Homosexuality in Australia (6 Viewers)

[Kwayera]

errrr, it was a SERIOUS question. Cos i havent heard of any straight dude that gets deeply offended by discrimination against homosexuals. In no way, i was mocking him. hence why i put the words "serious" and "no offence intended" in my post.

Yes, he is VERY gay, in fact he is so gay and so sickened by it he's spent a year sleeping with me to try and purge his gayness.


Please.

 

[boris]

Really, 2008. We're not much better than we were 30 years ago... I'd say we're more prude.

 

[ur_inner_child]

You really don't need to couch it in those terms.

Whatever your sexuality is, it shouldn't matter when it comes to guaranteeing equal rights for individuals.

its true. I don't know. I don't know how to reason with these people anymore. I can't relate to them

 

[MTP]

Great to see that you don't have any ethical friends, then.

:rollseyes:

Seriously, What i meant was, i dont know anyone, that has been personally deeply offended by such matters. Yes, me and my mates prevent and act upon, when idiots discriminate against homosexuals. But i dont know anyone, who feels that way .

Sorry if i sounded like an arrogant retard in the past few posts, but i was being serious.

 

[boris]

:rollseyes:

Seriously, What i meant was, i dont know anyone, that has been personally deeply offended by such matters. Yes, me and my mates prevent and act upon, when idiots discriminate against homosexuals. But i dont know anyone, who feels that way .

Sorry if i sounded like an arrogant retard in the past few posts, but i was being serious.

I seriously have no idea what you're trying to say.

 

[Iron]

But there is a tension between individual rights and social-cohesion on virtually every issue. I dont see the value in being absolutist about it.

 

[ur_inner_child]

:rollseyes:

Seriously, What i meant was, i dont know anyone, that has been personally deeply offended by such matters. Yes, me and my mates prevent and act upon, when idiots discriminate against homosexuals. But i dont know anyone, who feels that way .

Sorry if i sounded like an arrogant retard in the past few posts, but i was being serious.

I don't understand your post.

Yes, me and my mates prevent and act upon, when idiots discriminate against homosexuals.

So you DO step in when people discriminate against homosexuals, but Schroedinger just did too? He's defending them and stuff? Or am I misunderstanding something here?

Wouldn't you act up on something you believed to be unjust? Same way as when you see a guy bashing up a girl, you'd probably step in and defend her?

 

[MTP]

I don't understand your post.



So you DO step in when people discriminate against homosexuals, but Schroedinger just did too? He's defending them and stuff? Or am I misunderstanding something here?

Wouldn't you act up on something you believed to be unjust? Same way as when you see a guy bashing up a girl, you'd probably step in and defend her?

Yes and yes.

I dont know anyone that gets deeply Offended when homosexuals are being discriminated against, tbh. I am surrounded by relious dudes that believe that homosexuals are false people. I come from a boys school and you would be very suprised at the comments aimed at homosexuals. yes it is wrong but i personally dont get offended.

urrghh, sorry if my posts are all over the place. Just really tired

But yet my post was misunderstood as a cheap shot, when i asked that question.

 

[ur_inner_child]

Yes and yes.

I dont know anyone that gets deeply Offended when homosexuals are being discriminated against, tbh. I am surrounded by relious dudes that believe that homosexuals are false people. I come from a boys school and you would be very suprised at the comments aimed at homosexuals. yes it is wrong but i personally dont get offended.

urrghh, sorry if my posts are all over the place. Just really tired

But yet my post was misunderstood as a cheap shot, when i asked that question.

Well you come from an all boys school, that's pretty sheltered in general. I'm not saying YOU personally are sheltered, but once you get into the real world etc you'll see how it's pretty sheltered. An all boys school has its own bizarre social dynamics etc.

I went to an all girls school, and the neighbouring all-boys school were horrible with the gay jokes too. You don't defend them because you want to keep your place in the social pecking order. But when you get out of there, you'll hopefully take a grasp of what's appropriate in the real world; that all people deserve the same rights as everyone else. And hopefully you won't be quiet about it either. Honestly, it's such an injustice. The last thing we need is anyone's apathy.

 

[MTP]

Well you come from an all boys school, that's pretty sheltered in general. I'm not saying YOU personally are sheltered, but once you get into the real world etc you'll see how it's pretty sheltered. An all boys school has its own bizarre social dynamics etc.

I went to an all girls school, and the neighbouring all-boys school were horrible with the gay jokes too. You don't defend them because you want to keep your place in the social pecking order. But when you get out of there, you'll hopefully take a grasp of what's appropriate in the real world; that all people deserve the same rights as everyone else. And hopefully you won't be quiet about it either. Honestly, it's such an injustice. The last thing we need is anyone's apathy.

Great post, and yes i agree with you with the bolded bit.

kinda offtopic**
A friend of mine moved overseas cos of the constant bullying, and people labelling him "gay". Apparently, he fit into the criteria for the stereotypical gay, but if they got to know him better, they would of known that he was straight and had a couple girlfriends in his high school life.

This is the one of the many issues, in an all boys school. =\

 

[Iron]

Of course there is, but for the most part these issues on rights tend to stem from ignorance or bigotry, rather than reason or rational thoughts.

It's not being absolutist it's just pointing out the very basic logic of the situation.

No comprhenday
It's not ignorant to want the most people as possible to feel as socially included as possible in the street/town/state/country/world which they live.

