Capitalism is not compatable with real Democracy. (2 Viewers)

[moll.]

Everyone's whinging about how NCAP has died, so let's fix it.
"Capitalism and democracy aren't compatable because capitalism (namely corporate capitalism) is based upon 'one dollar; one vote' whereas true democracy is based upon 'one voice; one vote', which leads to a conflict of interest between the masses and the wealthy."
Discuss.

 

[JohnMcGee]

you can't bolster activity by putting up random threads and hoping people will bite. it doesn't work that way moll. you've got to find someone with an absurd or contentious view, and get them to express it publicly.

see, this is why you'd make a shit NCAP mod

 

[SylviaB]

Discuss.

retarded


corrupt politicians are not caused by capitalism


this thread will do nothing to make ncap less shit

 

[JohnMcGee]

this thread will do nothing to make ncap less shit

you could leave? that would be a good start.

 

[Fish Tank]

True democracy isn't compatible with anything, because humans are generally assholes. 'Majority rules', of course the method used to decide upon something 'democratically', only requires just over 50% of the people to agree with it.

So say there's a 51% majority deciding on one decision, the 49% who disagree will be forced into compliance. That's not true democracy as the 49% have had their voices overruled. There's always gonna be one asshole in the world who wants to disagree, so unanimous voting in places like Parliament is extremely difficult. So it's not capitalism that renders true democracy impractical, it's people.

This helped me procrastinate, that's it. NCAP unaffected.

 

[speak]

It is if you put restrictions on how money can be used on lobbying and donated to campaigns and campaign advertising. People will be always corrupted by money cause who doesn't like money?

 

[moll.]

retarded


corrupt politicians are not caused by capitalism


this thread will do nothing to make ncap less shit

I'm not talking about corrupt politicians. I'm talking about how everyone seems to be going on about how "democracy and capitalism go hand-in-hand" when in reality they're entirely seperate systems, based upon entirely seperate ideas.

 

[funkshen]

What is a vote in capitalism? Does 'one dollar one vote' refer to the fact that your purchasing decisions and capacity influence how the factors of production are utilised and allocated?

When people argue that "democracy and capitalism go hand-in-hand" they mean western liberal democracy. As in your economic liberty (capitalism) is inseparable from your political and civil liberty (democracy?).

 

[SylviaB]

I'm not talking about corrupt politicians. I'm talking about how everyone seems to be going on about how "democracy and capitalism go hand-in-hand" when in reality they're entirely seperate systems, based upon entirely seperate ideas.

then if its not about buying political power, in what way does having money subvert the democratic process

 

[ilikebeeef]

corrupt politicians are not caused by capitalism

+1. Corruption arises more out of authoritarianism.

Democracy is the 'closest' thing to freedom besides anarchy. Capitalism is freedom.

 

[Lolsmith]

It's not so much about having money. It's more about the shit extreme capitalism tries to pull off if left to it's own devices. Usually infringing upon the rights and liberties of the individual in a democratic state.

For example, Capitalism wouldn't educate as many people as what is being educated now because it's inefficient and a waste of resources. People would only be educated to feed a corporation and its head(s) in the needed role. The individual generally wouldn't possess the freedom to go and do/learn what they wish. Democracy steps in at this point and then allows the individual to be educated and learn a variety of things.

I doubt this will be a contribution taken seriously.

 

[SylviaB]

For example, Capitalism wouldn't educate as many people as what is being educated now because it's inefficient and a waste of resources. People would only be educated to feed a corporation and its head(s) in the needed role.

why are you so dumb

The individual generally wouldn't possess the freedom to go and do/learn what they wish. Democracy steps in at this point and then allows the individual to be educated and learn a variety of things.

m8 have you even been to a state school before?

12 years of my life down the drain

 

[kaz1]

Aren't the rich part of lobby groups and give donations to political parties, thus in effect the rich have more of say than the poor and it is not real democracy anymore.

 

[withoutaface]

Corporatism is not capitalism.

It is true that one dollar makes one vote in market making, but that's entirely appropriate given each person's contribution through their work.

 

[funkshen]

I would argue that democracy is one of the forces that moderates and engenders capitalism and arguing over compatibility is nonsense.

 

[gesh17]

Everyone's whinging about how NCAP has died, so let's fix it.
"Capitalism and democracy aren't compatable because capitalism (namely corporate capitalism) is based upon 'one dollar; one vote' whereas true democracy is based upon 'one voice; one vote', which leads to a conflict of interest between the masses and the wealthy."
Discuss.

Then again, there is an inherent ambiguity to the term democracy; it means different things to different people because each one of us lives bound by our own interpretations of reality. Personally though, I reckon many things within society are interrelated and sustain other components. I mean the next US election will allow the corporate funding of political campaigns and thus exponentially increase the chances of a particular candidate. Isn't that an example of whereby capitalism sustains democracy?

 

[littleboyjames]

suck my dick moll

 

[moll.]

What is a vote in capitalism? Does 'one dollar one vote' refer to the fact that your purchasing decisions and capacity influence how the factors of production are utilised and allocated?

No, 'one dollar; one vote' refers to the way corporations and bsuinesses are run. It isn't one vote per shareholder. It's one vote per share. Meanwhile the lowly employees of the company get left out of both the decisions and the profits.

When people argue that "democracy and capitalism go hand-in-hand" they mean western liberal democracy. As in your economic liberty (capitalism) is inseparable from your political and civil liberty (democracy?).

But how much of that economic liberty is actually real, and how much is simply theoretical? Liberty is defined as freedom from control, interference, obligation, restriction or hampering conditions. But in order to make it big in the capitalist system you have to have capital first. So where exactly does one get capital if you weren't born into it? And how does this not get defined as a "hampering condition"?
Now, our society is vastly more mobile than it once was, but most of that mobility is due to government intervention, rather than market forces. The janitor's son gets his science degree (and human capital) thanks to government education. In a fully private system he could never afford it, regardless of how brilliant a mathametician he is.

 

[moll.]

I would argue that democracy is one of the forces that moderates and engenders capitalism and arguing over compatibility is nonsense.

Wouldn't it be easier to just have an economic system that doesn't require moderation?

 

[Lolsmith]

Wouldn't it be easier to just have an economic system that doesn't require moderation?

Yeah, it would. But humans usually aren't too good with operating under a moral code rather than an actual lawfully imposed regulatory body. That's why we need separate things such as democracy to keep rampant capitalism in check, if it should ever arise. A good example is the education analogy you gave.

m8 have you even been to a state school before?

12 years of my life down the drain

No I haven't. But that state school probably wouldn't of even been in place if it weren't for democracy. Regardless of your opinion of it, it more than likely gave education to kids that wouldn't of received it otherwise.