Boat People (3 Viewers)

[OZGIRL86]

I think people should go about the correct ways of coming to Australia.Unless their countryis fully war torn or some big emergency evacuation happens.

 

[Alexander]

We take on all the skilled persons we can. If someone has the skills, they are given priority in terms of people entering the country, hence the problem with unskilled people entering without invitation.
im not saying its right to turn these people back, (becasue i dont have to), im saying that skilled immigration is very seporate to humanitarian immigration.
The gov. is turning back people they cant desporatly use, as opposed to people they can.

 

[midnight]

I didn't read this whole thread, so sorry if I've said something that's already been mentioned. It's annoying when people do that, but it's really long.

I've been to a detention centre before, and from what I saw it was hardly a jail. [I didn't go to the high security levels or anything though, it could be different there] I know a bit about why the asylum seekers and such are sent to those centres, and it's logical. People don't realise that, generally, they are treated quite well. The children can attend school and get taken on outings, people can have visitors, they have parties for holidays and things. [Again, I can't say if it's like that for every single person, but a majority]
The problem arises when people 'queue jump', as they often don't have the proper documentation the immigration officials need to make sure they don't have any sort of criminal background, or any diseases.
Another thing: boat people don't make up the majority of the refugees/asylum seekers, a lot will come on planes. It's all very generalised I suppose.
Also, those who come on the planes and boats have paid a fair amount of money for the privilege. The people I feel for are the most severely in need of help: those who are left in the country, sometimes with no family.

There's other processes for people who have nursing etc qualifications, but the problem with allowing in people with any skills is that there are plenty of under/unemployed people in Australia who could easily be trained with those skills. Personally I'd be pretty annoyed if someone from another country got a job that I would be just as suitable for.

Did anyone hear about the two Australians who were accepted into the US as asylum seekers? And there's still the other 30 who applied. At least our system is better than some...
I'm done prattling on.

 

[Alexander]

Yeah. The centres have never looked grossly inhumane. They just have measures in place to prevent people from escaping...makes sense. And considering that some sow their mounths up in protest, it gives the impression that they are fed!.
I guess they'd just be pissed about not getting what they wanted, which I can understand, but I can more understand why both the Libs and Labour treat the issue as they do.
Becasue it's so hard to oversee all australia's coast, we are forced to deal with the issue once it develops, rather than stopping it at sea like every other country does.

 

[SKA]

well can i just say somehting here.. if the detention centres are soo good that its like a holiday.. why are people putting themselves in danger in protest to get out!?

 

[glycerine]

Originally posted by midnight
I didn't read this whole thread, so sorry if I've said something that's already been mentioned. It's annoying when people do that, but it's really long.

I've been to a detention centre before, and from what I saw it was hardly a jail. [I didn't go to the high security levels or anything though, it could be different there] I know a bit about why the asylum seekers and such are sent to those centres, and it's logical. People don't realise that, generally, they are treated quite well. The children can attend school and get taken on outings, people can have visitors, they have parties for holidays and things. [Again, I can't say if it's like that for every single person, but a majority]
The problem arises when people 'queue jump', as they often don't have the proper documentation the immigration officials need to make sure they don't have any sort of criminal background, or any diseases.
Another thing: boat people don't make up the majority of the refugees/asylum seekers, a lot will come on planes. It's all very generalised I suppose.
Also, those who come on the planes and boats have paid a fair amount of money for the privilege. The people I feel for are the most severely in need of help: those who are left in the country, sometimes with no family.

There's other processes for people who have nursing etc qualifications, but the problem with allowing in people with any skills is that there are plenty of under/unemployed people in Australia who could easily be trained with those skills. Personally I'd be pretty annoyed if someone from another country got a job that I would be just as suitable for.

Did anyone hear about the two Australians who were accepted into the US as asylum seekers? And there's still the other 30 who applied. At least our system is better than some...
I'm done prattling on.

which centre did you visit?i've been to villawood more than once and it was nothing like that

 

[Alexander]

Ive been to Villawood too and i have to say it was anything but bad. I think it was a logical structure....It is a holding centre for people who shouldnt be here, whilst making sure those people dont escape in the meantime. Emotion doesnt come into that equation.
I can understand that it's depressing for the people who wont be able to stay, but that has nothing to do with the structure, which is fine.

 

[SKA]

welllll i dunno

 

[Generator]

A number of you are quick to call down the Howard Government for its actions when all it has done has been to act in a 'progressive' manner from the base created by the previous Labor Government... Try to remember that it is far from being a simple issue.

