Israel and Palestine (2 Viewers)

[B_B_J]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

tbqh I always thought Riet was Jew.

lol

 

[Drewx]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

I think the best solution to this is to go all the way back to the British mandate of Palestine. The region was fine up till the time Britain left the area. If these twits can't control their own country properly then the British will have to do it for then. Think about it will be impartial so no group would really have an advantage over the other.

 

[loller]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

ok so why on earth would britain ever want to do that you loon

 

[loquasagacious]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

I don't believe a two state solution will ever work. Its absurd to think that they'll shake hands and then no more fighting, someone will fire a rocket at someone be them government or not and it will all just collapse. A blended solution will be bumpy but i believe they'll get there in the end.

A proportional representation parliamentary system will invariably see a moderate government emerge. Yes there will be zionists and hamas mp's but they will never control a majority, the majority will be won by a party who gets support from another party representing the other race.

I might be optimistic but I expect having full voting rights, being able to walk freely in all of the region, no more enemies cutting power supplies for regions etc will see the arabic population come to be quite supportive of the democracy and will whittle away at Hamas' support.

The Jewish population will probably be less excited as, well they allready had it kind of good. However I believe enough Israeli's are sympathetic and will support a moderate coalition government obviously with a strong police force/paramilitary and as time goes by the incidentsof disrest will reduce and as well support for Likud.

I've mentioned this to a Palestinian/moderate friend of mine and he says both states will have problem with the idea that their people would just be incorporated into the others state to which I proposed calling it "the holy state of Jerusalem. " No Jewish voting areas of arabic voting areas just a complete poll of the state with proportionate representations in a parliament which would not have a jewish or arabic name.

I realise I make it sound all to easy and ofcourse I don't think this will happen without hicoughs but I believe it is the road to go down that will eventually result in a first world country for both groups to live in and over a period of 25-30 years is possible.

My thoughts exactly. A two-state solution won't work because hardliners from both sides will act aggressively and reignite the conflict. Also the occupied territories need to trade with Israel to survive and need a land corridor - both of which are much harder in a two state solution, but the security issue is what really destroys the two state solution.

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

No matter how good your intentions, watch this thread very quickly denigrate to a sledging competition. Will happen even faster if that Jeeee bitch finds this thread sooner, "th3 Zionist enemies R in all our basez. dey control da world, but somhow canot kill us".

While they do exist, I can count the number of pro-Palestinian supporters on this forum ready for a decent debate on the topic and ready to concede arguments as well as to 'win' them at times on one hand. I think the case is similar for the Israeli supporters, although they number far fewer in this forum than their opponents. The rest can be summarised by the very group they reside in; an "anti-Israel" group, rather than a "pro-Palestinian" group, which I think displays their blinding hatred of Israel, rather than their belief in finding a solution.

I once had the ( immense ) pleasure of agreeing with Nebs on something concerned with this. We both agreed that there should be a two state solution, that a Palestinian state should be in Gaza, most of the West Bank and that there should be an international shared zone in East Jerusalem, which would also act as the Palestinian capital.

Found it.

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Nope.

This is the only acceptable solution for land division - the one created before the Jews started stealing the land. Anything else is unacceptable.



I'm still unsure why you think a blended state would be a better solution. Main reason looks to be about security - that's a load of hogwash imo.

I completely agree. They have to give back what they illegally dispossessed. Every last grain of soil. However, it still won't restore all the lives they have taken, the homes they have uprooted, and it will never mend the scar it has left on Palestinian history and its people.

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

palestine should have thought twice about invading israel in 67 then

This dude's an idiot! You obviously no nothing of the conflict. You even got who invaded who wrong. Big LOL.

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Thank god the palestinians aren't an actual state that sanctions the use of civilians as shields and uses their deaths as propoganda.

Firstly, spell propaganda correctly.
Secondly, civilians used as shields is Zionist propaganda. The same propaganda that was used to justify the bombing of the UN school during the recent attacks on Gaza. Why would Hamas need to use Palestinian death as propaganda? Doesn't it speak for itself?

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

This has already happened, it's called Israel. If the palestinians could stop being insular and accept secularism we would have had peace long ago,

Oh, so Israeli fascism appears to be secularism to you?
You disgust me. You have no idea what the situation is like for Palestinians.
Want a miniscule insight of the suffering and injuries Palestinians go through daily, in comparison to Israel's lovely secular progressive and easy life on the other side of the apartheid wall?

 

[Sprangler]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Oh, so Israeli fascism appears to be secularism to you?
You disgust me. You have no idea what the situation is like for Palestinians.
Want a miniscule insight of the suffering and injuries Palestinians go through daily, in comparison to Israel's lovely secular progressive and easy life on the other side of the apartheid wall?

