Where do you stand? (4 Viewers)

[luscious-llama]

Economic Left/Right: -6.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.18

quite left and slightly libertarian

 

[leetom]

I don't know what people complain about in regard to an apparent lack of Labor policy. If passed, Kim has promised to "rip up" the workplace reforms proposed by the Government. Doesn't cut any more clear-fucking-cut than that.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

The problem is that while he's announcing policy everyone else is mesmerised by the blubber that's giggling just above his waist.

 

[Rafy]

Well seems i still lie in the center.

Economic Left/Right: 0.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.23

(proudly contributing to a wet liberal party)

 

[Capitalist Pig]

Well seems i still lie in the center.

Economic Left/Right: 0.00
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.23

(proudly contributing to a wet liberal party)

Wet libs are more determined on their stance on social issues (eg pro safe injecting rooms, affirmative action etc) than by their economics, as far as i can see anyway.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Wet libs are more determined on their stance on social issues (eg pro "safe" injecting rooms) than by their economics, as far as i can see anyway.

malcolm turnbull?

 

[Capitalist Pig]

I'm not sure of his position on those issues, but I was referring to what I've seen in the Young Libs.

 

[erawamai]

I think the grown up liberals are more concerned about their economic policy. Everything else is populist.

I don't think many young libs actually grasp what the Liberal party is about. I assume that most young liberals usually pretty redneck, as they would join more out a sense of identity with the conservative values Howard uses. Which is a bit of a danger for the future of the party. The Liberals today are a party of dry economics and realism when it comes to international relations. I don't think many young liberals understand that. The only ones to actually make it somewhere in the Liberal party are those with a determined dry streak in them.

The interesting thing is that most people in Australia would sit the political compass test and come out on the left. The point being that in reality Australian isn't really in tune with the actualy policies of the Liberal party. Australians are more glued to the rhetoric of the Liberal party. Be it dole bludgers, muslims, boat people, tax cuts for ordinary people (I'm an ordinary person!) etc...

Much like many don't grasp what its like to be young Labor. I have the feeling that many young labor kiddies are more concerned with raging against authority than slightly less saveagr neoliberal policy.

 

[chubbaraff]

I don't know what people complain about in regard to an apparent lack of Labor policy. If passed, Kim has promised to "rip up" the workplace reforms proposed by the Government. Doesn't cut any more clear-fucking-cut than that.

Ill give you an example, when John Howard announced spy planes off the north west shelf, Kym Beazley came on lateline he said, why dont they have guns to shoot terrorists attached to the planes. Yet he is supposed to represent many social democratics who find this concept violent and xenophobic. Its clear he is an opportunist trying to impress business, and clearly screwing the working class, who have lost patience with him. By the way, I attribute his latest rhetoric as stolen from Green Left Weekly and the anti-union campaign raged in New Zealand after their reforms, Kill the Bill and Bad Laws need to be broken are two such examples.

 

[_dhj_]

Hmm I hate these political compasses..

but anyway.. here's me

Your political compass
Economic Left/Right: -7.13
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -4.41

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Ill give you an example, when John Howard announced spy planes off the north west shelf, Kym Beazley came on lateline he said, why dont they have guns to shoot terrorists attached to the planes. Yet he is supposed to represent many social democratics who find this concept violent and xenophobic. Its clear he is an opportunist trying to impress business, and clearly screwing the working class, who have lost patience with him. By the way, I attribute his latest rhetoric as stolen from Green Left Weekly and the anti-union campaign raged in New Zealand after their reforms, Kill the Bill and Bad Laws need to be broken are two such examples.

I agree with you that in both young libs and young labor they stand for different causes than their senior parties do. At the same time I think it's wrong to claim because everyone turns out left on the poorly designed political compass, that most Australians would be left.

The political compass has the following problems....
- It only allows 4 possible answers, with no neutral.

- In reality political issues can be much more complex than the questions it poses to people, although when presented with a question about their values in a very simple form they may sit firmly on the left. However when it comes to a situation where you would apply this value to a real-life circumstance, people may shift all over the place.

- The questions it poses are often conflicting, i.e. "Unemployment is more important than low inflation", while many people I'm sure will pick unemployment because it is of course the nicer sounding thing, when you sit down and think about it, apply economic reasoning, it is basically the same thing.

 

[MoonlightSonata]

Yes I think that the compass test does shift a lot of people to the left from where they would ordinarily be.

As you say there will be some people, a lot of people, who when faced with making/supporting real-life, specific policy issues would alter their stance. Not all mind you, but a significant number. It is easy to approve of broad statements.

(Though some are specific enough, such as abortion, etc.)

