We're All a Bunch of Whiners! (1 Viewer)

[dhampoet]

*There is such a jump between yr 7-10 and Yr 11/12 studies that it seems unreasonable to expect so much of students in so short a time. Often, little is truly learnt in Yr 11, and students spent most of their time getting over the shock of the sheer depth and size of content they have to cover.

I agree,it's such a big jump
In another country,especially Asia,in year 7 they get the 3 first chapter of maths 2 unit in year 11 already and learn it like hell so they UNDERSTAND the topic by heart

 

[Bookie]

IQ test.

then I could be spared of dumbasses.

 

[Ultraviolent]

The problem with many HSC subjects is that they can be rote learnt. I reckon science subjects are quite easy to memorise. The unfortunate thing is that at uni, you actually have to understand the concepts taught to you. Many questions in the HSC are directly from the syllabus, and many textbooks (eg. Excel physics) provide students with information following extremely closely with the syllabus (including the dot points that require students to do their own research). I must admit that the textbook is great,, but it doesn't give students the opportunity to research themselves, which is sometimes necessary at uni.

I think it's wrong how in a lot of subjects, it isn't about demonstrating understanding or really knowing the course content, more memorising the textbook and reciting it in the exam.

This is also perhaps my main complaint. It seems to me that, in practice, quite a few of the courses actually discourage any real thinking. Instead, a program of mindless memorising and pseudo-intellectualism exists. I couldn't stand chemisty because any attempt to actually understand the content we were learning was met with "you don't need to know that". It may very well have only been my school, but they were basically saying "here, go learn these isolated facts".

Advanced English was another subject I loathed. The whole year was filled with teachers constantly repeating that one had to "play the game". Arrrrgh, just thinking it about now... They would tell you what the markers wanted to hear, what hoops you had to jump through, and then expected you to do exactly that. When I started comparative literature (a Distinction Course) this year (oh, if this dosn't quite make sense, I did half my HSC last year) it was a completely different experience. So much so that it was somewhat frightening. The lecturers would say "here's your essay, go do it". "What? Aren't you going to hold my hand while I do it?" "No, it's your essay."

Comparative Literature has been great. It really is what I wish the rest of the HSC was like. You, as an individual, are completely free to create whatever thesis you want and to go wherever the course takes you (I've even mentioned the psychologist Carl Jung in an assessment or two). Looking at its past HSC exams in an attempt to prepare for mine in a few weeks, they are utterly daunting. The papers are not predictable like the Advanced English ones, every question requires you to think on your feet and come up with your own thesis at the time, and the questions are challenging (extension history also makes you think on your feet but it's not quite there). Two of the three sections even let you choose from a set of five or six questions. I know it's going to be hard and I'm scared but I wouldn't have it any other way.

Perhaps I'm being idealistic and impractical (it's certainly easier in this sense to manage 9 students rather than a whole state), but I would prefer it if the whole HSC was like this; not so much about rote-learning and more to do with creatively thinking.

 

[Bookie]

what he said.

DC's for the win.

 

[Ultraviolent]

what he said.

DC's for the win.

:heart:

But dude, comp lit > cosmo

 

[Bookie]

ohhaigraham/

and is it? seeing as youve not studied cosmo, and ive not done comp. lit, perhaps it is a stupid argument. of course, you could analyse both and compare them, while i might see to both subjects' significance to the overall state of the universe, and in the end I think we shall only reach one conclusion.

Philisophy's for wankers.

 

[Ultraviolent]

Well said.

Basically I was headed towards your conclusion anyway

Dude, I watched the video in your sig. It was great. I'll have to get Reis to perform a rendition for me one day.

 

[Bookie]

yes, like you said in the other thread THAT performance was all andrew.

but you should see me when i dont study. im either masturbating or nsyncing. ive mastered 'its gonna be me' as nsync has. the one we did at the talent quest wasnt exact to nsync also, i have learnt 'bye bye bye' on my own.

but im sure andrew will be good for a one on one show with you

 

[Ultraviolent]

You didn't acknowledge in the other thread; fuck you. I thus felt the need to say something for a second time.

Lol, if that's all you're doing, I don't think I want to SEE you... Drew on the other hand, I'd definitely see him. And if he has feelings for me as you seem to be indicating...

LOL THREAD HIJACK AMIRITE

edit: i am so rite

 

[karoooh]

Posting after skimming through thread.

I agree that the UAI shouldn't be the only way into uni and that waiting a year to get is a bit unfair. But otherwise, there mostly isn't anything wrong with the way the HSC is at moment. I think we should have some course that teaches about grammar/the language of English alongside with what we have alreafy, instead of the AOS section.

I don't really think it was that big a jump from the junior school and senior school though, cos my English class were made to study Post-Colonialism (Jane Eyre and Wide Sargasso Sea), criticise Macbeth like we would've in Module B, analyse Bladerunner and other texts through ALOT of essay writing and the like, just as we do now.

I know we weren't really meant to study some of the texts, but the teachers didn't care, my class didn't mind it cos we found it interesting and 'apparently', we weren't going to study those texts in Yr 11/12 anyway, which we didn't, so it doesn't matter.

I don't know why some people find it a big transition though, because in English during Yr 7-10, weren't we just mainly analysing texts, writing essays, interviews and the like anyway?

 

[ElendilPeredhil]

IQ test.

then I could be spared of dumbasses.

what's your I.Q?

 

[Bookie]

150-160 on most internet tests.

which i think is about 130 in real life.