"o no all thoz dead kids n women omg its so sad". I've said it before and I'll say it again. Hamas use the deaths of their own civilians as propaganda in order to get support for their terrorist campaigns. People need to read a history book and see why the palestinians are in the situation they are now, to see why they don't have a homeland. To see why they are in refugee camps in Gaza, the West Bank, Jordan, Lebanon and Syria, where they are treated either as second class citizens with no access to health care, education, or jobs above minimum wage, or they are there with no citizenship at all.

The Jews and the Arabs living in the region had two competing nationalist movements, the Arabs lost and now they don't have a country, and they lost some land with each attempted invasion, that's mostly how war has been through history. You mess with someone bigger than you, you get fucked over. The situation will never change until the Palestinians elect an authority that can actually negotiate, now stop appealing for emotion with omg sad pictures and contribute with some possible peace scenarios.

 

[loller]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

This dude's an idiot! You obviously no nothing of the conflict. You even got who invaded who wrong. Big LOL.

yeah mang totally

Firstly, spell propaganda correctly.
Secondly, civilians used as shields is Zionist propaganda. The same propaganda that was used to justify the bombing of the UN school during the recent attacks on Gaza. Why would Hamas need to use Palestinian death as propaganda? Doesn't it speak for itself?

lol you're correcting someone else's spelling

after you spelt warrior 'worrior' lol

and he is about 100x smarter than you will ever be to start with

 

[Ben Netanyahu]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

The Jews and the Arabs living in the region had two competing nationalist movements, the Arabs lost and now they don't have a country, and they lost some land with each attempted invasion, that's mostly how war has been through history. You mess with someone bigger than you, you get fucked over. The situation will never change until the Palestinians elect an authority that can actually negotiate, now stop appealing for emotion with omg sad pictures and contribute with some possible peace scenarios.

Germany has been returned to the Germans.
Palestine has not been returned to the Palestinians - almost all of whom live there right now HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH THOSE INVASIONS BUT STILL LIVE IN POVERTY THANKS TO ISRAEL YOU STUPID NIMROD MORON CUNT

You're advocating the continued mistreatment of the Palestinians through the denial of their land because "oh it's always been like that", which is an utterly moronic way to look at the situation. Stop being a staunch, immovable cunt. The reason why real solutions aren't found is because the people in Israel have the same demented, dumbfuck views that you have. Sod off.

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

"o no all thoz dead kids n women omg its so sad". I've said it before and I'll say it again. Hamas use the deaths of their own civilians as propaganda in order to get support for their terrorist campaigns.

Palestinian death is not used as propaganda. Like I said, a death speaks for itself. The attacks on Palestine is powerful rhetoric alone. During the 08/09 attacks on Gaza, the information about the recent attacks on Gaza could not have been manipulated by Palestinians, but only by the Zionists since who underexaggerated the situation and attempted to justify one of the infinite war crimes they had evidently committed - the use of white phosphorous - by claiming 'it was not illegal.' It is quite frivolous that you continually refer to Hamas as the terrorists - are you still not quite sure what Israel and the entire Zionist regime is responsible for? It's about time they were indicted.

People need to read a history book and see why the palestinians are in the situation they are now, to see why they don't have a homeland. To see why they are in refugee camps in Gaza, the West Bank, Jordan, Lebanon and Syria, where they are treated either as second class citizens with no access to health care, education, or jobs above minimum wage, or they are there with no citizenship at all.

Those history books have been picked up and read. State your facts, and put them forward instead of demanding us to read nameless history books - unless you were referring to Israel's Global Language Project? Insightful historical detail. Ha.
The Diaspora across the Middle East occurred due to the invasion of Israel - haven't you heard? Palestinians fled or were expelled from their homes by the Jewish/Israeli forces, during the creation of the state of Israel. To add the 1948 onwards Palestinian exodus Diaspora, many Palestinians migrated to Lebanon because of the Black September massacre in Jordan and the expulsion of the Palestinians and PLO. Due to the sectarian political division in Lebanon, with the Maronites positioned as head of state, the Palestinians were forbidden normal living conditions, and this is partly due to the 1982 Sabra and Shatila massacre where the Phalangists were allied with Israel, hence there is still a subtle alliance existing between the two. The core of the problem stems from Israel. Watch Ari Folman's documentary 'Waltz with Bashir.'

The Jews and the Arabs living in the region had two competing nationalist movements, the Arabs lost and now they don't have a country, and they lost some land with each attempted invasion, that's mostly how war has been through history. You mess with someone bigger than you, you get fucked over. The situation will never change until the Palestinians elect an authority that can actually negotiate, now stop appealing for emotion with omg sad pictures and contribute with some possible peace scenarios.

The situation will never change until Israel pulls out and end their fascist Zionist regime. I’m not appealing for any emotion. As words and rhetoric are used to express fact, so are images.

