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More ancient movies (1 Viewer)

Lundy

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Um, the King Arthur movie has already been filmed and is due for release soon. The trailer is out.
 

cayte

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Originally posted by charmed_cuties
2 b honest, Troy wasn't really that good, coz it doesn't really go according to the myth and also the basis of the Iliad, there was 2 much focus on Brad Pitt's character, and the war was 10years and Hollywood produced a 2 weeks or couple of months war that didn't seem to weave in the historical/mythical basis of it
Wow, how insightful, I don't think anyone's mentioned any of that yet. :p (Just jokes, sorry).
 

Trigger189

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get over it. read this:

In Defense of "Troy"
By CHLOE COCKBURN

Troy has gotten a lot of flak over the past few days. Much of the opposition to this film seems to stem from a misunderstanding of the purposes and mechanisms of the Iliad. It is unclear exactly how many critics have actually read Homer, but it seems clear that the number who have picked up the book since high school sits perilously close to zero. Yes, there are problems with the movie (the drabness of queen Helen, for one). But (perhaps despite itself), it gets a lot of things right.

For one thing, Brad Pitt makes a great Achilles. As a sex symbol and hero of Fight Club, Pitt is the right man to play the great lover/warrior of ancient lore. The Achilles of Homer was not 'noble' in any sense of the word as we currently define it. His character is petulant and childish, unwilling to yield to any authority other than his own glory. In Homer, when Agamemnon snatches away Briseis and refuses to honor Achilles, the mighty warrior goes down to the beach and cries to his mother. What would Rambo say?

There have been complaints about Achilles' constant refrain that men must do great deeds so that their names will be remembered. Those familiar with the text of the Iliad will recognize this not as a screenwriter's defect, but a rather good rendition of the Greek epic style. The Greeks idea of the afterlife involved a lot of shades moping about in Hades, a far throw from the fluffy clouds of our imaginations. So if you want any part of you to survive the mortal coil, it is rather essential to make sure that everyone remembers, and, crucially, speaks your name. Breath gives life and so on.

Given that the epic was originally sung over the span of several days in front of a hall of drunken chieftains, the endless repetition of key points is not surprising.. Music, not literature, is the paradigm with which to approach this <genre.Pop> music in particular is a good place to start. Once you look at it that way, the snobbish denunciations of Troy start to look a bit silly. In their haste to demand a more faithful rendition of the text of Homer, they have forgotten that the Iliad was not the product of one man's labor, but rather the result of a long oral tradition whose chief aim was to entertain. Epic is not a highbrow genre.

What the critics do remember from English class is that Homer had gods, whereas divine squabblings are conspicuously absent from Peterson's revival of the epic (I am thankful to have been spared an inevitably painful rendition of life on Olympus). The influence of the supernatural in Troy is left to be constructed by mortals, particularly Trojan mortals, who die by the thousands thanks to Priam's chief soothsayer's miscalculations of Apollo's will. This seems to be a clear bid for the separation of church and state. When your best fighter (Hector) says, it's not a good time to attack, perhaps you should pay heed. Rumsfeld and Bush beware.

There is a strong case to be made for seeing the gods as projections of human intention. In the Greek vision of the world, any time someone has an urge or idea, a god has put it there. A vestige of this concept survives in English, as the word 'inspire' means 'to breathe in', meaning, 'to be taken hold of by the spirit of the god who compels an action'. A vision of the world without gods calls for personal responsibility for action, a welcome concept in a 'they made me do it' political climate.

In Troy, a great city falls at the hands of men, not gods. We see that even a noble army defending its homeland can lose against an invasion. And interestingly, while Agamemnon gets his comeuppance at the end of the film (a scene to make classicists cringe), Odysseus does not. Who is to blame for the mayhem? The king who ordered it, or the brilliant mind who found a way? Power does not work without instruments.

