Advice pleasE! What course should I choose? (1 Viewer)

santaslayer

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LoLz. :p

melbournian, your arguments can only be used on the people who do a similar degree to that of yours, but in a different tertiary institution. Directly picking on people who do vastly different degrees at different universities is an immense waste of time and effort. Would it not be more challenging if you were to compare yourself with people of your own 'percieved' calibre rather than bullying people who are completeing degrees that, in future, you will probably never cross paths with? It would be more interesting and entertaining if you could inform us of your current progess at USYD, compared to your other learned and noble collegues rather than hearing your constant belittleing of other forum members.:)
 

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hah melbournian is stirring the pot..
if i didnt know any better though i would have put him in his place.
as it was mentioned earlier, in the end it is not about what university you went to, but about your capability as a memeber of the workforce in your chosen field and what you can contribute.
 

jm1234567890

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~Dreamer said:
hah melbournian is stirring the pot..
if i didnt know any better though i would have put him in his place.
as it was mentioned earlier, in the end it is not about what university you went to, but about your capability as a memeber of the workforce in your chosen field and what you can contribute.
that mabye true, but the first step is to get into the workforce and a good uni helps in that regard
 

nick1048

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melbournian said:
A typing error is different to laziness.

Natstar, don't you mean rise to Sydney University's level?

And be nice natstar, we are the ones who will be paying you UWS graduates to clean our toilets.

Your a poofter who should be shot the moment he graduates from USYD. Get a life, and some modesty and stop making an ass out of yourself online.
 

shelley

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Ha firstly an answer to what the original post was about;

Follow your dreams, humanities is alot more self motivated work, well atleast arts is (and anyone whose about to slam me for arts, trust me i proberbly do more work then u do) and even though its "volunatry" you are expected to do it. I do alot more at home work then science but i have less compulsary hours at university.

Everyone i know who does law loves it, so i would suggest you follow what your heart tells you. You can always transfer and its a long time to be doing something you dont like and rather expensive if you take a science degree.


Now my comment on the side Debate;

Look im sorry but i'm gonna side with Melb on this one. Look im sure you can get hired with a UWS degree. Yes i'm sure we all know someone who did. BUt lets look at this realically. And just to piont out, Melb never said that going to usyd made us superior people in any moral or social sense, just that were reciveing a better education. So tehers no piont in attacking him saying hes demoting a persons worth on teh grounds of a university degree. Hes merely applying the same ranking sstem to our degrees that teh government already did back when we were alocated uais, and the cuttoffs for the universities where determined.

So you want to argue there's no difference in universities. I'm sorry but thats just stupid. The whole uai system is designed to make a stratified university system. If there was no difference in uni's, wouldnt all unis offer the same courses, and there'd be a standardised uai enterance. This would thus set a leve by which you could argue there id no difference in universities.

The fact is the more "academically inclined people" with the higher uai's go to the "better" instutions. Those of you who wish to argue that UAI's have no bearing on your academic ability have a piont, but it is the only reference of ranking the government has, and it is realistically a measure of your scholarly abilities. Lets face it, we have in australia a league of 8, and look im sorry but UWS isnt on it. Look i come form the western suburbs, and while i admit i attend usyd, the fact remains i attend it and travel the stupid distance every day for the simple fact its better. For me there is access to better informed and knowledgable lecturers, greater resources and the courses are more challanging. Unfortunatly it's fairly obvious that the more academic people go to the institutions of UNSW, Usyd, Macquaire, ect. Thus teh combined intellegence, and the lecturers who in my experience double as tutors are higher. Uni is a collective learning xperience, and thus it would be senisible that beacuase the students who have shown themselves to be superior (and lets face it the UAI are alla bout ranking us in superiority) combined with distinguished tutors/lectueres, it woulod be hard to argue that these people are not recieving a "better" education.