 

[loller]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Palestinian death is not used as propaganda. Like I said, a death speaks for itself. The attacks on Palestine is powerful rhetoric alone. During the 08/09 attacks on Gaza, the information about the recent attacks on Gaza could not have been manipulated by Palestinians, but only by the Zionists since who underexaggerated the situation and attempted to justify one of the infinite war crimes they had evidently committed - the use of white phosphorous - by claiming 'it was not illegal.' It is quite frivolous that you continually refer to Hamas as the terrorists - are you still not quite sure what Israel and the entire Zionist regime is responsible for? It's about time they were indicted.



Those history books have been picked up and read. State your facts, and put them forward instead of demanding us to read nameless history books - unless you were referring to Israel's Global Language Project? Insightful historical detail. Ha.
The Diaspora across the Middle East occurred due to the invasion of Israel - haven't you heard? Palestinians fled or were expelled from their homes by the Jewish/Israeli forces, during the creation of the state of Israel. To add the 1948 onwards Palestinian exodus Diaspora, many Palestinians migrated to Lebanon because of the Black September massacre in Jordan and the expulsion of the Palestinians and PLO. Due to the sectarian political division in Lebanon, with the Maronites positioned as head of state, the Palestinians were forbidden normal living conditions, and this is partly due to the 1982 Sabra and Shatila massacre where the Phalangists were allied with Israel, hence there is still a subtle alliance existing between the two. The core of the problem stems from Israel. Watch Ari Folman's documentary 'Waltz with Bashir.'



The situation will never change until Israel pulls out and end their fascist Zionist regime. I’m not appealing for any emotion. As words and rhetoric are used to express fact, so are images.

citation needed

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

citation needed

1948 Palestinian exodus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
YouTube - Waltz With Bashir Trailer
Black September - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Israel Project's 2009 Global Language Dictionary | Newsweek.com
Sabra and Shatila massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2009/03/25/israel-white-phosphorus-use-evidence-war-crimes

 

[loller]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

wikipedia, hardly a very reliable source

hey i was just commenting on how i found it hilarious that you would pick on other peoples spelling after you did that lol

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

wikipedia, hardly a very reliable source

hey i was just commenting on how i found it hilarious that you would pick on other peoples spelling after you did that lol

Actually Wikipedia has become a very reliable source. It contains footnotes and references that you can refer to and double check, and it is usually always very impartial and succinct. My teacher *identity remains disclosed* who a lot of you doing the HSC over the years most likely met, credited Wikipedia.

If you found that hilarious then you have a shit taste in humour.

Anyway, stop moving away from the actual topic with your trolling antics. Either have something worthwhile to contribute or f!@# off.

 

[loquasagacious]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Anyway, stop moving away from the actual topic with your trolling antics. Either have something worthwhile to contribute or f!@# off.

And in your opinion would a two-state solution work?

 

[JonathanM]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

1948 Palestinian exodus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
YouTube - Waltz With Bashir Trailer
Black September - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
The Israel Project's 2009 Global Language Dictionary | Newsweek.com
Sabra and Shatila massacre - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
http://www.hrw.org/en/news/2009/03/25/israel-white-phosphorus-use-evidence-war-crimes

Again, I loved the balanced, unbiased sources. It's always hard to discuss a topic with someone who not only cites You Tube and Wikipedia as fact, but also completely removes them from context.

Germany has been returned to the Germans.

Citation?

Germany was not 'handed over' to the Germans. Secondary level history would teach you that it lost huge amounts of land it had occupied prior to World War 2 and that even after this loss, it was then separated into 2 states (one of which was occupied by the Soviets). Not to mention the huge change in government and leadership (and that it was demilitarised for a long period of time). Also by implication, your statement does sound like "Germany was returned to the Nazi's," clarify moar pl0x.

Firstly, spell propaganda correctly.
Secondly, civilians used as shields is Zionist propaganda. The same propaganda that was used to justify the bombing of the UN school during the recent attacks on Gaza. Why would Hamas need to use Palestinian death as propaganda? Doesn't it speak for itself?

Wow. You're telling him off for incorrect spelling? I think you should learn to think, more like it.

Not going to bother replying to the rest of your post, because I can't possibly put into words how stupid you are. Why do you bother posting, if not just to satisfy your own ego? The measured, intelligent people you seek to convince are probably bowled over by statements like the above. Your attitude, I think, is summed up by this quote:

"If Algeria introduced a resolution declaring that the earth was flat and that Israel had flattened it, it would pass by a vote of 164 to 13 with 26 abstentions. "(by Abba Eban)

 

[Jeee]

Re: Peace in Israel-Palestine

Not going to bother replying to the rest of your post, because I can't possibly put into words how stupid you are. Why do you bother posting, if not just to satisfy your own ego? The measured, intelligent people you seek to convince are probably bowled over by statements like the above. Your attitude, I think, is summed up by this quote:

"If Algeria introduced a resolution declaring that the earth was flat and that Israel had flattened it, it would pass by a vote of 164 to 13 with 26 abstentions. "(by Abba Eban)

When somebody isn't 'bothered' replying during a discussion, it's because they can't think of anything to say.
Go ahead, ad hominem away. You clearly have no argument or anything to say.