Aboriginal children in care now exceeds stolen generations (7 Viewers)

[katie tully]

I believe the term is "sarcasm", katie

you're welcome?

 

[RSVPixie]

Might I also point out that this decline in support of One Nation is probably due to their ideas, which i was likening to the opinions of the majority of the people involved in the thread?

 

[xeuyrawp]

Ok. God, i love you people! So ready to broaden your minds to the possibilities!!

1. Yes i know i used a quote from the African-American movement; does that really matter if i agree with it??

The problem is that there is a difference between x and y races, even if it's only biological. If you say we're all the same, you've lost people who can think.

3. If i call myself an aboriginal, you understand what i mean, and personally, i consider it offensive to be called an "aborigine". "Aboriginal" is an adjectve and a noun.

Well I'm offended to hear an Aborigine called an "Aboriginal". Do you care? Probably not.

I am of aboriginal ancestry,

Yeah me too.

This is my main point; we are all the same people; Australians.

Why do you keep saying this shit? Part of "being Australian" is apparently being as diverse as similar. Stop trying to twang the most basic of rhetorical notes.

 

[katie tully]

Might I also point out that this decline in support of One Nation is probably due to their ideas, which i was likening to the opinions of the majority of the people involved in the thread?

Well you can liken One Nation to as many of us as you like, but I don't support One Nation and never did.

I just don't believe in pussy footing around these issues because what I say may or may not be offensive to Aboriginals and their sympathisers.

People are not automatically racist just because they don't agree with this victim agenda.

 

[Graney]

The Howard government adopted similar views to One Nation on intervention in aboriginal communities, and they were quite popular.

Witness the NT intervention.

 

[katie tully]

I'm 1/4 Irish and I'm not an alcoholic and I don't have red hair. See!!!!!! We aren't all the same.

 

[hpdanemma]

Look, this is just like every other stereotype. Groups of people get identified by their characteristics or actions. And of course people just look at this behaviour and make critical judgements, without looking at the causes of the behaviour or trying to fully understand all aspects of the issue. If society can't see itself as one and take responsibility for caring for and looking after all people then there will always be segredation and a social hierachy of sorts. Of course, you can't make everyone think a certain way but individuals should try and look at stereotypes thoroughly, as opposed to accepting what their first impression indicates.
Promoting ideas that Aboriginals are all playing the victim card and that they're abusive and lazy certainly won't help anyone achieve anything. Maybe the reason they get so many benefits is because they are DISADVANTAGED. If you don't care WHY or atleast seek out the reason why they are disadvantaged then it's just pointless for you to talk about it; you're not going to help solve the issue if you're not open to changning your views.

 

[RSVPixie]

I entered this discussion over interest and passion in the issue. I must admit, I don't understand why my opinions and beliefs are being being attacked. I have simply communicated my view.

Thats good for you guys, that you have diversity in your background. Honestly I don't think you understand that I'm trying to give you an alternate perspective. It is quite obviously different to yours, and i respect the fact that you have your own opinions. However, rudeness is not necessary. This is, after all, not a life changing discussion that will determine the survival of all mankind. I am entitled to my views and opinions. If you dont want to respect them or even think about them, thats your loss.

I do not believe that small biological differences make us a dfferent race. If that were so, there would be billions of categories of mankind. The only thing tha should matter is that we are human and we all have basic rights. Like shelter, food, fair treatment, etc.

As for "pussy footing" around issues, that was not and is not my intention. If you read anything i have said, you would realise that i am trying to adress the issue directly.

Did anyone notice that we no longer have a Liberal Government, and that Howards Government is gone?? Or was that just me? Well, please excuse me, I was under the illusion that Howard's Government lost populatiry, just like One Nation? Probably not to the same extent, but enough they ARE NO LONGER IN POWER.

If it causes you personal offence for me to call myself an aboriginal, then i will, for the context of this thread, call myself an aborigine, as much as it upsets me, so as to minimise the antagonism that i am getting for no apparent reason.

Please note Katie, i was not referring to stereotypes. I was using myself as an example. Not as a rule. Most people use evidence like this to back up an argument. And, i say again, there is no need to attack my point of view.

 

[katie tully]

You can argue till you're blue about whether there are stereotypes or not.

You can't argue that Aboriginals are not over represented in jail and in child abuse. Until people stop blaming the "white invasion", the "stolen generation" and whatever else for this over representation, it won't go away.

And you're such tards, because nobody has said take away their benefits. What I'm saying is that until they start taking responsibility for themselves, no amount of welfare will pull them out of this situation.

Stop being such lolly gaggers for a second and look at it with perspective and not rose tinted goggles.

 

[Iron]

You can argue till you're blue about whether there are stereotypes or not.

You can't argue that Aboriginals are not over represented in jail and in child abuse. Until people stop blaming the "white invasion", the "stolen generation" and whatever else for this over representation, it won't go away.

