Expansion of the EU (1 Viewer)

[Ziff]

1st May 2004, 10 new countries, 8 of them ex-Socialist nations will join the European Union.

The Australian media, particularly the SMH seems to be taking up the most negative attitude to the experiment. It seems to be focusing mainly on the worst aspects of the expansion, these problems are relatively minor to what has been achieved.

As opposed to viewing the trade and security benefits to the new nations and viewing this as a massive feat of goodwill, diplomacy and democracy, the Australian media is reporting this as a forced agreement - that most nations simply joined for the subsidies.

Personally, I think that the European Union will bring massive opportunities for the nations joining and plow a lot of money into their nations - not from the subsidies - but from companies looking for cheap labour, lots of land and highly skilled workers. Most people tend to forget that the education system under the Socialists was of extremely high quality and gruelling - especially with the quota system imposed on all professions - only the best students would be able to go on to practice in these professions. Many corporations, particularly telecommunications and computing industries, have already invested lots in Eastern Europe and it will be easier for them to do so as of 1st May.

The other aspect is also the way in which the EU has forced these nations to impliment positive changes in their legal systems especially in relation to trade, welfare and human rights. This is something the US is still struggling to do in Afganistan and Iraq and totally failed in doing so in Vietnam as well as other nations (I wouldn't call the decades of dictatorship in South Korea or the corrupt democracy in the Phillipenes a success, let's not go into South America!). The way the EU is working, they have also have a positive and influential effect on Turkey and Romania, two nations with a bad human rights record and is trying to help them fix up these problems, generally with some money and a nice bit of diplomatic pressure. Use the carrot - not the stick!

Of course I agree that in the immediate, short-term and perhaps medium-term, there will still be problems. Many of the Eastern European nations still feel a lot of pain towards to west, especially after many nations tried to revolt against the Soviet system and were never lent any assistance (Hungary - 56, Czechoslovakia - 68, Poland - Early 80s). Also the idea of once again seemingly giving up power to a new bureaucracy - this time Brussels, not Moscow. In the long-term, however, and it's even apparent now, the EU has had positive effects on the Eastern European nations and will continue to do so.

I want to see how this experment turns out in 15-30 years time. For something that grew out of the Franco-German attempt to create ever-lasting peace between the nations I think they've done a pretty good job getting 25 nations on board in a massive political and trading bloc promoting peace and democracy amongst one another.

What will be more interesting however, is if this works, what's next? Once/If all of continental Europe (and Iceland and Greenland perhaps) is in will Russia and Turkey be given a chance? Remember that Russia and Turkey are partly in Europe and have contributed much to the development of Europe throughout the ages. If Turkey is allowed in would Israel be allowed as it too also has a strong European heritage and has played a reasonable role in it as well?

A Europe stretching from Greenland to Vladivostok, from the North Pole to the Gaza Strip. Just think about it!

So what's everyone's else's thoughts if you have any?

 

[jm1234567890]

nah, its not going to work in the long term, conflicting cultures and values will ultimately be their downfall.

ppl have compterd the EU to be being the next superpower like the USA. However, i doubt so many countries can work to a 'common' goal.

I mean, consider the UN, that isn't exactly a success. The USA still 'forced' the UN to let them wage a war in iraq.

then again, the USA may fall into anarchy in the future due to the ever widening gap between the rich and the poor.
In china it is a different story. There is a every widening gap between the rich and the poor, but instead of the poor living in trailer parks. the poor die off, thus not causing any problems.
and not burdening the economy.

So, i predict china to be the next super power.

 

[Alexander]

People have been predicting China to be the next super power since Naploeon...seriously.
The new members have now made the possible name change (Western. EU) impossible. Now the sub-human peasant east have clawed their unimaginative, dissorgainised and inefficient selfs in, the dream is dead....i mean...i hope i didnt say that out loud.
The bad things ive heard are that their workers aren't allowed to be intergrated into the west, even though they could revitalise the aging pop. of the west. Also, the members are very poor and likely to see a rise in cost of goods thru. the euro.
All I can say is that Margret would be falling out of her weelchair over this.

 

[George W. Bush]

I'm pretty sure it's going to last, the CIS states NEED the EU.

 

[victor..cleaner]

www.eugirls.net

 

[chepas]

Originally posted by Alexander
Now the sub-human peasant east have clawed their unimaginative, dissorgainised and inefficient selfs in, the dream is dead....i mean...i hope i didnt say that out loud.
The bad things ive heard are that their workers aren't allowed to be intergrated into the west, even though they could revitalise the aging pop. of the west. .