As any good translator knows, a literal interpretation is unlikely to succeed in viscerally affecting its audience. Peterson has made many changes to the story that critics have called significant. However, anyone with a thorough understanding of the Iliad can see that those changes have not destroyed the substance of the epic, but rather have preserved the story's ability to communicate with a modern audience.
 

tina_goes_doo

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After we did Celtic society in yr 11 (bog bodies), everyone (ie. me me me!!) has a weird obsession with...*gasp!*

THE WICKER MAN!
 

Lundy

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Originally posted by tina_goes_doo
After we did Celtic society in yr 11 (bog bodies), everyone (ie. me me me!!) has a weird obsession with...*gasp!*

THE WICKER MAN!
The movie? That was so bizarre. The ending was particularly disturbing and fucked up. Those crazy pagans.
 

Persephone87

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Originally posted by Enlightened_One
they've began work on one called 300 Spartans, which I assume is about Thermopalyae (I do believe I spelt it wrong).

What do you think, are they going overboard?
It must be a remake cause I watched that movie in ancient and it was made 40-50 yrs ago
 

trekkie

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Yes history is being expolited just a wee bit by hollywood, Mel Gibson is beginning work on a film about Boudicca, plus there are two other Boudicca movies almost ready to be released. As for Troy, dont get me started on that, there were that many bits taken from the Illiad that had been twisted beyond the sight of truth it wasnt funny, apart from the historical inaccuracies it was a good movie though
 

charmed_cuties

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i believe that Troy was not exactly based on the iliad and i'm speculating abt the fact that there is really no basis of what we noe abt the myth that we come to associate with
well i'm doing the myth and historical accuracy of the Trojan War, and after watching troy i thought it was crap that i literally got bored thru the whole movie

we must continually ask when and how can historical accuracy become a distortion of the Hollywood minds to fit in Brad Pitt as the protagonist
can we ever rely on Hollywood producers and directors to create a film free from distortions, manipulation and pure exaggeration?
well i believe that is practically impossible
we have become to much of a visual society that we suddenly ignore the values of going back to the original source and rely on easier and alternative methods to gain insight or tune into something that is considered cool or "in"
 

cayte

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Trigger, Cockburn's soapbox spiel is not a definitive truth about the worth of the film, it's simply another opinion and it completely fails to address the fact that the bloody thing was so light-on in the what-makes-a-truly-great-film department that, even without any regard for the plot manipulations, it isn't a particularly wonderful film. As a representation of history it fails, which was to be expected. As a good, solid, inspiring, moving film it fails, which is disappointing.
You mistake the coherency and apparent logic of Cockburn's argument for "truth" and "correctness". We are all entitled to our opinions. We are also entitled to disagree. Debate should be encouraged, not suppressed.
 

Trigger189

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I wasnt presenting it as fact. I havent even studied Troy. My point was just stop bitchin and moaning about it and heres an article I found that defends it.... Please dont supress me!
 

Arnor

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umm gladiator? if u know anything about rome you know its completely fake... they just threw in some personalities from that time to amke it look pretty...

movies are bad ways to study too inaccurate and dramatised (though herodutus does do the same thing) atleast u can pick out his lies...

(sigh) my skool never takes us on excursions think we went once 2 the museum at syd uni... were the first people to see these mummies be unveiled ;) was cool they ahd emm brought out for the first time since they arrived like 20 years ago while we were there
 

Enlightened_One

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Originally posted by Arnor
umm gladiator? if u know anything about rome you know its completely fake... they just threw in some personalities from that time to amke it look pretty...

movies are bad ways to study too inaccurate and dramatised (though herodutus does do the same thing) atleast u can pick out his lies...

(sigh) my skool never takes us on excursions think we went once 2 the museum at syd uni... were the first people to see these mummies be unveiled ;) was cool they ahd emm brought out for the first time since they arrived like 20 years ago while we were there

Gladiator was for the most part a bunch of different things brought together that shouldn't have been, but we studied as a comparison in class, and certain elements of it were true.

Troy though, was way of the mark, especially considering all the info they could have gathered on it.
 

misery

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The more movies they make, the more ancient history excursions to the cinema, right? :p
 

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