himself as his own true Sun. . .​

~ Karl Marx

 

[Karlmarx]

Quoting from me are you...

Well, dont i feel specialz

 

[Scorch]

Quoting from me are you...

Well, dont i feel specialz

Well you don't do the best job of impersonating him, but it's a fair reference and slightly learned so I'll grant you it.

 

[Karlmarx]

Well, we should find a real christian to poke a stick at.

 

[777HYBRID777]

What about the thousands of acts of cruelty? ... What about those homosexuals who are marginalised to this day because of religion? ... but it takes religion to make good people do bad things.

Thousand acts of cruelty? - everyone does evil in this world, but it is how you respond to that that matters - some religions have repentance for this, others have different methods. Religion does not condone violence.

If you are saying that it takes religion for evil to be in this world, i don’t see how you concluded that... 'evil' (evil/hate/spite) are atavistic human responses - not the stem of religion. And yes - atheists can do evil deeds (Embryonic Stem Cell, cloning ect.) BUT of course that is relative to ones thoughts, as is all evil deeds.

And RELIGION does not discriminate against homosexuals.... > SOME< ROMAN CATHOLICS/FUNDAMENTALISTS do. There are MANY religious traditions and denominations amongst them that openly accept them and have no problem with among the community.

Religion is definitely not the primal reason to hatred against homosexuals - the fact that they are different makes one uncomfortable, religion is often blamed because of what’s publicised in media.

 

[Scorch]

Well, we should find a real christian to poke a stick at.

Yes, we should. Shame that none of them will actually answer my points well enough for this to be any more challenging than debating 6 year olds.

 

[Scorch]

Thousand acts of cruelty? - everyone does evil in this world, but it is how you respond to that that matters - some religions have repentance for this, others have different methods. Religion does not condone violence.

Sure it does. The Bible is one of the most grotesque and disgustingly violent books in antiquity.

And RELIGION does not discriminate against homosexuals.... > SOME< ROMAN CATHOLICS/FUNDAMENTALISTS do. There are MANY religious traditions and denominations amongst them that openly accept them and have no problem with among the community.

Christianity stems from the Bible. The Bible states homosexuals must be put to death.

Could you please try and deal in actual facts before responding to my posts next time? Maybe even try a google/wiki search or two to educate yourself to a rudimentary level.

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

Well, we should find a real christian to poke a stick at.

such a shame that iron isnt here no more

 

[777HYBRID777]

Christianity stems from the NEW TESTAMENT - read some of it. Christians believe Jesus arrived to stop corruption of the Pharasses. Its primal message, and "new commandment of love is" LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOUR AS YOU LOVE YOURSELF. He lived amonst the outcast lepors (contemporary homosexuals if you wish), as an indication to NOT DISCRIMINATE. The prime message for christians to live by is to not judge, and not discriminate. Please find for me a passage in the new testament which supports any indication or even hint that chasing a homosexual with a pointy stick is the way to go

 

[Scorch]

Christianity stems from the NEW TESTAMENT - read some of it. Christians believe Jesus arrived to stop corruption of the Pharasses. Its primal message, and "new commandment of love is" LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOUR AS YOU LOVE YOURSELF. He lived amonst the outcast lepors (contemporary homosexuals if you wish), as an indication to NOT DISCRIMINATE. The prime message for christians to live by is to not judge, and not discriminate. Please find for me a passage in the new testament which supports any indication or even hint that chasing a homosexual with a pointy stick is the way to go

"Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. 18I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke of a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law until everything is accomplished.
~Luke 5:17-18


The New Testament doesn't mean that somehow the barbarity of the Old Testament doesn't count.

Also I did ask you to deal in facts, so if you continue along this vein I'm really just going to be snippy and short, so as not to waste time.

 

[777HYBRID777]

Dude what facts do you want? - i dont really care if one does not believe in the existance of a god, but i really cant see how someone can look back through histroy and say "yea, religion. That shudnt have happened".

The fact is that for many people religion is the answer, for others it is not.

 

[Scorch]

Dude what facts do you want? - i dont really care if one does not believe in the existance of a god, but i really cant see how someone can look back through histroy and say "yea, religion. That shudnt have happened".

The fact is that for many people religion is the answer, for others it is not.

... and those for whom it is the answer impose it on the others. Inquisitions, murder, torture, crusades, witch-hunts, the Jewish Question, execution for homosexuality, persecution, distortion of truth, brainwashing of children and thousands of other historical events all based on the words of Holy Books that are thousands of years old and whose claims are demonstrably false.

