Lawyer Salaries - Help me (4 Viewers)

[Exemplify]

I've been lurking for quite some time and decided to make an account to ask this question.

I was talking to some friends from school and they said that lawyer salaries start at 35k a year and slowly increase from there. This girl even told me that this was at a mid-tier firm. Is this true?

I'm doing my HSC this year, well on track for a 99.8+ and will be going comm/law at usyd

Don't go all crazy and think that I'm basing my career choice purely on the salary because that's not true at all. I have great passion for law but if I'm making less than a person at coles does, then I wont go at all. I'm not going to waste 5 years at uni, rack up a bunch of debt and have no job in a field that lawyers, in my opinion, are earning much less than they should.

Someone knowledgeable on this topic or if you have anything to say, please reply.

Oh and If someone with some kind of authority can move this thread to its right place, it will be great. I'm not sure as to where it would go.

 

[qianjixin]

You should check this out http://www.graduatecareers.com.au/Research/GradJobsDollars/BachelorU25/Law/index.htm

Seems like its more akin to 50k

 

[enoilgam]

*Moved to law forums*

Look, salary is always going to be a consideration when choosing a career - saying that it isnt is being a bit naive. Having a high paying career doesnt just mean you can buy great cars and holidays, but it provides financial security which is very important if you want to start a family. In the long term having money gives you many options like early retirement and helping your kids out when they go to uni, get married etc. Obviously, you should try and pick something you are passionate about, but money should always be factored in.

Unfortunately, Law isnt what it once was in terms of salary. Back 20 or 30 years ago, the majority of lawyers were making excellent money. Nowadays, the over supply of graduates means that salaries have fallen. Whilst there are still high paying law jobs out there in law, quite a few lawyers dont make great money. However, if you are passionate about law (which you say you are) you should still pursue a career in it. Just be warned that the high paying jobs are extremely competitive, so you will need to do well in uni.

 

[Exemplify]

*Moved to law forums*

Look, salary is always going to be a consideration when choosing a career - saying that it isnt is being a bit naive. Having a high paying career doesnt just mean you can buy great cars and holidays, but it provides financial security which is very important if you want to start a family. In the long term having money gives you many options like early retirement and helping your kids out when they go to uni, get married etc. Obviously, you should try and pick something you are passionate about, but money should always be factored in.

Unfortunately, Law isnt what it once was in terms of salary. Back 20 or 30 years ago, the majority of lawyers were making excellent money. Nowadays, the over supply of graduates means that salaries have fallen. Whilst there are still high paying law jobs out there in law, quite a few lawyers dont make great money. However, if you are passionate about law (which you say you are) you should still pursue a career in it. Just be warned that the high paying jobs are extremely competitive, so you will need to do well in uni.

Thanks for moving it + info

I talked to a few people that are studying law and some of them said there just going to open up their own office. They say family law is the most profitable too.

 

[Azure]

Might also want to give this a go (though do take it with a grain of salt). I think there may be some mid tier salaries also floating around on that website.

Be warned that many lawyers (and many professionals for that matter) are working increasingly long hours. If you're the type to calculate your income on a per hour basis then you may end up bitterly disappointed with many law salaries.

 

[UNSW Law]

Hi Exemplify,

What you make will depend on many factors, and as with most university graduates, you probably won't be earning the big bucks in the first few years.

Having said that you should take a look at the Good Universities Guide 2012 which shows average graduate incomes. For UNSW Law, our graduates earn roughly $61, 456 after Law School while Sydney University is close behind at $55, 075.

Definitely do some more research based on the types of firms you might like to work in, and even the city will make a difference. As a lawyer you do have great earning potential in later years so don't be too put off if $35,000 feels a bit underwhelming at the moment. You could be a barrister, a law firm partner or indeed set up your own practice.

I hope this help!

Regards,

Katie Parkinson
Marketing Officer
UNSW Law

 

[Omnipotence]

Mallesons Stephen Jaques: 2011/2012 Package = $75,000
Freehills: 2011/2012 Package = $83,000
Allens Arthur Robinson: 2010/11 Package = $73,000
Clayton Utz: 2011/2012 Package = $73,000
Blake Dawson: 2011/2012 Package = $77,000

That's a lot of money.

