Does God exist? (14 Viewers)

[katie tully]

me thinks the egg.

i hope the egg was baptised

 

[seano77]

Not knowing that something does exist is to me non-existence, for my reality is only made up of those things I know and those which I do not I cannot speak of, they do not exist in it. This is true even of things which do turn out to exist.

Your logic: I've never been to China, I've never seen China, I think people who believe in China are stupid, thus China does not exist.

Lets say you turn up before God on judgement day. Your excuse is 'in my reality you don't exist'. Sorry, but that makes no difference to what the reality is. If a semi-trailer is coming down the road straight at you, you can will it into non-existence till you turn blue in the face, but the reality is that the trailer is still coming.

 

[katie tully]

What a ridiculous argument.

Of course canon law was a basis for common law. I distinctly remember a time when religion prevailed over common sense and it was illegal not to be a Christian. Distinctly also remember books being burnt because Christians hate knowledge.

Anybody remember Galileo? Pretty sure that poor bastard spent the remaining years of his life imprisoned because he ARGUED THAT THE EARTH ROTATED AND THE CHURCH DISAGREED.

In conclusion, the Church is wrong and who gives a fuck if law was once governed by religion. I'll put money on it that any person born without the influence of religion will have an intrinsic set of self regulated morals, SUCH AS THOU SHALL NOT KILL (i also disticntly remember religion condoning killing at one point).

In conclusion part 2, fuck you're a retard cannibal.

 

[katie tully]

Your logic: I've never been to China, I've never seen China, I think people who believe in China are stupid, thus China does not exist.

Lets say you turn up before God on judgement day. Your excuse is 'in my reality you don't exist'. Sorry, but that makes no difference to what the reality is. If a semi-trailer is coming down the road straight at you, you can will it into non-existence till you turn blue in the face, but the reality is that the trailer is still coming.

Poor analogy.

If you refuse to acknowledge the truck is coming, you're an idiot. The truck is tangible. You've had exposure to trucks before. There is proof that trucks exist. The truck infront of you is such proof.

Prove to me that God exists. None of this judgement day shit, coz I'm pretty sure once rigor mortis sets in, I won't give a shit who's judging my corpse.

Yes I realise the statement was intended for Chadd, but you're a twat.

 

[Iron]

Seano made a very articulate post and you did nothing to refute it but throw swears at him. Truth must be external to the individual, otherwise there is no truth and nothing exists at all.

 

[Enteebee]

Your logic: I've never been to China, I've never seen China, I think people who believe in China are stupid, thus China does not exist.

Lets say you turn up before God on judgement day. Your excuse is 'in my reality you don't exist'. Sorry, but that makes no difference to what the reality is. If a semi-trailer is coming down the road straight at you, you can will it into non-existence till you turn blue in the face, but the reality is that the trailer is still coming.

Yes that is my logic... if I had absolutely no strong evidence at all in favor of believing in some place called china then I don't see why I'd believe in it. If I told you that zanziwooland exists, would you believe it without any evidence? I'm not willing anything into non-existence seano, it's just that I have no evidence of it there for me to will away.

 

[katie tully]

Seano made a very articulate post and you did nothing to refute it but throw swears at him. Truth must be external to the individual, otherwise there is no truth and nothing exists at all.

Fuck off.

I did plenty to refute it.

Trucks exist.
God doesn't.

Can I make it any more clear for you Iron, or are you having a hazy day again?

 

[Iron]

??? Such blind venom. I weep.

 

[Kwayera]

God most certainly does exist, for if He did not, then Serbia would be overrun with muslims!

Praise be to God!

Can't argue with that logic.

 

[gibbo153]

It's one thing to believe in God and another to appreciate how great He is.

true. satan 'believes' in god.

 

[supercalamari]

Your logic: I've never been to China, I've never seen China, I think people who believe in China are stupid, thus China does not exist.

Lets say you turn up before God on judgement day. Your excuse is 'in my reality you don't exist'. Sorry, but that makes no difference to what the reality is. If a semi-trailer is coming down the road straight at you, you can will it into non-existence till you turn blue in the face, but the reality is that the trailer is still coming.

No, there is the physical and then there is the psychological. This God thing is just a psychological sensation that a lot of people seem to experience. I am one of them from time to time. Proof of God- there is little to none, I'm afraid.

 

[gibbo153]

ive got a question about christianity/monotheistic gods. Ive never really understood this, im sure christians must have some sort of answer for it since it seems like such an obvious problem.

Firstly, God is omniscient. He knows everything, he is outside of time. he knows the past and the future.