In fact it is the mark of an entirely rational human being to see religion as an embarrassing blight on the history of human civilization.

 

[777HYBRID777]

and you can say for certain that no Athiest has ever done any evil against man? OF COURSE in the stages and progression of religion (if we are talking of Christianity) there is going to be dispute, YES there has been evil deeds done in the name of religion - the world was in its progressive stage to a globalised world - YES THERE WILL BE CONFLICING BELIEFS AND IDEAS- that cannot be avoided.

Yes i agree there are some severe distortions amongst religion and i will not deny that there are vial acts by distorted individuals - but to say that religion is a blight upon human history is pretty bold.

Alot of good has come from religion. Religion is not the fault for some places being in shit and others not.

 

[Scorch]

and you can say for certain that no Athiest has ever done any evil against man? OF COURSE in the stages and progression of religion (if we are talking of Christianity) there is going to be dispute, YES there has been evil deeds done in the name of religion - the world was in its progressive stage to a globalised world - YES THERE WILL BE CONFLICING BELIEFS AND IDEAS- that cannot be avoided.

Yes i agree there are some severe distortions amongst religion and i will not deny that there are vial acts by distorted individuals - but to say that religion is a blight upon human history is pretty bold.

Alot of good has come from religion. Religion is not the fault for some places being in shit and others not.

Atheism has nothing to do with evil deeds, that's the point. One does not rationally commit a crime based on a lack of belief.

However the problem with your interpretation is that you assume that these evil deeds are committed by people that are not obeying their religious book. The problem is that those that do such deeds are the ones that are actually obeying it properly. The violence and bigotry is there already in its composite parts; there is nothing manipulative about it.

Also, the 'good' that comes from religion, beyond people having an imaginary friend to turn to, is nothing that could not have been done, or bettered, by rational, secular people working within society. Without religion, in fact, there would not be as much of a need to 'do good' in places such as Africa, for example.

Also shouting in capitals does not make you any less wrong.

 

[Karlmarx]

/B/

Logic>God

'Atheism is a reaction to a belief. It is the rejection of a claim for which there is no evidence.'

'Nonetheless, the fact remains that it is altogether rational to state that something does not exist if there is no evidence to suggest that it does.'

Scorch

 

[777HYBRID777]

Atheism has nothing to do with evil deeds

However the problem with your interpretation is that you assume that these evil deeds are committed by people that are not obeying their religious book.

Also, the 'good' that comes from religion, beyond people having an imaginary friend to turn to,

Also shouting in capitals does not make you any less wrong

Well 'evil' is very relational - many people consider that the view of embryonic stem cell reasearch is 'evil' whilst other view ect. ect. - so no if you believe what you are doing is right that in a secular community very little would be considered wrong

and sorry dude if my view is seems obnoxious - perhaps i have come off very wrong. my interpretation is that we should accept all views, learn as much as we can from each, and the individual live by one or combination of beliefs (not talking about just religious beliefs). I very much believe that everyone should at least attempt to see others perspectives and with that make a judgement on what is right and wrong. To me this should be abided to - not specifically a singular religious book.

Religion is not an 'imaginary friend'. Religion does not = semetic religions.
If some find it easier to see the reasoning for creation through a physical being then fine. Religion is a beautiful tradition and way of living.

haha yes i am sorry for using constant CAPS.

 

[Karlmarx]

Well, for my last post of the day (of which there have been about 80ish), id like to post the simple, and highly convincing argument, of which, is, creationism:

'God did it'... Evidence from Science

'The universe is only several thousand years old.' - ICR.ORG
'To get around this problem, many astronomers assume there is a vast cloud of comets out near the edge of the solar system, which releases new comets every so often. This imaginary cloud is called the "Oort Cloud," named after the astronomer who proposed it. The problem is that there is no observational evidence such a cloud exists at all.'

Well, its probably the same reasoning to justify God's existence. It must then, be ohkai.




Science suggests:

'Current theory and observations suggest that the universe is 13.75 ±0.17 billion years old.'

Okay,



Now, if the creationists are trying to justify God's creation of the world/universe...


They haven't done a very good job.

 

[777HYBRID777]

yes i am going to head of for some sleep after this comment hehehe


watchmaker theory

how can something come from nothing

just because something has yet to be revealed/ proven to be true (god?) does not mean it does not exist

science has a theory of evolution, but has not yet proven the origin of the world, as it is still a theory.

So at the moment - the origin of the world is still theory based, and there is no way to prove god put it there (and yes i may perhaps be wrong, but nobody knows everything)

have a good life everyone.