• Want to help us with this year's BoS Trials?
    Let us know before 30 June. See this thread for details
  • Looking for HSC notes and resources?
    Check out our Notes & Resources page

Does God exist? (4 Viewers)

do you believe in god?


  • Total voters
    1,555

moll.

Learn to science.
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,545
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
true, but its not limited to the christian community either. all those things can be provided by others, apart from the spiritual guidance, in which case you can find alternatives
But none of them can be found in such numbers and force as within the Christian community.
Why tell a friend a secret or ask them for emotional guidance, when instead you can communicate with the Creator of the Universe, with the knolwedge that He and His servants have the full weight of universal divinity upon their side.
 

Iron

Ecclesiastical Die-Hard
Joined
Jul 14, 2004
Messages
7,765
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
For all I know you may have solved the riddle and will reap the rewards or you may have found the wrong answers and end up wasting your life.

My question still remains. Why make it so hard to figure out. It is like a course designer/examiner who can't set the right references and reading material.
Free will.
We have the choice to ignore God, but he is accessible to all who seek, through the conscience -an inbuilt radar of right and wrong- and the help of the holy spirit.

If God was revealed in more physical ways, and not just through the Bible/holy spirit/conscience, then there would be no real moral choice made to accept him.
 

Iron

Ecclesiastical Die-Hard
Joined
Jul 14, 2004
Messages
7,765
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
I have sought, sincerely, and not found.




"accepting" god is not a matter or morality.
That's cool, just dont close yourself off to the possibility. Keep the candle burning.

When I said 'moral choice', I merely meant as opposed to a choice made on more physical evidence.
 
Last edited:
K

khorne

Guest
Is there really a point to arguing about this? It's like a boxing match, both parties go in believeing they are the strongest, best and with no intention of surrendering if the oppenent shows they are stronger. After reading 100 or so pages of this thread, I really don't believe people have any intention of changing their beliefs, so what is the point of this? To promote discussion? But discussion is flawed if neither party is willing to embrace new ideas...as the point is to communicate ideas.

I am personally atheist, but religion is fine. However, religion is a private matter, and personal religion or religion loby groups should not be able to sway the government or any other parties (Like with the first cases of stem cell cloning or abortion), as this is, and should be a purely secular society.

As you people say, religion is between you and god, and there is no need to involve others.
 

Iron

Ecclesiastical Die-Hard
Joined
Jul 14, 2004
Messages
7,765
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
A fair few lambs have been led astray by this evil thread, my fren
 
Joined
Feb 6, 2009
Messages
410
Gender
Undisclosed
HSC
N/A
i punched an Evangelical at USYD for trying to convince me to convert to Christianity on the spot. he had a bible so i can put my hand on it and swear Jesus is god.

fucking idiot.
 

Graney

Horse liberty
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Messages
4,434
Location
Bereie
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
Is there really a point to arguing about this? It's like a boxing match, both parties go in believeing they are the strongest, best and with no intention of surrendering if the oppenent shows they are stronger. After reading 100 or so pages of this thread, I really don't believe people have any intention of changing their beliefs, so what is the point of this? To promote discussion? But discussion is flawed if neither party is willing to embrace new ideas...as the point is to communicate ideas.

I am personally atheist, but religion is fine. However, religion is a private matter, and personal religion or religion loby groups should not be able to sway the government or any other parties (Like with the first cases of stem cell cloning or abortion), as this is, and should be a purely secular society.

As you people say, religion is between you and god, and there is no need to involve others.
I don't believe you have read 100 pages of this thread.

You wouldn't say many of the things you just have, if you did.
 

Graney

Horse liberty
Joined
Jul 17, 2007
Messages
4,434
Location
Bereie
Gender
Male
HSC
2005
No, but people are a lot less blind defenders of their particular ideology, and a lot more open minded than you believe. You're far from the first person to romp in and declare "omg there's no point discussing religion".

People are absolutely interested in new ideas.

People like hearing from others about their spirituality, and all parties enjoy this discussion.
 

Cisco-Kid

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Messages
48
Gender
Male
HSC
2009
[/font][/color]
But He can. God is omnipotent, as well as omniscient. Do you honestly think that a mere contradiction in the petty English language (of which the original text was not even written in) is going to stop He who can create energy and matter from a vast expanse of nothingness?