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I agree with you that in both young libs and young labor they stand for different causes than their senior parties do. At the same time I think it's wrong to claim because everyone turns out left on the poorly designed political compass, that most Australians would be left.

The political compass has the following problems....
- It only allows 4 possible answers, with no neutral.

- In reality political issues can be much more complex than the questions it poses to people, although when presented with a question about their values in a very simple form they may sit firmly on the left. However when it comes to a situation where you would apply this value to a real-life circumstance, people may shift all over the place.

- The questions it poses are often conflicting, i.e. "Unemployment is more important than low inflation", while many people I'm sure will pick unemployment because it is of course the nicer sounding thing, when you sit down and think about it, apply economic reasoning, it is basically the same thing.

That has to be the poorest written post ever.

 

[MoonlightSonata]

That has to be the poorest written post ever.

lol following the government and providing your own opposition now?

 

[Not-That-Bright]

lol following the government and providing your own opposition now?

Now that we hold a majority in the house of BOS there is no need for debate.

 

[Capitalist Pig]

I think the grown up liberals are more concerned about their economic policy. Everything else is populist.

I don't think many young libs actually grasp what the Liberal party is about. I assume that most young liberals usually pretty redneck, as they would join more out a sense of identity with the conservative values Howard uses. Which is a bit of a danger for the future of the party. The Liberals today are a party of dry economics and realism when it comes to international relations. I don't think many young liberals understand that. The only ones to actually make it somewhere in the Liberal party are those with a determined dry streak in them.

The interesting thing is that most people in Australia would sit the political compass test and come out on the left. The point being that in reality Australian isn't really in tune with the actualy policies of the Liberal party. Australians are more glued to the rhetoric of the Liberal party. Be it dole bludgers, muslims, boat people, tax cuts for ordinary people (I'm an ordinary person!) etc...

Much like many don't grasp what its like to be young Labor. I have the feeling that many young labor kiddies are more concerned with raging against authority than slightly less saveagr neoliberal policy.

I agree, I've found the party to have way too many people concerned only with conservative social policies and absolutely no idea what a free market is :/

 

[loquasagacious]

"Unemployment is more important than low inflation", while many people I'm sure will pick unemployment because it is of course the nicer sounding thing, when you sit down and think about it, apply economic reasoning, it is basically the same thing.

In the interests of providing an opposition and making our BoSocracy worthwhile:

Inflation and Unemployment are not the same thing. In fact they are more like opposites. An economy with high employment will have high inflation and economy with high unemployment may infact have deflation.

The control of both inflation and employment are two of the key goals of any government however the left and the right tackle them in a different order. To the left it is generally preferable to maintain full employment even if it is inflationary though to the right it can be a worthwhile to sacrifice some jobs to rein in inflation.

 

[transcendent]

i have a preference for getting rid of inflation. it's an unjustified reason though.

 

[Arbeit~!]

haha i don't support female repression...just their status within church infrastructure (shuts self up) but yeah the religious conservatism and support for private schools may have given it away.

btw thanks generator.

I agree..........

 

[leetom]

Ill give you an example, when John Howard announced spy planes off the north west shelf, Kym Beazley came on lateline he said, why dont they have guns to shoot terrorists attached to the planes. Yet he is supposed to represent many social democratics who find this concept violent and xenophobic. Its clear he is an opportunist trying to impress business, and clearly screwing the working class, who have lost patience with him. By the way, I attribute his latest rhetoric as stolen from Green Left Weekly and the anti-union campaign raged in New Zealand after their reforms, Kill the Bill and Bad Laws need to be broken are two such examples.

No politician of any standing reads Green Left Weekly. GLW, like the ALP, is opposed to WorkChoices and you can expect statements from both organisations to be similar (only I imagine GLW makes use words like 'solidarity' and 'comrades' whereas the dictum of the ALP isn't imported from Soviet Russia).

You may not like it, but to be fit for election in this country it is necessary for a party to forge strong links with the business community. Your unquestioning adherence to socialism prevents you from realising that a nation's prosperity is brought about through private enterprise. It is necessary then, for the sake of winning the election in two years as well as continued economic success, for Beazley to present an ALP that can cater to the requirements of the business community (provided those requirements do not include mass-AWAs).

I myself see no clear evidence as to how Beazley is 'clearly screwing the working class.' He's not in a position to be actively screwing them. As I see it, the ALP is all the working class has got.

National security is perceived to be Liberal stronghold. The ALP needs to convince the masses that it is equally capable of protecting the nation, but being in opposition its options are limited to making bold statements, such as the guns on planes one. (I don't know how you came to conclude that such armaments would be xenophobic. I'll admit the practicality of them can perhaps be questioned, but xenophobic?).