 

[SKA]

maybe thats why its still unresolved n there is much conflict ova it

 

[midnight]

It was Villawood.
And I never said it's a Hilton, or that it's like a holiday, but it makes you question what sort of places and situations the people lived in previously to think that the centres are like a hell. But people aren't as set on getting out of Villawood as they are at the others. They always have the option of going back home too, our government will pay and organise the proper travel documents provided the person doesn't come back here.

The public and the media are quick to jump to conclusions about it all, but does anyone have a sensible, practical suggestion for where the people could stay? I'd certainly like to hear it.

 

[Enlightened_One]

I agree with Midnight. Although I know nothing about Villawood, never been there, they do it pretty good, and have the option of returning.

 

[TheDreamer]

I have to say I agree with Midnight as well. They were given pretty fair treatment for anyone in jail and, yes, had options. It's only when they rebel, then things get messy.
Please don't flame me, just my opinion.

 

[Alexander]

My Dutch cousin was half-way through a degree in town planning in Rotterdam and gave it up to come to Australia, just like that - no qualifications, no nothing and he was accepted within 3 months. It isn't hard to get into Australia, just do it on the right terms.

 

[SKA]

well i think its not fair ... when it comes to human rights

 

[glycerine]

Originally posted by midnight
It was Villawood.
And I never said it's a Hilton, or that it's like a holiday, but it makes you question what sort of places and situations the people lived in previously to think that the centres are like a hell. But people aren't as set on getting out of Villawood as they are at the others. They always have the option of going back home too, our government will pay and organise the proper travel documents provided the person doesn't come back here.

The public and the media are quick to jump to conclusions about it all, but does anyone have a sensible, practical suggestion for where the people could stay? I'd certainly like to hear it.

compared to some of the others, villawood is heaven
also, they can't just go back home, for example iran (i think, correct me if i'm wrong) has a law where they could be prosecuted for attempting to seek refuge in another country if they did go back. i'll look that up at some point tonight and tell you the exact law. so it's not quite that simple

 

[braad]

hmm, media dusnt help anything these days, well not much, and this might sound like a beat up on the media, but u gotta admit they show us wot they want us to see, or hear....

anyway onto the boat people, its a tough thing, and i dont want just anyone coming into OUR country (that is, all us australians living here already) but we gotta be compassionate towards those that trully seek refuge from a "crapped-up" country, so pick n choose i reckon, it might b tougher than goin bulk, but it'll save us in the future and we can hep the real refuge-seeking people of the world

 

[Alexander]

A better policy would be to aid foreign countires that boat people flee from.

 

[OZGIRL86]

Originally posted by Alexander
Ive been to Villawood too and i have to say it was anything but bad. I think it was a logical structure....It is a holding centre for people who shouldnt be here, whilst making sure those people dont escape in the meantime. Emotion doesnt come into that equation.
I can understand that it's depressing for the people who wont be able to stay, but that has nothing to do with the structure, which is fine.

I agree.
it's probably luxury accomodation compared to what they are used to anyway.. so I don't see why there is any excuse for them to complain... at leastthey arent being chucked in a dirty jail.

 

[OZGIRL86]

Originally posted by Asquithian
the argument is that they are being detained...not the level of luxury they are being kept in...the fact that there freedom and movement is restricted and that they are in the middle of no where is what is the issue...if say u or i were locked up on entry to the US for 2 years in the Crown plaza hotel on LA i think we would want to leave...sure not an anologous example..but i still kinda applies

i think the problem is the time it takes to process these people...way too long...when u have instances of people being held for over a year in detention then their is an obviously problem...

twas doing this at uni a few lectures ago...about 5000 people each year come to Australia seeking aslyum ... (it varies each year but last year there were something like 400 boat people...)

the number of people overstaying their visas is in the 50 000 range...technically these people are illegals...no big fuss over these people mainly becasue they are US or UK or white origin.

Australia under international law must take people who are deemed to be refugees.

the human rights comission is onto Australia not for us refusing them but for detaining them for such long periods of time.



As for the Pacific solution ..and that all of our northern islands are exised from Australian territory is funny....
that we all get so hyped up over a few hundred boat people many of whole are legit refugees freeing relgious or political persecution which the specture of being killed if they return to their homelands...


there is no doubt that there is some racism in the current system...not directly but indirectly...


i saw a cartoon ...twas very funny ...it was a sign saying "Welcome to the lucky (in small print "we dont shoot u" ) country"

its very sadly true...

middle of nowhere? well ive never seen where the detention centre is actually located i villawood, but i do know that the actual suburb villawood isn't in the middle of nowhere..
Their location isn't an issue