school sending in lots of tied ranks...implications? (1 Viewer)

[ipod21]

Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

We finally got all our internal ranks for all subjects now.

For visual arts, me and 2 other people are tied second.

How does this work? I've heard that usually they will send in individual ranks (and refer to class marks or what ever to differentiate) but however my teacher has decided to send in 3 of us on the same internal rank.

What does this mean? (like what are the implications and how does it work in terms of HSC and Internal Marks). Ive heard sending in equal ranks is bad as they will average the tied people's exams mark for the asessment mark...?? (so if my friend tied with me stuffs up his exam, it will drag me down?)

thanks

 

[cem]

Re: Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

We finally got all our internal ranks for all subjects now.

For religion, me and 2 other people are tied second.

How does this work? I've heard that usually they will send in individual ranks (and refer to class marks or what ever to differentiate) but however my teacher has decided to send in 3 of us on the same internal rank.

What does this mean? (like what are the implications and how does it work in terms of HSC and Internal Marks). Ive heard sending in equal ranks is bad as they will average the tied people's exams mark for the asessment mark...?? (so if my friend tied with me stuffs up his exam, it will drag me down?)

thanks

You keep your own external mark.

When they allocate the second highest moderated mark, which may or may not be the same as any of the exam marks earned they will take into account the three people being equal and you will get the same moderated assessment mark.

Last year I sent in my top two students as equal firsts. We did look at separating them - but with 1/15 of one mark we decided that it was just too narrow and I couldn't separate them anyway. They got the average of the top two external marks for their moderated internal mark.

 

[ipod21]

Re: Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

You keep your own external mark.

When they allocate the second highest moderated mark, which may or may not be the same as any of the exam marks earned they will take into account the three people being equal and you will get the same moderated assessment mark.

Last year I sent in my top two students as equal firsts. We did look at separating them - but with 1/15 of one mark we decided that it was just too narrow and I couldn't separate them anyway. They got the average of the top two external marks for their moderated internal mark.

So if I understand what you are saying correctly, all three of us will recieve the same moderated mark.

So, my moderated internal mark will be based upon an average of the three-external marks (i.e of the three tied on second)? That sounds pretty crap because if one of us three "has a bad exam" it will pull all three of us down...

 

[cem]

Re: Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

So if I understand what you are saying correctly, all three of us will recieve the same moderated mark.

So, my moderated internal mark will be based upon an average of the three-external marks (i.e of the three tied on second)? That sounds pretty crap because if one of us three "has a bad exam" it will pull all three of us down...

You keep your own exam mark.

After that the marks will have very little to do with exactly what the three of you get in the exam except that the better the cohort goes the better you will go.

The top exam mark will become the top moderated mark.

The bottom exam mark will become the bottom moderated mark.

After that they add the total number of marks earned by your cohort and award the same number of marks to your cohort as the assessment marks.

They don't simply add up the 2nd 3rd and 4th exam marks and average them to get your assessment mark. They will allocate you a mark that keeps the relative gap the same between you and first and you and fifth and the three of you will get the same.

If one of you gets a bad exam mark then they will keep that exam mark for themselves but they have earned the same assessment mark as you through the work they have done in class and so will get it. However, if they are as bad as you say then you will beat them in the overall scheme of things.

 

[ipod21]

Re: Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

thanks

 

[simonloo]

Re: Tied final internal ranks... how does that work?

cem- so is it bad to tie first? or is it an advanatge you would say? or overall negligible?

 

[ipod21]

thanks

ok thanks cem, i confirmed what you said with my teachers.

 

[ipod21]

school sending in lots of tied ranks... good or bad?

so we all got all our ranks and stuff and for all my subjects i am on a tied ranking. and from looking at what my friends have and such, the school hasnt bothered to seperate people at all and tied ranks are everywhere from 1st place to 50th place (so its not just constricted to a certain band).

i know some schools seperate their students at all costs to send in non-shared ranks....

so what are the implications.. benefits? dis-advantage?

thanks

 

[ipod21]

Re: school sending in lots of tied ranks... good or bad?

my bad, posted in wrong section :jaw:

 

[munchiecrunchie]

Re: school sending in lots of tied ranks... good or bad?

for equal first, the implication is that both of those people will get an average of the top 2 hsc assessment marks attained by the school. That would kinda suck for the person who gets their mark dragged down (if there is a substantial difference in marks)

 

[cem]

Re: school sending in lots of tied ranks... good or bad?

for equal first, the implication is that both of those people will get an average of the top 2 hsc assessment marks attained by the school. That would kinda suck for the person who gets their mark dragged down (if there is a substantial difference in marks)

This happened to me last year with my top two students. One didn't do as well as expected in the exam (actually came about 5th on the exam). The top exam mark was 92 and 2nd 87 so they both got 89 for their assessment mark. NB neither of the top students actually got the top exam mark so weren't really pulled down but is it fair to ask a teacher to nominate a 'best' student when the assessment tasks across the entire year have them not able to separate them. What is the criteria that a teacher could use, remembering that they can't use anything other than the assessment tasks? They can't suddenly change the weightings or add an extra task - so what is the solution.

I always send in the raw marks my kids get and if that means that there are ties so be it.

 

[erm]

can't you look at their percentages to, say, two decimals? Then you would be able to separate them (unless in the very unlikely chance that they both get the exact same marks in every assessment).

 

[cem]

can't you look at their percentages to, say, two decimals? Then you would be able to separate them (unless in the very unlikely chance that they both get the exact same marks in every assessment).

We had to go to three decimal places to separate them. At the minute difference that makes we don't believe that any person can be that accurate in their assessment as to separate students to that degree of accuracy.

The school asked me to nominate who I thought was the better student and I told them who I thought but the marks are all that we can use. Had we gone with my gut feeling the other student could have appealed and the BOS would have upheld that student.