I want a community which people feel apart of, happy in, safe in. It's utilitarian. People should see what goes on across the road as involving them, they should identify their interest in things other than what clothes they wear, what things they buy - their immediate, narrow, animal interests and instincts. This is a much more humanitarian view and goes a much longer way in safeguarding the fundamental human rights of others - as opposed to making lol threads/posts on all manner of human tragedy.
Bell tolls for thee and all that.

 

[Iron]

As i've said, I accept homosexuality. It's fine. But its promotion in society and intrusion into marriage cut into community values and social-cohesion. There should be a general pressumption, a noble lie, that there is stability, everyone is similar. Im a guy, youre a guy - therefore we like sport, women, cars etc. This is a conversation point, a shared identity. We can build a friendship from this basis.
It might not be true. You might be as gay as a picnic. But you can swallow that and talk generally about boobs for the greater goal of our friendship, right?

The fact is that difference is true, but intimidating. If I thought that you might jump me given half the chance, id be more on guard - i'd not share as much with you, i'd retreat just a little more within myself and, I dont know, spend a lot of time on the internet. If I assume that you have the same desires, beliefs etc as me and the majority of society, then we're practically friends already.
Hug?

 

[xeuyrawp]

If I thought that you might jump me given half the chance, id be more on guard - i'd not share as much with you, i'd retreat just a little more within myself and, I dont know, spend a lot of time on the internet. If I assume that you have the same desires, beliefs etc as me and the majority of society, then we're practically friends already.

That's a very peculiar argument. :-/

Obviously you're then of that opinion with women?

That being said, I doubt I'd jump you, but given that I'm gay, you think that we still couldn't be practically friends already?

 

[Iron]

Youre obviously the chink in my absolutist armour PwarYuex. To me, you very much retain your masculinity. I'd say that what unites you and me is greater than what divides us, so yeah, hello friend. Your homosexuality isnt overt/in your face. There's a dignity to you. I am forced then to burrow deeper and talk generally about gender roles, which was my point anyway; your sexual preference wouldnt be entirely relevant to any conversation we would have and you would have the maturity and sensitivity to not plonk it on the table. That being said, im sure that there are circumstances where you have felt it not worth insisting on your sexual preference in situations where it would embarrase others and disadvantage your standing in their eyes.
Delicious compromise.

Furthertomore, men and women have a natural sexual desire for eachother and that's their basis. Im not brave enough to argue traditional breadwinner/homemaker roles, but it's out there.

 

[boris]

Did a bit of digging up re: origins of homophobia. Found these points.
- It's not natural (which has been debunked by scientists showing examples of other species of animals engaging in homosexual behaviour)
- It's a perversion; extention of the it's not natural argument
- It's against God's law; which if anybody who knows their Bible properly will note this is not the case
- It's disgusting; so are a shit load of other things on this planet, but we're not going to legislate against sewerage workers because they come home smelling like poop
- Us vs. Them; if gays are married it will somehow undermine the traditional heterosexual institution of marriage. So far I haven't seen a valid argument to substantiate why this is the case. I'd be interested to see if any research has been done in countries where gay marriage is accepted, to see what detrimental effects this has had on the heterosexual community.
Fear that one may be a homosexual themself; I think this is the underlying root of 90% of homophobia. UH OH, IF I ACCEPT GAYS THAT MUST MEAN I'M GAY?

 

[boris]

Youre obviously the chink in my absolutist armour PwarYuex. To me, you very much retain your masculinity. I'd say that what unites you and me is greater than what divides us, so yeah, hello friend. Your homosexuality isnt overt/in your face. There's a dignity to you. I am forced then to burrow deeper and talk generally about gender roles, which was my point anyway; your sexual preference wouldnt be entirely relevant to any conversation we would have and you would have the maturity and sensitivity to not plonk it on the table. That being said, im sure that there are circumstances where you have felt it not worth insisting on your sexual preference in situations where it would embarrase others and disadvantage your standing in their eyes.
Delicious compromise.

Furthertomore, men and women have a natural sexual desire for eachother and that's their basis. Im not brave enough to argue traditional breadwinner/homemaker roles, but it's out there.

Despite cultural strictures that discourage gay relationships between men, much of men’s interaction is in homosocial settings (i.e., segregated settings that include only men). Studies of interaction between men in such settings find that their interaction is based on emotional detachment, competitiveness, and the sexual
objectification of women

Integrative Psychological and Behavioral Science, Volume 41, Issues 3-4

 

[boris]

Moar

Because gender includes beliefs about sexual behaviour, it is one of the primary crucibles within which sexuality is produced. Sexualities are informed
by and embedded in conceptions of gender; that is, they are embedded in gender ideologies that enable and structure differential practices for women and men

 

[boris]

Moar

Homophobia, like other phobias, is associated with a deep feelings of discomfort (like anxiety, fear and, in extreme cases, hate) relate to people that have affective and sexual relations with same sex partners. These feelings appear as expressions of irrationality by homophobic people. But, according our hypothesis, these are not the result of “irrational feelings” constructed just from an individual history (i.e., snake phobia). In this direction, homophobia is not a kind of phobia, but a boundary
phenomenon built by affective meaning making, a collective historical–cultural construction. In our point of view, although there are some common aspects between
homophobia and phobias in general, it is not accurate or productive to consider homophobia as just one more example of phobia.

 

[esquared]

didnt read thread but how the fuck did this get to 141 pages? are there seriously people here who have a problem with a man loving a man?

 

[boris]

didnt read thread but how the fuck did this get to 141 pages? are there seriously people here who have a problem with a man loving a man?

yes