And the fact is employers now this. I have a friend who had a slightly lower uai then me, who went to UWS because she got a sholarship. When people ask me what university i attend and i answer university of Sydey, they are impressed, there's an aura of presitge and respect attatched, whether ir not one agrees with that is irelevent, teh gerneral perception is what it is. When she says UWS people are not impressed and just assumes that part and parcle of growing up in the western suburbs, that you would attend a commonly oercieved "inferior" university.

Look im not saying its impossible to get hired with a UWS degree. But think about it. If say myself, and another person from perhap UWS went for the same job. We have similar extra cirrcular experiences, we both present well, are articulate and we have the same grade piont average from our respective uni.I believe, and i know enough people who haveI believe, and i know enough people who have business and hire people, that i would be hired because it is percieved that it's harder to achieve a high grade piont average at Usyd then it is at UWS ect.

The fact remains there is a sytem of grading to universities whether we as students agree with it, and depite concerns on whether its a fair grading system, im sorry but Melbournian is right, in the eyes of the general public there is a perception of superiority. It would be like saying there is no difference in high schools. That stupid and everyone knows it, James Ruase would be horrified to be compared to say Plumpton high. There is a difference, and even if its just a fincial advantage, theres "ivy leagues" equivalent universities in Australia, and they generally have more money thus superior staff, services, and thus higher uai cutt offs because student wish to attend them, thus the university can take the "cream of the crop".

Unless they change the system by which students qualify for university it will be impossible to argue there is no difference to uni's. Hence why Usyds' cuttoffs rarely fall past 85, and UWSs' are regularily in the 70s. You cant tell me that there is no difference in the ideas that are expressed in a tutorial between the two students. The fact remains one has demosnstartated that they can comprehende a greater level of teh information being expressed, and that has an affect on what they will contribute to a tutorial.

Thats not to say Usyd ect are always suprerior, Macquaire is superior if you wish to study Egyptology (stcicking to what i know) because they have Kanawati. Lectireres also make a difference, and i challange you to fins a WORLD renowed professor that doesnt teach in one of the "presitigous" universities!!!!!!!!! Thus its largely impossible to argue conclusivly Usyd is ALWAYS the best in every disapline in every subject, but i do think one must be realistic and realise there are "better" and "worse" unis!

And by the way, that derogitory comment on collage students was pathetic. Seriously such sweeping generalisations are pathetic. His living arrangement for the past year would not have had a massive impact on his identity!

Ok im done!
 

santaslayer

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shelley said:
Now my comment on the side Debate;

And just to piont out, Melb never said that going to usyd made us superior people in any moral or social sense, just that were reciveing a better education. So tehers no piont in attacking him saying hes demoting a persons worth on teh grounds of a university degree.

So you want to argue there's no difference in universities. I'm sorry but thats just stupid. The whole uai system is designed to make a stratified university system. If there was no difference in uni's, wouldnt all unis offer the same courses, and there'd be a standardised uai enterance. This would thus set a leve by which you could argue there id no difference in universities.

The fact is the more "academically inclined people" with the higher uai's go to the "better" instutions..

Lets face it, we have in australia a league of 8, and look im sorry but UWS isnt on it.

For me there is access to better informed and knowledgable lecturers, greater resources and the courses are more challanging. Unfortunatly it's fairly obvious that the more academic people go to the institutions of UNSW, Usyd, Macquaire, ect. Thus teh combined intellegence, and the lecturers who in my experience double as tutors are higher. Uni is a collective learning xperience, and thus it would be senisible that beacuase the students who have shown themselves to be superior (and lets face it the UAI are alla bout ranking us in superiority) combined with distinguished tutors/lectueres, it woulod be hard to argue that these people are not recieving a "better" education.

And the fact is employers now this. I have a friend who had a slightly lower uai then me, who went to UWS because she got a sholarship. When people ask me what university i attend and i answer university of Sydey, they are impressed, there's an aura of presitge and respect attatched, whether ir not one agrees with that is irelevent, teh gerneral perception is what it is. When she says UWS people are not impressed and just assumes that part and parcle of growing up in the western suburbs, that you would attend a commonly oercieved "inferior" university.