And you're such tards, because nobody has said take away their benefits. What I'm saying is that until they start taking responsibility for themselves, no amount of welfare will pull them out of this situation.

Stop being such lolly gaggers for a second and look at it with perspective and not rose tinted goggles.

Isnt the point that theyve lost all responsibility for themselves? Theyve been dispossessed, stolen etc - we've always treated them as less than us. In this context, where on earth do you find the drive to own a slither of a foreign country that used to be yours?

 

[RSVPixie]

If i was looking at the situation with rose tinted glasses, i would not see any problems. However, i do, and i am not romanticising the aboriginie's plight, i am suggesting that there needs to be more of an effort from the government. I do agree that some aboriginals need to help themselves, BUT most are unable to do so, due to their current situation.

And i was not arguing about stereotypes, i was saying that that was not part of my discussion. if it was my wording that prevented this point from coming across, i apologise.

 

[katie tully]

Isnt the point that theyve lost all responsibility for themselves? Theyve been dispossessed, stolen etc - we've always treated them as less than us. In this context, where on earth do you find the drive to own a slither of a foreign country that used to be yours?

Boo, you whore.

Britain colonised this desert hole 200+ years ago. Get a grip and move on. If they want, they're more than welcome to find their traditional roots and go be native again, I'm sure there is still lots of uninhabited land for them to spear their roos on.

Truth is they don't want to, they'd rather have the trappings of the modern world, whilst whinging about what it's done to them as well.

Whatevz.

 

[hpdanemma]

What I'm saying is that until they start taking responsibility for themselves, no amount of welfare will pull them out of this situation.

I have absolutely no problem with this idea, in fact I support it 100%. [Although it's not a specifically Aboriginal point, it applies for every single person or issue in society]. I DO have issues with a few comment's you've made, I wasn't even going to enter this discussion except your tunnel vision annoyed me so much I couldn't help it. And I don't understand why you got so defensive about it just because people don't agree with you. But it doesn't matter, I agree with your above statement, however general it may be, and if you had said that from the start this whole thing probably wouldn't have started.

But I mean, really. Describing people as a "troll", "shit" and a "whore" doens't exactly help get people to see your perspective.

 

[Graney]

Did anyone notice that we no longer have a Liberal Government, and that Howards Government is gone?? Or was that just me? Well, please excuse me, I was under the illusion that Howard's Government lost populatiry, just like One Nation? Probably not to the same extent, but enough they ARE NO LONGER IN POWER.

I don't think that had anything to do with indigenous affairs.

He was in power for 11 years. He refused to issue an apology to Indigenous Australians from 1999-2007. It didn't stop him getting reelected. Three times.

Just prior to the 2001 election, the government introduced tough border security legislation, in part inspired by One Nation policies, in an attempt to woo One Nation voters. It was a hugely popular move, and led the coalition to a strong victory.

You're trying to rewrite history.

 

[RSVPixie]

I am astonised that you feel threatened enough to swear as much as you do. This is a DISCUSSION and eveyone is entitled to their opinion! That is the main reason for discussions. That you feel it is necessary to insult others is not an admirable trait.

If that is your opinion on Aboriginies, i doubt i can change that, but at least you must admit that not all aboriginals are like that and that now YOU are stereotyping them into a role you have invented. Some aboriginals DO live in their native way, and others are very successful in the modern world. Its quite annoying that you try to put people of a certain culture or back ground in boxes, labeled and described as clones of one another, which is one way to look at steretyping. As we have said, though we are the same [humans] we are also all individuals, with our own quirks and slight biological differences. You cant classify a group as all the same. Someone i know once said: "It is our differences that make us similar." This has never been more true than now in the context of this discussion.

 

[katie tully]

You both need to get over the fact that I swear.

I swear. Deal with it. Stop whinging about it, it wont change. FFS.

 

[RSVPixie]

Im not trying to re-write history, Im just saying that the Liberal Govt. is no longer in power, so its a moot point. As you so rightly pointed out, it is now HISTORY, i.e. in the past/over. Thank god.

Katie: im just suggesting that there is no need to get worked up about this. People only swear when they get desperate/angry/hurt/upset. Or they are inconsiderate and rude.

 

[katie tully]

No I swear all the time in every day conversations.
it's my vice. Like some people smoke, I swear.

 

[hpdanemma]

You both need to get over the fact that I swear.

I swear. Deal with it. Stop whinging about it, it wont change. FFS.

haha I just think its funny you can't come up with coherent justifications for your views and instead revert to insulting people of opposing ideas.

 

[hpdanemma]

No I swear all the time in every day conversations.
it's my vice. Like some people smoke, I swear.

By the way, I swear a lot too. It's a very bad habit and I actually really don't like that I do, but yeh it's just a fact. My point is that I don't feel the need to personally and directly insult complete strangers with derogatory terms because I can't think of anythign better to say.