Homosexuality in Australia (15 Viewers)

[Graney]

It's a legal contract for the benefit of the two people involved ffs. Why do couples that plan to remain childless often form this contract?

Why did homosexual couples pursue legal equality for civil unions? There were all sorts of dramas with homosexual couples to gain recognition from the armed services so they would receive equal pensions, widows rights etc...

It is all about managing finances between families. Having a contract secures the financial relationship between partners.

You are just talking utter garbage, it has no necessary or implied relationship to children.

 

[Name_Taken]

Unions between men and women, raising their own children, the natural family have always been an integrel aspect of human all soceities.

Marriage originally came about as the means to raise children, it was then adapted to relate to finances, but even in such cases of historically arranged marriages etc, children (typically male heirs) were a vital aspect.

Marriage is a legal term, but it is not something that was ever defined by society, it is simply recognised by it.

Marriage (as in, a monagomous unions between man and women) and the family were around before legal contracts and tax benefits.

 

[meeatu]

My point is that marriage is a legal contract, but why should it be so, if not for the benefit of the children, i.e. to promote stability in the relationship and in the case of a divorce, to ensure that their needs are met, both parents getting enough to support them etc. (obviously division of assets is done on a case by case basis, for couples without children for example or w/e, just talking on broad terms).

I'm feeling unloved Mr Name_Taken :[

First of all, let me just say two things:
1) The point of my initial comment was not to point out WHY people get married, but why homosexual marriage should be permitted.
Because on a whole, I agree with you and your questioning of what the legal contract of marriage is and means when it no longer holds religeous relevance.

The point I'm trying to make is, regardless of the significance of marriage as a religous ceremony, or as a civil union/legal contract, marriage as a symbol is deserved by all.

Which raises a question: If matrimonial union outside of what purist christians believe to be gods will is meaningless, what is their issue with homosexuals wanting to be able to claim it? If you believe that a union between a homosexual couple is not recognised as a mariage (Note: "the union between a MAN and a WOMAN under god") by god, then who is harmed by us using the word - as that is all it has become in your eyes, a word.

It seems the equivalent of saying that (in a world with infinite supply) that people who are healthy should not be permitted to eat well balanced diets, because you do not see a need for them too.

But we gays, see a point to our mariage (well... not me, but gays in general).
So why deny the healthy man his vegetables if he likes them?

2) What about my previous question on the whole OT/NT thing?
I'm feeling awfully unloved by your lack of an answer :[

P.S. About the quote above: you forget the rights of a married couple to make decisions for eachother when the other is deemed unnable to (ie: surgery in hospital) etc.

P.P.S. are those such rights included in civil partnerships (between homosexuals)? -I'm not interested in the whole gay marriage issue for myself (only out of sympathy for gays who do actually care) so I am uninformed on such things.

 

[Graney]

Unions between men and women, raising their own children, the natural family have always been an integrel aspect of human all soceities.

Marriage originally came about as the means to raise children, it was then adapted to relate to finances, but even in such cases of historically arranged marriages etc, children (typically male heirs) were a vital aspect.

Marriage is a legal term, but it is not something that was ever defined by society, it is simply recognised by it.

Marriage (as in, a monagomous unions between man and women) and the family were around before legal contracts and tax benefits.

ok cool.

Monogamous homosexual relationships between two men have been around before legal contracts and tax benefits also.

What is your point? I read this post as you backing down from the ignorant point you were trying to make about the relationship between government and marriage, slyly trying to redirect the discussion and hoping no one would notice. You were the one trying to assert the importance of it's legislative status, and now that that opinion has been proven false, you are trying to draw on the relationship outside governance.

 

[meeatu]

Marriage originally came about as the means to raise children

Marriage (as in, a monagomous unions between man and women) and the family were around before legal contracts and tax benefits.

First off: erm... no... That's why the great lord invented sex
And by great lord, i mean the natural forces of nature (see Darwin and the theory of natural selection)

*blinks* and as for your other point... Ding! Correct!
But you forget...
Marriage (in a million different forms) also predates Christianity.
So your point is rendered null and void.
Marriage is defined not by god, but by the society it exists within,
and that society is calling for it to include homosexuals.

 

[Graney]

You were saying heterosexual marriage is proven as significant to society, because it has special legislative status.

Having been rebuffed, now you are attempting to argue from the position that the legislative status of marriage is not key to it's importance.

Having your cake and eating it.

Stop posting.

 

[meeatu]

You were saying heterosexual marriage is proven as significant to society, because it has special legislative status.

Having been rebuffed, now you are attempting to argue from the position that the legislative status of marriage is not key to it's importance.

Having your cake and eating it.

Stop posting.

Nawww... don't frighten him away!
I'm only here for the joy of arguments.
Without him, I'll be bored again, and it will be all your fault!

And then I will come after you and kill you slowly and painfully!


Hurray!

We all know he's wrong anyway, what's fun is arguing it regardless :]

P.S. the cake is a lie anyway, so just let him try

 

[JasmineNuytre]

This thread disgusts me.

How can anyone have a problem with homosexuals?

In fact, how can you people sit here and debate on homosexuality?

If you dont like Gays, piss off seriously.