Look im not saying its impossible to get hired with a UWS degree. But think about it. If say myself, and another person from perhap UWS went for the same job. We have similar extra cirrcular experiences, we both present well, are articulate and we have the same grade piont average from our respective uni.I believe, and i know enough people who haveI believe, and i know enough people who have business and hire people, that i would be hired because it is percieved that it's harder to achieve a high grade piont average at Usyd then it is at UWS ect.


Unless they change the system by which students qualify for university it will be impossible to argue there is no difference to uni's. Hence why Usyds' cuttoffs rarely fall past 85, and UWSs' are regularily in the 70s.

Thats not to say Usyd ect are always suprerior, Macquaire is superior if you wish to study Egyptology (stcicking to what i know) because they have Kanawati. Lectireres also make a difference, and i challange you to fins a WORLD renowed professor that doesnt teach in one of the "presitigous" universities!!!!!!!!! Thus its largely impossible to argue conclusivly Usyd is ALWAYS the best in every disapline in every subject, but i do think one must be realistic and realise there are "better" and "worse" unis!


Ok im done!
1) Wrong. Please read his first comment on this particular thread. (even though you probably haven't read any of his other provacative statements.) :)

2) Wrong yet again. I think the more appropriate response would be that the difference is in the concening degree at that particular university. To use the wider approach and to look at the university as a whole would be quite naive.

3) Gernerally yes, yet there are always exceptions to that rule. Other considerations which are taken into account when choosing a university are proximity, friends, vibe..etc.

4) Do you know what the go8 is or does? It shoouldn't apply to undergraduate degrees.

5) That's quite correct. Combined knowledge does foster an enviroment where education can be delivered abd recieved to the optimum level. :) The problem is that you are implying things about other university lecturers. Do you realise that these academics can go from uni to uni?

6) Yes that's quite correct if you are trying to impress arrogant people. Your friend, IMO, is much more intelligent than you are as she gained a scholarship for her degree. Yes, you do go to a sandstone university, but the problem is that you do a singualr Arts degree. What does your friend do?

7) Where did you get that perception from?

8)Yes that wascorrect in the year 2000. :p It has no meaning you do realise?

9) Just like the B Science at UWS. Highest UAI cutoff in NSW. (yet it dosen't mean anything) :)
 

hipsta_jess

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santaslayer said:
9) Just like the B Science at UWS. Highest UAI cutoff in NSW. (yet it dosen't mean anything) :)
are you saying the cutoff means nothing, or a BSc means nothing?
 

jm1234567890

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The "sandstone" unis are prestegious cause they have done leading research in various fields. If you don't plan to do research, this kind of advantage doesn't help.

If you go to uni for training alone in a particular field of expertise UWS wouldn't offer greatly less facilities compared to sydney or UNSW. Sure, the lectures won't be spending alot of time
researching, but that also allows them to focus more effort on teaching, which is what you
are after. This is particularly releavent to unis like UTS, where it focused on industrial
training, thus become ranked 3 star (even behind wollongong, 4star).

this argument on what uni is better really depends on what kind of job you are after.
If you want a job which doesn't involve research and creativity, by all means go to UWS
if you want... Employers of this kind of employee prolly won't discriminate much.
 

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santaslayer said:
9) Just like the B Science at UWS. Highest UAI cutoff in NSW. (yet it dosen't mean anything) :)
2 Points.
Wouldn't cutoff matter? High cutoff implies higher median mark (when candidature numbers are about the same) and hence higher calibre students...

