Yasser Arafat dies in Paris hospital; age 75. (3 Viewers)

[Bone577]

He denounced them WAY too late after he signed the oslo accord...

Oh sorry, i mixed the Oslo Accords with the Camp David Summit of 2000

Ooops.



Ok again Hamas has moral grounds though resolutions 3314 and 3013 in 1974.
I am not saying i support it, but even not denouncing it at all can be justified by the resolutions.

The fact that he denounced it at all is alarming.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

*bashes head against wall*

1. palestinian group resisting israeli occupation
2. president of israel
3 president of france
4. read up on it lazy..........uve been give the link

1: Palestinian political Party
2: Isreali PRIME MINISTER
3: wow you got one.
4: yea i can't be bothered giving a description either..

 

[joujou_84]

1: Palestinian political Party
2: Isreali PRIME MINISTER
3: wow you got one.
4: yea i can't be bothered giving a description either..

ahhhhhhh its all the same

 

[hiphophorray123]

'that Israel would continue in efforts to reach a peace deal with the Palestinians. '

yeah wat an effort they have been putting in

 

[tWiStEdD]

i have a question

whats a:

1. PLO
2.Sharon
3.Chirac
4.UN Security Counsel Resolution 242

1. Palestinian Liberation Organistion. EST 1964 (?). The only political force that the Palestinians have.

2. Ariel Sharon. Prime minister of Israel. Fought in the Yom Kippur War of 1974 and was badly wounded. Led the Israeli army during the invasion of Lebanon in 1982. Has much hate for the Arabs and little time for the Palestinian question.

3. Jaques Chirac, President of France.

4. UN Security counsel resolution 242 tells Israel to get out of the occupied terrortories of the Gaza straight and the West Bank, as they had occupied them after the 6 day war of 1964.
Israeli government said "blow that"
palestinians get cut and remain so.
now these regions are 'autonomous', but are still occupied by the israeli military and governed by the israeli government.

 

[Bone577]

The Palestinian question extends back into biblical times and before it.

The Muslim fathers had it most recently.
The Jewish fathers had it first (we're talking ages ago and for thousands of years)

Each claim side claims God gave it to them, each side is so totally entrenched in religion that the policies reflect the religious beliefs.

The rock throwing that dark_angel questions is a direct result of pent up Palestinian anger over their displacement and the lack of representation politically. The first Intefadah (1987) was a result of the death of a Palestinian boy at the funeral of a man who was killed by a Jew driving a truck.
The chaos continues.... it would take a long time for any of you to truly understand the causes and the effects of the issue.

Arafat is basically the only leader that the Palestinians have ever had. I do not doubt that these will be times worth watching, but I highly reccomend that NONE of you judge what is happening without knowing what it is that is causing it all.

That is incredibly condascending. Israel has no claim over the land, you should know that, i know that, even the fucken father of Israeli himself knows that:

"Why should the Arabs make peace? If I were an Arab leader, I would never make terms with Israel. That is natural: we have taken their country. Sure, God promised it to us, but what does that matter to them? There has been anti-Semitism, the Nazis, Hitler, Auschwitz, but was that their fault? They only see one thing: we came here and stole their country. Why should they accept that?

David Ben-Gurion quoted in
"The Jewish Paradox"by Nahum Goldmann,
former president of the World Jewish Congress.



If you want to know about the issue, go to
http://www.zmag.org/content/Mideast/jewsfjustice.cfm
Writen by a group of Jewish men, a proper starter on the matter.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Well they want peace, he wanted to get the most he possibly could for his people... and then more and i feel he did get the best deal he'll ever get.

He signed it, but he couldn't control people like hommas who basically ruined it... It COULD have been peace.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Lol he was saying they won't make peace because IN THEIR EYES they came and stole their country....
But that's the same argument as saying Australians stole the country off aboriginals so they should never make peace, Americans stole the country off the native americans, The english stole their land off the french, vice versa....

I think you need to get over little things like these and accept that WILL both co-exist and the fairest way to do this was recommended by the un and signed by arafat.

 

[Bone577]

Well they want peace, he wanted to get the most he possibly could for his people... and then more and i feel he did get the best deal he'll ever get.

He signed it, but he couldn't control people like hommas who basically ruined it... It COULD have been peace.

What type of peace though? The loss of even more Palestinian land? Without the right of Palestinian refugees to return to there home? A right under Geneva Conventions mind you.