 

[enoilgam]

Mallesons Stephen Jaques: 2011/2012 Package = $75,000
Freehills: 2011/2012 Package = $83,000
Allens Arthur Robinson: 2010/11 Package = $73,000
Clayton Utz: 2011/2012 Package = $73,000
Blake Dawson: 2011/2012 Package = $77,000

That's a lot of money.

True, but the competition for those grad positions is extremely high. Plus, the job itself is extremely demanding - the firm owns you. Also, the pressure to remain in those jobs is intense, because if you arent making the high standard or if you arent well liked by the partners, they will eventually push you out. So they have good grad salaries, but it is very very hard job. My mum works for one of those firms as a secretary and we are good friends with a person who was a grad lawyer and senior associate there for years and it is very intense.

 

[Azure]

Also keep in mind that those are the figures relating to the total package (superannuation and so forth are included).

 

[Omnidragon]

If setting yourself up early (ie prior to 30) and having sufficient passive income before 30 to have the ability to invest in land when you feel like it because it's a bargain and can make you a few hundred k in 6 months, running for politics because you desire to give back to society, buying your wife a $100k engagement ring at 26 etc is all important to you, then you're in the wrong industry and your 99+ ATAR/5 years in law school is probably the biggest waste of time I can possibly fathom.

If you're very risk-averse individual, have a passion for what some would consider menial and boring work and am happy to work in a PAYG salary role in return for paying off your Redfern/Brunswick $900k townhouse in 15 years (ie by the age of 38) and don't mind working til 9pm often and 1am sometimes and pulling the infrequent all-nighter, and buying your wife a $8k engagement ring at 34, then this is the industry to be in.

PS: the very high salary a previous poster quoted for the top tier law firms will no doubt set you up well down the path of Scenario 2.

My brief stint at one of these top-tier law firms one of previous posters mentioned (and of course I was on this apparently "very high" salary) ended with me leaving in less than 4 months, otherwise I'd probably still be paying off my Chaswood/Glen Waverley apartment.

Finally, OP, I'm not sure why you think these people are earning less than what they should be. The market works on supply and demand. If there's enough demand for their services, they'd be earning more.

 

[The Matrix]

Go to pirate pay and download The Lincoln Lawyer, you will realise that there are so many ways to make millions with a law degree!
It is an awesome movie BTW!

 

[iSplicer]

Don't go all crazy and think that I'm basing my career choice purely on the salary because that's not true at all. I have great passion for law but if I'm making less than a person at coles does, then I wont go at all. I'm not going to waste 5 years at uni, rack up a bunch of debt and have no job in a field that lawyers, in my opinion, are earning much less than they should.

There's nothing wrong even if it was.

And I think enoilgam nailed it. Law isn't what it used to be; but if you're one of the top then I'm sure you'll have no problem earning an acceptable amount.

 

[iSplicer]

If setting yourself up early (ie prior to 30) and having sufficient passive income before 30 to have the ability to invest in land when you feel like it because it's a bargain and can make you a few hundred k in 6 months, running for politics because you desire to give back to society, buying your wife a $100k engagement ring at 26 etc is all important to you, then you're in the wrong industry and your 99+ ATAR/5 years in law school is probably the biggest waste of time I can possibly fathom.

If you're very risk-averse individual, have a passion for what some would consider menial and boring work and am happy to work in a PAYG salary role in return for paying off your Redfern/Brunswick $900k townhouse in 15 years (ie by the age of 38) and don't mind working til 9pm often and 1am sometimes and pulling the infrequent all-nighter, and buying your wife a $8k engagement ring at 34, then this is the industry to be in.

PS: the very high salary a previous poster quoted for the top tier law firms will no doubt set you up well down the path of Scenario 2.

My brief stint at one of these top-tier law firms one of previous posters mentioned (and of course I was on this apparently "very high" salary) ended with me leaving in less than 4 months, otherwise I'd probably still be paying off my Chaswood/Glen Waverley apartment.

Finally, OP, I'm not sure why you think these people are earning less than what they should be. The market works on supply and demand. If there's enough demand for their services, they'd be earning more.

Excellent post. Thanks omni!

 

[RDX]

If setting yourself up early (ie prior to 30) and having sufficient passive income before 30 to have the ability to invest in land when you feel like it because it's a bargain and can make you a few hundred k in 6 months, running for politics because you desire to give back to society, buying your wife a $100k engagement ring at 26 etc is all important to you, then you're in the wrong industry and your 99+ ATAR/5 years in law school is probably the biggest waste of time I can possibly fathom.