And UWS doesn't have highest cutoff...
looking through their booklet...
If you're referring to their advanced degree, then you have to compare it with USYD's equiv :p
 

jm1234567890

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ok i think this thread should be locked now....

why is it that everytime unis are compared (escpecially UWS) it must degrade to a flame war?
 

shelley

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Hrmm id love to know what exactly those numbers corresponded to...

anyhoo, look she actually does arts to, and im on scholarship at usyd too thanks mate! Its not like usyd doesnt have them!(and the next person who bags my degree, please realise i qualified for pretty much anything...unless u needed like 4 units maths for the degree, instead i chose something i loved at a uni that will give me the greatest chance at developing my skills)


Actually for me, in terms of an arts ancient history degree, research is all important, rather then having somone telling me what someone else maybe thinks, my lecturers have been there, wrote the influential works and are well known...world renowed in fact for their knowledge and achievements in the field...why would i wanna trade that for a slightly shorter train trip?

and btw what do you think getting a job is about? yes folks its impressing arrogant ppl who think there better then you!
by the way i did read his post he was saying people need to use a higher quailty of english on the boards, and that while less nominilised and informal language may be acceptable at UWS but wouldnt cut it at usyd. And seeming ive written essays for friends at other unis hes right, sydney does demand a very high academic standard of writing (atleast in humanities) the other universities.

Thanks Estel for getting the piont i was making about uai's! And if u want a different mesaure, UWS has the highest drop out and dissatification evel of all unis in Australia....TO ME I THINK THIS PROBERBLY DEMONSTRATES SOMETHING ABOUT THIS UNI!

Oh and btw i seriously doubt you manage to get the likes of Kanawati or Welsh to go to UWS. Also universoity is suppose to be about gaining skills to think for yourself and critical analyse situations. Who wants a lecturer who holds your hand? Id much rather have one whose been out researching in teh feild and knows there stuff, rather then someone who wants to spoon feed me information!
 
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shelley

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argh i knew actually id get myself into hot water about that post!

"The UAI cutoff for uni's is majorly determined by how many people want to go there. It is in people's own opinions whether they want to go there, and their own opinions about whether the uni is good or not."

Id argue those are the EXACTLY the things that determine UAI cut off cos they are the things that make you choose your course

"So u are saying people who dont go to 'prestigious' uni's arnt 'academically inclined""

Not at all, but the larger majority of teh people with the higher UAI's (which generally meant they were academic) are at other institutions. Actually i have been to UWS, i have sat in on a lecture and ive done a few assessments for a friends, so yes i do know what its like there! And simple put its at a lower level then the same education i recieve, maybe its different fo other degrees, but i cant see how! The fact is the course has to be taught for the median person, that hows its set, thus the lower the median the lower the course!

and yes i did say it has nothing to do with personal superiority the uai, but THEY are a rank of our academic achievment, same as marks, other WHY WOULD WE HAVE THEM!

As i said i know alot about UWS, infact i know personally alot of its staff! I probebrly know more about the marking system there then you, BECAUSE I DID MY WORK EXPERIENCE THERE. Just because you would like to think that everyone in USYD is snobby and has no idea about "the real world" is unfair. I know exactly what UWS is like!

Some high schools select there students...well so do unis! I mean offering scholarships, breaks on uai, and the uai itself are all ways the universities "select" there canditure!

and that comments a bit dumb, uais cant go down, the only way they can is if less people sit the hsc..there based on numbers x amount get each 0.5 deduction! its not like they can not give a uai of 100 out cos they didnt like the canditure! The uais at western sydney jumping can also be attributed to the fact they cut course numbers. The uni itself complained that it would push uai's up!

UWS is proberbly superior in areas like forensic science and agriculture, i really cant see how you can say that about nursing! Its very hard to argue that seeming the nursing degree at UWS is very limited, thou the same can be said about Usyd, actually the best is most likely UTS! And actually i never said usyd was best in all displines, i merely said you can rank a university on the whole. I mean you also cant say James Ruse is the BEST high school for all courses! But i know a fair few whod say all round its the best high school in the state.

And UWS has been around for awhile, and teh fact its a new uni means it should have better resources, which it doesnt, i remeber trying to use its library last year...the words rather pathetic come to mind...

I never said Usyd was the best uni in the state, i merely said i agreed with Melb on teh concept its possible to rank unis. I dont believe in this idea all unia re equal!