Secondly, I have free choice to accept god or not. My future is not pre-determined, I can make my own decisions.

But how can I have a free choice if god already knows what Im going to do? God knows the future, he surely must know what I am going to do and if he does then I wouldnt have free choice. If he doesnt know what Im going to do, then he isnt much of a god.

predestination is an incredibly complex topic to get into, but in short answer to what you've said,

free choice (i.e. the ability to do whatever you want) doesnt actually contradict god being omniscient.

he knows everything you will do in your life, everything about you, before you were made

(ok ps noone reply with blah blah god didnt make us etc, im just explaining this from a theist perspective)

it all comes back to the garden of eden etc. god knew that those naughty kids were gonna take the bad fruit, even though they had perfection in the garden.

but, its easy to think, well that was just stupid of him to do, why did he make us if we are going to do whatever we want etc, which also leads to , 'why did god make people if he knew some were going to hell' and that sort of thing.

but it can be seen that god wouldnt just want to make people who don't have free will, who just obeyed everything all the time. obviously everyone would always respect and obey him. theres just no point.

god wants everyone to follow him, but without free choice, there's no point us even existing.

but yes, god does in fact know that some people he has made are destined not to be christian, some are.

you say, how can there be free choice if god knows what im going to do.

free choice as i said doesnt constitute a lack of omniscience. free choice, is the ability to choose uninterfered. god is not controlling you.
you are acting of your own self and being, its just that god in his infinite knowledge knows everything about you, and what you are going to do.

i hope that basically explained that free will isnt interfered with by omniscience

 

[Enteebee]

Free will isn't imo necessarily contradictory with omniscience... but it definantly is with omnipotence.

 

[Kwayera]

No, there is the physical and then there is the psychological. This God thing is just a psychological sensation that a lot of people seem to experience. I am one of them from time to time. Proof of God- there is little to none, I'm afraid.

It's funny - religious 'experiences', in all their splendour, can actually be induced by electrical stimulation of certain parts of the brain (along with NDE and UFO experiences).

 

[Iron]

Maybe they werent genuine religious experiences then? Doesnt hurt God much.

 

[supercalamari]

It's funny - religious 'experiences', in all their splendour, can actually be induced by electrical stimulation of certain parts of the brain (along with NDE and UFO experiences).

I read about that, it was very interesting. In one of Dr. Karl's books (the new one) there is a chapter about NDE's electro magnetic stimulation, it's really interesting. I can smell an interesing PIP or IRP topic for year twelve...

 

[moll.]

Your logic: I've never been to China, I've never seen China, I think people who believe in China are stupid, thus China does not exist.

Lets say you turn up before God on judgement day. Your excuse is 'in my reality you don't exist'. Sorry, but that makes no difference to what the reality is. If a semi-trailer is coming down the road straight at you, you can will it into non-existence till you turn blue in the face, but the reality is that the trailer is still coming.

Your sarcastic argument is flawed from the outset, because it assumes that China exists.
China is a man made construct, much like God. China doesn't actually exist.
China as a nation is just a line on a map. Who made the map and the line? Humans. Historically, the borders of China have changed geographical location many times throughout the centuries as well.
Or China as a people? What about all the immigrants and emigrants of China? Are they Chinese or not?
Or China as a ethnic group? Then technically Australia would then be an Aboriginal nation, but of course we are not, because they only make up an obscure minority of the populace.
China doesn't exist. China is only an idea. Much like God.

 

[Enteebee]

I read about that, it was very interesting. In one of Dr. Karl's books (the new one) there is a chapter about NDE's electro magnetic stimulation, it's really interesting. I can smell an interesing PIP or IRP topic for year twelve...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qIiIsDIkDtg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5z4B5BYbjf8

Very much related.

 

[Kwayera]

Maybe they werent genuine religious experiences then? Doesnt hurt God much.

Supposedly they were indistinguishable from the "real thing".

 

[Kwayera]

Your sarcastic argument is flawed from the outset, because it assumes that China exists.
China is a man made construct, much like God. China doesn't actually exist.
China as a nation is just a line on a map. Who made the map and the line? Humans. Historically, the borders of China have changed geographical location many times throughout the centuries as well.
Or China as a people? What about all the immigrants and emigrants of China? Are they Chinese or not?
Or China as a ethnic group? Then technically Australia would then be an Aboriginal nation, but of course we are not, because they only make up an obscure minority of the populace.
China doesn't exist. China is only an idea. Much like God.

Wow, I never thought of that argument that way.

+1 sir!