If you're very risk-averse individual, have a passion for what some would consider menial and boring work and am happy to work in a PAYG salary role in return for paying off your Redfern/Brunswick $900k townhouse in 15 years (ie by the age of 38) and don't mind working til 9pm often and 1am sometimes and pulling the infrequent all-nighter, and buying your wife a $8k engagement ring at 34, then this is the industry to be in.

PS: the very high salary a previous poster quoted for the top tier law firms will no doubt set you up well down the path of Scenario 2.

My brief stint at one of these top-tier law firms one of previous posters mentioned (and of course I was on this apparently "very high" salary) ended with me leaving in less than 4 months, otherwise I'd probably still be paying off my Chaswood/Glen Waverley apartment.

Finally, OP, I'm not sure why you think these people are earning less than what they should be. The market works on supply and demand. If there's enough demand for their services, they'd be earning more.

Best post. I wish we still had rep.

 

[uniquee]

i think it's around 800k a year.

 

[seremify007]

Mallesons Stephen Jaques: 2011/2012 Package = $75,000
Freehills: 2011/2012 Package = $83,000
Allens Arthur Robinson: 2010/11 Package = $73,000
Clayton Utz: 2011/2012 Package = $73,000
Blake Dawson: 2011/2012 Package = $77,000

That's a lot of money.

Also worth mentioning;
a) Those are the top-tier law firms (i.e. the ones which most people aspire to)
b) The number of applicants to positions is definitely not in your favour
c) The quality of the other people all around Australia and internationally applying for those positions is also very high;- keep in mind everyone applying already has kickass academics (c'mon they got into law) so what used to be your competitive advantage becomes a lot less so
d) Salaries are definitely not on an upward trend this year from those who I've spoken to.

That all being said, $75k or so for your first year out of law school (i.e. approximately 24 years old) isn't bad... but you would definitely be way above this if you followed one of numerous other professions or trades at a similar age. To put things in perspective though, I did accounting in a big 4 firm and was above $75k on salary/bonus alone (i.e. not including investment income) several years earlier. In other words, law isn't going to be the job which gets you the big bucks straight away, nor is it an easy path- therefore, just like medicine, don't do it unless you actually have a passion for the field.

 

[seremify007]

Don't go all crazy and think that I'm basing my career choice purely on the salary because that's not true at all. I have great passion for law but if I'm making less than a person at coles does, then I wont go at all. I'm not going to waste 5 years at uni, rack up a bunch of debt and have no job in a field that lawyers, in my opinion, are earning much less than they should.

Depends on how you measure remuneration for comparison purposes. Depends on whether you are looking at it from a gross per annum basis and net of tax and HECS repayments, or for every hour you're physically working, or for every hour you're thinking about work/on-call/etc. The reality is your pals at Coles/Maccas/etc probably will earn more on an hourly basis with much less outside-of-work work-time (i.e. work stops when you finish your shift); but obviously you need to assign some kind of present value to your future income earning capacity.

 

[Omnipotence]

Also worth mentioning;
a) Those are the top-tier law firms (i.e. the ones which most people aspire to)
b) The number of applicants to positions is definitely not in your favour
c) The quality of the other people all around Australia and internationally applying for those positions is also very high;- keep in mind everyone applying already has kickass academics (c'mon they got into law) so what used to be your competitive advantage becomes a lot less so
d) Salaries are definitely not on an upward trend this year from those who I've spoken to.

That all being said, $75k or so for your first year out of law school (i.e. approximately 24 years old) isn't bad... but you would definitely be way above this if you followed one of numerous other professions or trades at a similar age. To put things in perspective though, I did accounting in a big 4 firm and was above $75k on salary/bonus alone (i.e. not including investment income) several years earlier. In other words, law isn't going to be the job which gets you the big bucks straight away, nor is it an easy path- therefore, just like medicine, don't do it unless you actually have a passion for the field.

Yep

 

[Newbie]

75k is probably the bare minimum:

tax man takes 1/3
rent 20k
day to day expenses 15k
holidays/random stuff 15k

= zero

im not sure if this means australian living is overpriced or law is underpaying

 

[Azure]

75k is probably the bare minimum:

tax man takes 1/3
rent 20k
day to day expenses 15k
holidays/random stuff 15k

= zero

im not sure if this means australian living is overpriced or law is underpaying

Probably both to be honest. Australia is becoming ridiculously expensive all around.