Intolerance: Christians vs. Atheists (2 Viewers)

[aussiechica7]

The New Face of Old Atheism
In Church history class we talked about a lot of the repeating mistakes that have been made throughout the history of the Church. Money, abuse of power, and ignorance were the big ones. But one of them in particular got my attention and sparked quite the conversation: Intolerance.

I gave my two cents on the church taking up it's (self imposed) role of enforcing morality and religiousity with in secular society and finished off with, "When the time comes, we won't want thier standards forced upon us so why are we forcing our standards on them?"

Apparently part of my sentence wasn't spoken soon enough because, as I found out today, "when the time comes" has already come. Part of me knew this, the whole creationism/evolutionism being taught in school debate has been going on long enough. But this is beyond science class and in my opinion, beyond science.

A recent Wired Magazine article entitled, "The Church of the Non-Believer" tells of the quest of a group of intellectuals who are adamant about destorying any notion that there is a God. That's right, they're proselytizing, except, I found thier arguments a tad bit elitist. For example:

"Highly intelligent people are mostly atheists" - Richard Dawkins

The message of the article is clear, atheism is intellectual high ground, not only are theists stupid but also religion is evil because it breeds intolerance, war, and suicide bombing. Of course atheism doesn't do any of this (yeah, right). And Dawkins goes so far as to paint atheism with the same social stigma as homosexuality, as if atheists need time to 'come out'.

The author then goes on the age old arguements for discounting Christianity altogether, one of them being the advent of slavery with in Christainity, as if it was the atheists who eventually came to the rescue of the slaves. It wasn't, it was the Christians who faught against other Christians to put an end to it.

Of course, most of the article is bunk and more intolerant then a lot of Christians I know! I'm not going to sit back and pretend that Christianity is innocent, because it isn't. But I'm dumb founded that these people would raise the atheist flag in the name of intellectualism (which is more like elitism), and peace and neglect to look back and see who first delved into intellectualism. Oxford, which in the article is made to seem like the haven for reason (and thus atheism) was started by Christian monastic orders!

As well, the notion that discarding religion will solve the problem of 'religious' wars was proven wrong a hundred years ago.

Nietzsche said that, 'God is dead' or in other words, the Christian worldview with in modern culture has died. And he said because intellectuals and philosophers killed God in the 19th century the 20th century would be the bloodiest century in human history. Nietzsche never lived long enough to find out, but he was right. 10's of millions would die under communist (atheist) Russia alone!

So we come back to intolerance. Personally, I don't have a problem with atheism, I can understand where they're coming from and how they could form such a belief. But for the atheist to set themselves up as the intellectual and moral (if that's even possible with in atheism) strongman is nonsense.

So here's my suggestion to all the atheists. Don't make the same mistakes Christians made. You aren't better or smarter because you don't believe in God.

Just like I'm not better or smarter because I believe in God.

Let's play nice.

(Written by a friend of mine from overseas)

Thoughts?

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Athiests are more logical.

That's my view at least. Maybe not "smarter" but I think more logical/rational/etc.

By the way, people will fight wars no matter what. Religion was just a handy excuse.

 

[S1M0]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Its an interesting insight, and true as well.

 

[S1M0]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

By the way, people will fight wars no matter what. Religion was just a handy excuse.

Now that i think of it,religion is also used as anexcuse to justify hatred and prejudice among someone. (e.g christians hating gays)

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Now that i think of it,religion is also used as anexcuse to justify hatred and prejudice among someone. (e.g christians hating gays)

That was a cultural thing. Religion was not only used as an excuse by it's leaders to wage war but also to explain the unexplainable.

 

[S1M0]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

That was a cultural thing. Religion was not only used as an excuse by it's leaders to wage war but also to explain the unexplainable.

So very true.

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Actually, in regards to the original poster, I have nothing against people who believe in God, merely institutionalised religion and those who push their faith on others.

Believe all you want, just A) don't force it on me or B) quote the Bible.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

I think the article is sub-par. To be honest I dislike this sort of immature atheist elitism that's popping up, but the article doesn't really provide an accurate picture of what's going on imo. Atheism is far from reigning in over anyone, it's only begining to become any sort of popular movement.

Also, throwing in little quips, like this: "10's of millions would die under communist (atheist) Russia alone!" really doesn't lend its self on a critique of the immaturity of others.

On the whole atheists probably are smarter by some small margin, but considering those with more money are more likely to be atheist and the huge number of christians that are likely to be smarter than your average atheist (let alone basic morals) I really don't think this is the sort of thing any atheist should be bringing up.

 

[S1M0]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Hey Not-That-Bright, uh....whats up with the sig?

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

I think the article is sub-par. To be honest I dislike this sort of immature atheist elitism that's popping up, but the article doesn't really provide an accurate picture of what's going on imo. Atheism is far from reigning in over anyone, it's only begining to become any sort of popular movement.