I have had enough with the conscious and subconsious hatred that goes on through people's mind about Gay people. WE ARE FUCKING HUMAN, we aren't animals, we arent sub class citizens. Treat us with respect even if you dont agree with our "lifestyle choices".

This thread hurts me, as a Gay male, what I have been through, coming on to here and seeing people spread Gay hate, it disgusts me.

I know people will reply to this message with comments like "Fag" or whatever, and thats fine by me, I know that me being Gay was something I was born with, something I can not change. WHO WOULD CHOOSE TO BE GAY?! WHO WOULD CHOOSE A LIFE OF BEING DISCRIMINATED AGAINST AND BEING TREATED AS SUB CLASS CITIZENS?!.


Seriously, this is pathetic.

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

I have had enough with the conscious and subconsious hatred that goes on through people's mind about Gay people. WE ARE FUCKING HUMAN, we aren't animals, we arent sub class citizens. Treat us with respect even if you dont agree with our "lifestyle choices".

"we"???

HELLO :wave:

 

[supercalamari]

If you dont like Gays, piss off seriously.

Yeah, exactly, hello this thread is 'infested' with gays inc. myself :wave:

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

Unions between men and women, raising their own children, the natural family have always been an integrel aspect of human all soceities.

Marriage originally came about as the means to raise children, it was then adapted to relate to finances, but even in such cases of historically arranged marriages etc, children (typically male heirs) were a vital aspect.

Marriage is a legal term, but it is not something that was ever defined by society, it is simply recognised by it.

Marriage (as in, a monagomous unions between man and women) and the family were around before legal contracts and tax benefits.

i can say with utmost certainty that you would not hold such views if you were a homosexual, nor would you be able to find any "christian" homosexual who would possess such views as yourself. Lol, it's easy to sit on your high horse and look down on others, telling them that their desire for love and affection is no more than "perversion" and "immoral lust". I pity you, and others like you, because you will never know anything beyond what you see with your own eyes.

 

[NewiJapper]

WE ARE FUCKING HUMAN

I think us gays should band together not in that way though...


We can create our own bible then convince people its the bee's knees and everyones life would be so much better with it. Oh wait...we already have a bible. Italian vogue XD

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

lol i didn't realise that there are that many homosexuals here!

 

[Name_Taken]

i can say with utmost certainty that you would not hold such views if you were a homosexual, nor would you be able to find any "christian" homosexual who would possess such views as yourself.

Actually you cannot assert this at all... And I have posted links to "ex-gay" people, such as that guy who was the editor of that gay magazine, but then gave up his former life for something more dignified.

Lol, it's easy to sit on your high horse and look down on others, telling them that their desire for love and affection is no more than "perversion" and "immoral lust".

Mate I'm just calling it how it is. I'm not looking down at you as a person, simply conveying an inconvenient Truth. Its not like I or anyone else is asking you to be perfect, but simply not to idle in and glorify your imperfections. You are welcome to say the same back at me.

FFS what I will never understand is how the message against homosexuality is somehow interpreted by anyone as being one agaisnt homosexual people themselves. There is more to you than your sex life (I imagine), stop pretending its like all that you are.

I pity you, and others like you, because you will never know anything beyond what you see with your own eyes.

Haha mate, can I just ask how it is that you are able to see through anyone's eyes other than your own? Oh of course you can, you're not Christian right?

"The Christian ideal has not been tried and found wanting; it has been found difficult and left untried."

- G.K. Chesterton

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

alex hun, there no such thing as an "ex-gay". it is simply preposterous.

 

[Name_Taken]

alex hun, there no such thing as an "ex-gay". it is simply preposterous.

No it isn't at all, how is it?

I would admit there are ex-heteros as well, which are actually well represented in the homosexual community, as people who were in happily married (possibly with kids) before reverting to homosexuality for some reason or another.

Come on, if homosexuality is actually genetic, it would be pretty clear cut, you would think? People have either red or brown hair etc, people should either be gay or straight.

Genes don't change. Consciously chosen behaviours do.

 

[SeCKSiiMiNh]

No it isn't at all, how is it?

I would admit there are ex-heteros as well, which are actually well represented in the homosexual community, as people who were in happily married (possibly with kids) before reverting to homosexuality for some reason or another.

Come on, if homosexuality is actually genetic, it would be pretty clear cut, you would think? People have either red or brown hair etc, people should either be gay or straight.

Genes don't change. Consciously chosen behaviours do.

so you're saying to me, and everyone on this thread, that people have the ability to change their sexuality???

 

[Name_Taken]

so you're saying to me, and everyone on this thread, that people have the ability to change their sexuality???

Didn't say that at all, all I said (which is simply supported by what we can observe); is that it is in fact possible.

 

[JasmineNuytre]

Didn't say that at all, all I said (which is simply supported by what we can observe); is that it is in fact possible.

You make an interesting point.

I do believe all of us have the potential to be Bi-sexual, and I believe most people fall inbetween, I doubt many are strictly hetero or strictly homosexual.

 

[Name_Taken]

You make an interesting point.

I do believe all of us have the potential to be Bi-sexual, and I believe most people fall inbetween, I doubt many are strictly hetero or strictly homosexual.

Ah k, so most gay people are in fact, somewhat attracted to both sexes, its just they exhibit a preference (of varying strength I assume, depending on the individual) for those of the same sex.

Ergo it is a choice...