That is IF the Israeli's planned to honour the agreement, i will remind you they don't have a good track record with these things, 60+ breached resolutions.
We know what the eventual plan is anyway;

"In internal discussion in 1938,[David Ben-Gurion] stated that’ after we become a strong force, as a result of the creation of a state, we shall abolish partition and expand to the whole of Palestine… The state will only be a stage in the realization of Zionism and its task is to prepare the ground for our expansion into the whole of Palestine’… In 1948, Menahem Begin declared that: ‘The partition of the Homeland is illegal. It will never be recognized. The signature of institutions and individuals of the partition agreement is invalid. It will not bind the Jewish people. Jerusalem was and will forever be our capital. Eretz Israel (the Land of Israel) will be restored to the people of Israel. All of it. And forever.’ "

Noam Chomsky, "The Fateful Triangle"


And there is alot more of those quotes at http://www.zmag.org/content/Mideast/jewsfjustice.cfm
Some of them are very shocking indeed. And while there are Palestinians that wan't the eradication if Israel, these are actual Israeli heads of state saying these terrible criminal, genocidal things.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Yes and you believe the palestinians see it otherwise? Homas will only accept 100% of the land.

The difference is AT THE MOMENT the jews are willing to have peace and that border, and arafat and the majority of palestinians were willing to too. Wether later on Isreal plans to take back that land, that will be a matter for when it happens...

 

[Bone577]

Lol he was saying they won't make peace because IN THEIR EYES they came and stole their country....
But that's the same argument as saying Australians stole the country off aboriginals so they should never make peace, Americans stole the country off the native americans, The english stole their land off the french, vice versa....

I think you need to get over little things like these and accept that WILL both co-exist and the fairest way to do this was recommended by the un and signed by arafat.

I agree with the 1967 borders. I like Arafat. I just don't see peace coming along because of zionest expansionism.

I WOULD prefer a bi-national state like the original plan. A single country with both races living peacfuly. Which at one point was possible considering the similarities, the fact that they ARE racial cousins. But it is more and more unlikely.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Yes.. but an easy way to become a bi-national state would be to first be separate states in peace...

 

[Bone577]

Yes and you believe the palestinians see it otherwise? Homas will only accept 100% of the land.

The difference is AT THE MOMENT the jews are willing to have peace and that border, and arafat and the majority of palestinians were willing to too. Wether later on Isreal plans to take back that land, that will be a matter for when it happens...

I am unaware of a reasonable peace agreement that has been given to Arafat.

The Israelis (the government that is) are not willing to commit to peace, why would they build the wall as they do? Why is settlement construction still continuing? (faster than they are being taken down, though you only hear about them being taken down).

Again, under the resolutions i have mentioned 2 times already, Hamas has some legal and moral grounds. I don't see how Arafat could realisticaly quell the problem. How about accepting the 1967 internationaly recognised borders first on the part of Israel, along with allowing palastinians autonomy and their rights to return home first?

 

[Bone577]

Yes.. but an easy way to become a bi-national state would be to first be separate states in peace...

No i'm just saying what my own preference is. For now I think most of us will be happy with a 2 state agreement, such as the 1967 borders agreed on by the whole world.

 

[Not-That-Bright]

Yes and i believe arafat wasn't doing enough to make that a reality... he has great power within his people, much greater than homas, however it probably would of been unpopular.
Just as it is unpopular with the isreali's to give them some land.

 

[dark_angel]

Yes and i believe arafat wasn't doing enough to make that a reality... he has great power within his people, much greater than homas, however it probably would of been unpopular.
Just as it is unpopular with the isreali's to give them some land.

question

1. whats a homas

 

[Bone577]

question

1. whats a homas

Homas is a type of Arabic food.

Hamas is an organisation that delves in militancy, politics and humanitarian causes.


edit: This thread exploded bloody quick.

 

[dark_angel]

Homas is a type of Arabic food.

Hamas is an organisation that delves in militancy, politics and humanitarian causes.


edit: This thread exploded bloody quick.

wtf how can 1 words have 2 meanings?

 

[Bone577]

Yes and i believe arafat wasn't doing enough to make that a reality... he has great power within his people, much greater than homas, however it probably would of been unpopular.
Just as it is unpopular with the isreali's to give them some land.

I would agree he has greater power. But I definitely think it would be popular. It is just that i don't think it would be easy to stop Hamas. They DO play an essential role in Palestinian life with education and such. I don't think it would be soo simple.

 

[dark_angel]

oh shit, didnt see the 'o'