Also, throwing in little quips, like this: "10's of millions would die under communist (atheist) Russia alone!" really doesn't lend its self on a critique of the immaturity of others.

On the whole atheists probably are smarter by some small margin, but considering those with more money are more likely to be atheist and the huge number of christians that are likely to be smarter than your average atheist (let alone basic morals) I really don't think this is the sort of thing any atheist should be bringing up.

Plus, I think Christians (in particular) are jumping on those elitist athiests to go "Ohhh Ohhh We're not the only ones who are extreme in our views and rude to everyone else about them. Atheists do it too!"

Simplistic but true.

 

[S1M0]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Plus, I think Christians (in particular) are jumping on those elitist athiests to go "Ohhh Ohhh We're not the only ones who are extreme in our views and rude to everyone else about them. Atheists do it too!"

Simplistic but true.

Though the athiests are often the ones who ridicule and make fun of Christians and their values. And believe me, they're insulting. I think i've snapped on this forum a few times because of it.

Sure, some churches and a lot of sects, go about harassing people, but the overwhelming majority of christians don't. Having no respect for someone's religion and insulting their own religion often leads to insults back at them.

 

[Legham]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

The original post makes it sound as though christians and athiests are different species :/.

The author then goes on the age old arguements for discounting Christianity altogether, one of them being the advent of slavery with in Christainity, as if it was the atheists who eventually came to the rescue of the slaves. It wasn't, it was the Christians who faught against other Christians to put an end to it.

Im no expert when it comes to history, but if we talk about the civil war, i think it's pretty safe to say that, when they were recruiting people to fight in the war they didn't make it exclusively for christians. Therefore, it wasn't just christians fighting against other christians either, it was one group of people fighting another group. Whether these groups were 100% christian, 99% christian or even 2% christian.

 

[volition]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

And Dawkins goes so far as to paint atheism with the same social stigma as homosexuality, as if atheists need time to 'come out'.

I think that there are people who hold irrationally negative feelings towards atheists, and so I believe there is some truth to Dawkins' comments about the way that atheists get treated/seen by non-atheists. His comments might also be more relevant in the USA, where there are many christians.

10's of millions would die under communist (atheist) Russia alone!

With the case of 'Atheist' Russia, we do need to make the distinction between acting on something BECAUSE of your religion, as it could have happened anyway. ie. holding everything else the same, if they weren't atheist, might their beliefs still have led them to do the same/similar things? I think the atheism itself here doesn't matter.

By the way, people will fight wars no matter what. Religion was just a handy excuse.

True to some extent, but I do have a problem with the hatebreeding that goes on. eg. Muslim countries. Those people are being taught to hate ideas/people because of their religious beliefs. Look at the reaction to the Jyllands-Posten Mohammed cartoons, where some Muslims were burning things(like flags, embassies) down etc.

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

The original post makes it sound as though christians and athiests are different species :/.



Im no expert when it comes to history, but if we talk about the civil war, i think it's pretty safe to say that, when they were recruiting people to fight in the war they didn't make it exclusively for christians. Therefore, it wasn't just christians fighting against other christians either, it was one group of people fighting another group. Whether these groups were 100% christian, 99% christian or even 2% christian.

That's a good point, another good point is the atrocious spelling, grammar and syntax of this piece.

 

[Tulipa]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

True to some extent, but I do have a problem with the hatebreeding that goes on. eg. Muslim countries. Those people are being taught to hate ideas/people because of their religious beliefs. Look at the reaction to the Jyllands-Posten Mohammed cartoons, where some Muslims were burning things(like flags, embassies) down etc.

Again, religion is the excuse there. It's not within the religious code to do that, it's humans fixating on it because of their own means, ends and ideas.

It's all human error.

 

[iamsickofyear12]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Athiests are more logical.

That's my view at least. Maybe not "smarter" but I think more logical/rational/etc.

I think you could make an argument for athiests being smarter.

They may not have a higher IQ or anything but what kind of person makes a decision to believe in god based on the evidence we have now... in my opinion a fairly stupid (or maybe just an emotionally weak) person.

 

[dagwoman]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

"Religiousity" and the misuse of "it's" was enough for me to discount what the person was saying. I gave up after that.

 

[dagwoman]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Also, don't know how legit this is, but here's a graph showing a supposed link between religion and IQ:

http://www.gnxp.com/MT2/archives/001527.html

 

[xXeMoxXxCoRexX]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Athiests are more logical.

You could be right, but that statement itself isn't actually logical at all, which is quite funny.

 

[lengy]

Re: intolerance Christians vs. atheists

Believe all you want, just A) don't force it on me or B) quote the Bible.

Quoted for Truth.