Let us here hypothesise upon the outcome were He to not have placed the tree in the garden.
If He hadn't placed the tree, then He would have been doing so to protect us from our own folly. As logically follows then, He must be forever afterwards obligated to protect us from all potential folly that was to come. In essence, He would have had to lock us within the garden for eternity and deny us any resemblance of free-will to choose our own lives and to learn from our mistakes.
But God loved His creations, and did not wish them to become emotionless slaves within His house. So He, in all His mercy, gave them a choice, even though He knew which one they would choose. He did not create the sin, but merely prevented it from happening, such that His children could live far better lives.
Think of it like a father whose young child desires to buy their own home and move out of their current abode with the father. The father knows that the child will not be able to make it in the world on their own, but still allows him to, with the promise that he will love and support them, no matter what comes about. When these bad things do happen to the child, the father looks on with pity and remorse, yet knows that his child is free to choose their life and will always be welcomed back into the house of their creator, so long as the child can humble themselves in order to make such a choice.



It appears here that you are taking the Bible literally. But to me, Satan represents only an idea. He is temptation and sin personified, and it is only through man's baser nature that such an idea is even possible.
Whilst God undoubtedly shines as the source of all light, Satan is not the source of darkness in this world. He is merely the name given to it. For darkness is only an absence of light, not a seperate entity, in constant battle with it. Darkness only comes about when we humans turn away from the light offered to us and instead start staring at our own shadows.

its in the bible, its gods word

if he knew what we would choose there is no free will, only the illusion of free will...

and yes, i do take the bible literally. doesnt everyone?
 

Cisco-Kid

Member
Joined
Sep 22, 2008
Messages
48
Gender
Male
HSC
2009
my overall point is this though.

make sure the life you lead is the best possible one you lead. EVERYONE wants answers in life. the problem and fact remains - you wont get em. we will never know why we came to be. (i was thinking of this a lot when i was on LSD) :D

hey guys, DOES IT REALLY MATTER? are our lives gonna change if we found out god created us? we'll all what, live till the age of 80? lifes too short to question these things. instead of worrying about this kinda stuff, i worry about how im gonna live my day. since the big bang theory isnt 100% proven, people think god was the creator...thats not just the BBT, anything that cant be proven, it must be the act of god or faith.
 

Kwayera

Passive-aggressive Mod
Joined
May 10, 2004
Messages
5,959
Location
Antarctica
Gender
Female
HSC
2005
since the big bang theory isnt 100% proven, people think god was the creator...thats not just the BBT, anything that cant be proven, it must be the act of god or faith.
Um. Check your working definition of "Theory"*.


* As distinct from the colloquial "theory".
 

moll.

Learn to science.
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,545
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
its in the bible, its gods word
The same Bible which was written by humans? Which was subsequently translated to Greek, then Latin, then Old English, then modern English by humans?
You know, the Chinese have hundreds of different words for "love". We have one. Is it not possible that the true meaning of all three verses which you quoted was lost in translation?

if he knew what we would choose there is no free will, only the illusion of free will...
Just cos you know what someone is thinking doesn't mean the person doesn't have the choice of what to think. Knowledge doesn't mean you have power over them.

and yes, i do take the bible literally. doesnt everyone?
Only idiots.
 

Iron

Ecclesiastical Die-Hard
Joined
Jul 14, 2004
Messages
7,765
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
Big bang theory is the only rigorously tested hypothesis. Sorry, but it's the fact.

Not accepting it is an act of outrageous ignorance.
How is that pacifically inconsistent with creation?
 

Iron

Ecclesiastical Die-Hard
Joined
Jul 14, 2004
Messages
7,765
Gender
Male
HSC
2004
lol Schroe's pretty good value imo
 

moll.

Learn to science.
Joined
Aug 19, 2008
Messages
3,545
Gender
Male
HSC
2008
so religious people are idiots? btw, do you believe in god?
Literalists are idiots. But very few Christians are lieralists. If they were, Christendom would be stoning adulterers and crucifying homosexuals.
What does it matter if I do or not? Your arguments are still fallacious, nonetheless.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Users: 0, Guests: 4)

Top