And erm other ppl have backed up some of what Melb said, i dont support all of what Melb says, just the underlying principle! And ever though maybe its simple the rest are to scared to risk getting virtually yelled at? The fact is whether Melb had gone to Usyd, UNSW, UNE i still would have supported his underlying principal that its possible to rank unis!

And i dont think im an expert on everything, but i certainly know alot about UWS to make an informed comment, let me ask you this, have you EVER been to Usyd? I mean i was invited last year for degre in a day program satin in on lectures ect, and i went to talented students stuff at UWS. Plus my other experiences so i figure im capable of making a judgement. So in your wild accusations that Usyd isnt any different to your buissness degree...have you actually been, actively participated? Had something marked? Cos otherwise your just as guilty of making assumptions as u accuse Melb and myself of...and erm...please dont ask me questions then answer them for me..im capable of answering and your answers were wrong!
 
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shelley

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haha i didnt realise i needed to put down my academic transcript lol ok in future i shall just for you write every day/event/lecture/interview ive had at any other universities should i mention them in my post! I was never trying to say UWS was terrible i was using it simply because i know about it. I was trying to say unis can be ranked

And i know all about the qualifications of my university lecturers because i read the books they written, ive spoken with them about digs, i know whose doing what and what there currently working on! Im going to assume if a lecturer has been invited to re excavate the GIZA PRYMAIDS by the HEAD OF THE EGYPTIAN ANTIQUITIES DEPARTMENT hes probebrly good at what he does......and actually i did have interaction with lecturers before i chose my univeristies, i interviewed kanawati, sought advice from Katherine Welsh and Peter Brannan....so actually i do know all about there qualifications!

and actually i never said mine were though i tend to go back and edit them, and actually my spelling and punctuation is excellent, i just dont type efficently! lol

And im not impressed by the lectures delievered the one i sat in on was pitched far closer to the hsc level then the ones i recieve there was less emphasis on going out and doing your own research AND when ive ever gone to use the library for resources its been sub par. Look im sure UWS has many redeeming qualities, to start ith..theres less stairs then at usyd, but the simple fact is i agree with Melbs concpet its possible to rank unis..
 

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natstar said:
thanx theone...sorry i just get real steamed up when ppl think they are experts on everything cuz they go to USYD...
Notice how the only ppl (well 1 person) backing Melbournian up are USYD's...as i say u guys are taking the piss outa ur uni
Only because nobody gives a damn.

natstar said:
no one has said that all uni's are equal
But you seemed to imply that all unis equipped graduates equally and that was all that counted, as can be seen by following quote.
natstar said:
I only said that when we graduate, no one will care what uni we went to as long as we have the right skills for the job... a business degree for example at USYD will teach u the same stuff as a business degree at UWS
Why should you be proud that your lecturer is a Harvard graduate? Would you be as proud if he were a UWS graduate?

And can you honestly say that UWS>USYD, or UWS=USYD in job prospects, resources, learning environment etc?

This post is not meant to insult you, merely to show the stupidity of the entire (not just yours) argument.

Now back to original q!
 

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haha see i cant see how calling me superficial (beacuse i dont like what your uni teaches? well thats why i didnt go there, didnt realise making an informed decision made me superficial, its not like i said im gonna got to usyd cos it matches my nail polish) makes u any better then Melb saying you were cleaning toliets, i wasnt having a go at you, i admire your dedication to your uni....and simply put i realise this argument got blown stupidly outta proportion, maybe you didnt mean to imply that unis cant be ranked, same as i didnt mean to imply i supported Melbs..errr...interesting..opionions on your job prospects.


and now back to the original question of this thread..if hes still reading, i had a chat to a few of my law friends and they say that provided your dedicated ull enjoy the course, and that the maths/science training youve had will actually be an advantage! hope it helps!

AND erm id have many issues saying harvards teh worlds best uni! Im sure the likes of Princeton, Cambridge, Oxford and Yale would agree! Im suuuuure you meant to say best for buissness....id proberbly conceed that...maybe even law, but that debatable
 

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