(I'm just a bit unclear/too dumb on one thing, what's the 'dream', sorry, ?)

That not-allowed-to-integrate thing seems to be a big sticking point for me.. (Now pray let me know if thses are sweeping generalisations, as my unlearnedness would probably show) Just for an example, it seems to be that even though that collectively the EU preaches unity and working together etc, but many of the bigger countries understandably are scared of a big 'invasion' of the Ten into the Fifteen (current members, as of yesterday), of people sort of 'fleeing' for jobs, etc...

The French newspaper "Le Figaro" on its front page today had a list of ten questions, a lot of them pointed, on the surface to something negative, questions like "Should we fear an influx of immigrants?", "Will crime and corruption increase" - but thats probably a bit of sensationalism for you

But talking to people over the net of the respective bigger nationsin th EU, Ger, France etc, their immigration policies seem rather selective in who they take in... so there might be a very 'steady influx', depending who they 'let' in... not quite sure.. still reading the mountain loads of stuff about this.

In general, me, I'm just fascinated by it. 25 countries vying for unity and one working together for, theoretically, the same common goals, whatever they are... working together and all that... very huge ! I find myself agreeing with Ziff on a lot of that msg.

 

[Ziff]

Hell yes! That's what I like about the EU - it's fasinating. The history, the way they've moulded it, the way it's put together, the strange and complex politics and legal system! God, it's fantastic!

What most of the old nations are doing is that they are not allowing members of the new nations to take up welfare in their nations for between 2-7 years. Ireland is the only one that has not placed any restrictions on the citizens from the new members. In most cases, members from the new countries can go over to the old countries and work immediately. In Britain, the government is requiring that all workers from the new EU states fill out a form, but then the workers get a big book of how not to get screwed over by unscrupilous British employers

Europe is a non-stop party isn't it? May day + New countries joining. 9th May is Europe Day! To celebrate the day Schuman delivered his speech in 1950 about the European Coal and Steel Community.

 

[RUB!X]

vegra magyarorsag bana von os EU ba ... go hungary !

 

[Xayma]

Hmm Im still not satisfied with the EU till a non-Europenan (sp?) country joins, and hence defeats the whole purpose.

If Russia can join NATO...

 

[lengstar]

i hope it works out. the world needs a coalition to challenge the US and unfortunately China's taking a merry long time especially with the one-child policy backfire

 

[Sarah168]

the one child policy was abolished a few years ago anyway....

 

[chepas]

It was? Wow! OK. So what process/realisation led to its abolition?

Re: the coalition to challenge the US, let's hope that they wil not become two wildly opposing parties that could eventually lead to a big conflict! But agreed that it's good to have the 'challenge'.

Seem to be a lot of Hungarians here

 

[Ziff]

Two, we all congregated here.

 

[Sarah168]

Originally posted by chepas
It was? Wow! OK. So what process/realisation led to its abolition?

the social problems were defeating the purpose of the policy. Since China has traditionally had the view that newborn girls are inferior to boys, there was a significant rise in female infanticide (particularly in rural areas) and all the legal problems arose with parents hiding the fact that the family actually has two or more kids or so. There are now 120 males for every 100 females in China which could potentially cause social problems in the future..as you can imagine

 

[Ziff]

Like the legalisation of multiple marriages for both genders?

 

[Sarah168]

ahhh only the future will tell but lets hope the mentality of the Chinese governemnt is not the same as yours Ziff

 

[glycerine]

i'm very interested to look back at this in say 20 years, fascinating to see the construction of an empire : ) as long as i can remember it's always been the usa with little to no competition and i just really love that (despite any immediate problems) maybe we'll get to sit back and watch the superpower build itself

 

[chepas]

Very very true...

I'm listening to the BBC World Service atm and seems to be that the old countries have been battering down the hatches preparing this mass movement of people from one nation to another, as the SPD Party in Germany put in reforms re: immigrants and jobs/etc, ... And the Latvian Presidents on it talking on it.. Very fascinating.

SBS 1107AM.

If you didn't catch it at this ungodly hour.. bbcworldservice.com, Talking Point programme.

 

[ameh]

wasnt the one child policy introduced in the 1970's and still enforced today?


chepas is that radio national?

 

[chepas]

Nah the SBS foreign lang. station.. Just broadcasts the worldservice from midnight to 6am. Good accompaniment to the bored nocturnal teenager