 

[ElendilPeredhil]

That's pretty good...I mean internet tests are pretty unreliable but still, that's good.
Actually whilst your sugestion of I.Q tests instead wouldn't bother me because mine's high enough to get into uni that way, I don't think that they are conclusive enough...not that the HSC is much better...but a person with an I.Q of, say, 120 would not be significantly smarter than someone with an I.Q of 118, or 119. Unless you are talking about taking only the top,so to speak, only those with I.Q's of 120 and above...I don't really know.

 

[Barbarossa]

I definitely think there should be a unit on basic English skills. Sooooo many students on here don't have a clue; they're unable to use basic grammar, spelling, or even the right words.

totally agree, i struggle to remember basic rules assocoaited with verbs pronouns adjectives etc i can write english fine though but why dont we just skip the crap of journeys and get back to the basics. i think you realise how dodgy we are taught english when you start to learn another language or watch other people learn english. i've been corrected on my grammar by frenchies learning english!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[Bookie]

totally agree, i struggle to remember basic rules assocoaited with verbs pronouns adjectives etc i can write english fine though but why dont we just skip the crap of journeys and get back to the basics. i think you realise how dodgy we are taught english when you start to learn another language or watch other people learn english. i've been corrected on my grammar by frenchies learning english!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

yes. why dont we.

That's pretty good...I mean internet tests are pretty unreliable but still, that's good.
Actually whilst your sugestion of I.Q tests instead wouldn't bother me because mine's high enough to get into uni that way, I don't think that they are conclusive enough...not that the HSC is much better...but a person with an I.Q of, say, 120 would not be significantly smarter than someone with an I.Q of 118, or 119. Unless you are talking about taking only the top,so to speak, only those with I.Q's of 120 and above...I don't really know.

Well the initial suggestion of IQ tests is very harsh. A lot of guys with high IQs turn out to be massive dickheads, and thats not what you want your doctor to be.

But I think for the novelty of it they should still single out smarts from the dumbs.

HSCs fine. I've not done any study and I will get around 95, while some kid who has worked their ass off all year might get 90. It works out well. Those intelligent still get what they deserve. It's oppurtunity cost. I mean, I couldve done work and not missed a term and possibly pushed for a 99. But I didnt do anything () and I also missed a term of school, yet to due my awesomeness, I'll get a fairly decent UAI [thanks also to the school which I attend] - so I'll get what I deserve

on another matter, do you like tolkien?

 

[alcalder]

I wouldn't say whiners, I would just say discussing the issues that are pertinent. From the perspective of someone who did the HSC some years back (under the older system) and is now teaching the newer system, I think there are pluses and minuses.

My year through was one of the first to have assessment included as part of the HSC mark. Previous to that there was just the exam and the exam encompassed everything covered over the two senior years - Years 11 and 12 (except maybe in English but I could be wrong). So, if you fluffed that final exam you were completely stuffed. At least with the introduction of assessments we were able to demonstrate consistent ability over those two years and if we made a big blunder in the final exam the examers would know something was wrong. It could also pinpoint those who were cheating (because poor consistent performance in assessments that suddenly became outstanding in the HSC exam is very suspect).

The big jump from Year 10 to Year 11 is more indicative of the teaching methods at the school. The progression should be smooth, not a jump. The teaching style and work load should ramp up to Year 11 not jump.

I agree there is poor English grammar being taught, but then again I learnt my English grammar by studying another language. Perhaps that should be compulsory through to Year 10?

There has to be some way to determine Uni entry. The US uses the SAT system (IQ, basically) and Australia uses the UAI (or equivalent in other states). Imagine having to interview the thousands of students wanting to enter. Some unis are doing this for Medicine. There could be an application process but again, it would need a lot of time to read and assess those applications (and another stress on top of doing the final year exams).

Keep the discussion going, guys. It's very interesting. Love it.

 

[Ennaybur]

yes. why dont we.



Well the initial suggestion of IQ tests is very harsh. A lot of guys with high IQs turn out to be massive dickheads, and thats not what you want your doctor to be.

But I think for the novelty of it they should still single out smarts from the dumbs.

HSCs fine. I've not done any study and I will get around 95, while some kid who has worked their ass off all year might get 90. It works out well. Those intelligent still get what they deserve. It's oppurtunity cost. I mean, I couldve done work and not missed a term and possibly pushed for a 99. But I didnt do anything () and I also missed a term of school, yet to due my awesomeness, I'll get a fairly decent UAI [thanks also to the school which I attend] - so I'll get what I deserve

on another matter, do you like tolkien?

egh! i do bookie!

hai bookie!

 

[Bookie]

hi woobian

that's cool

 

[B35tY]

The thing i find funny is that to succeed in English, i find my writing becoming more and more verbose. The thing is, it gets to the point where i'm making up words to do better in English!

 

[ElendilPeredhil]

on another matter, do you like tolkien?

Yes I love tolkien! I think the man was a genius. I like the Lord of the Rings better than The Hobbit and the Simarillion was interesting- as a history book.
Christopher Tolkien unfortunately wouldn't know a good read if it crawled up his arse and died...

yes. why dont we.
...
Well the initial suggestion of IQ tests is very harsh. A lot of guys with high IQs turn out to be massive dickheads, and thats not what you want your doctor to be.

But I think for the novelty of it they should still single out smarts from the dumbs.

Yes I think that is the argument, that IQ doesn't determine how well suited you are to the work, just that you would probably be capable of it.

Lol what a world it would be, if BOS was full of Alpha's and the masses were Beta's and Gamma's...and the guy who cleaned tables at Macdonalds was an Epsilon.