Legalising Gay Marriage: The Netherlands, Belgium, Canada and Spain (1 Viewer)

[Ollz San]

I'd be very interested in hearing your thoughts on the recent news about Canada and Spain legalising gay marriage.

 

[Rafy]

Well they are beginning to change their laws to match the shifting societal mores on the issue. The opposition to gay marriages is becoming increasingly thin, with the ulta conservative and religious right making most of the noise......Its good to see that these countries have not succumbed to the pressure of the minority.

 

[paper cup]

Well they are beginning to change their laws to match the shifting societal more on the issue. The opposition to gay marriages is becoming increasingly thin, with the ulta conservative and religious right making most of the noise......Its good to see that these countries have not succumbed to the pressure of the minority.

the pressure of which minority?
homosexuals are the minority in every country :S

 

[shady_03]

Well they are beginning to change their laws to match the shifting societal more on the issue. The opposition to gay marriages is becoming increasingly thin, with the ulta conservative and religious right making most of the noise......Its good to see that these countries have not succumbed to the pressure of the minority.

very tru, i dont see nething wrong with it, society is deeming it more acceptable and the country is moving along with the trends. I don't really see why gay marriage is different then other marriages (besides the obvious), it has the same fundamental principles as regular marriages, so why ban it?

 

[Rafy]

the pressure of which minority?
homosexuals are the minority in every country :S

I'm talking about the VIEW/OPINION of the population on homosexual marriages.

 

[withoutaface]

I'd be very interested in hearing your thoughts on the recent news about Canada and Spain legalising gay marriage.

I find it rather surprising, given the overwhelming majority of Spanairds are Catholics.

 

[Rafy]

True that, Although i find that many catholics are becoming increasingly tired of having dated traditional views of how to run their lives being dictated to them from rome.

 

[Ollz San]

They do have a very powerful Roman Catholic Church though.

That was a really nice surprise, I'd say

 

[Xayma]

I find it rather surprising, given the overwhelming majority of Spanairds are Catholics.

"However, polls suggest Spaniards supported gay marriage. A survey released in May by pollster Instituto Opina said 62 percent of Spaniards support the government's action on gay marriage, and 30 percent oppose it. The poll had a margin of error of 3 percentage points."

Source: http://www.cnn.com/2005/WORLD/europe/06/30/spain.gay.vote.ap/

It differs in various countries but.

Civil unions are generally alot more acceptable, NZ's model is quite good (with 1/3 of those with civil unions being straight couples). Spains model allowed EVERYTHING, adoption and all.

 

[paper cup]

if it suits Spain then I've got no problems with it.

 

[Bambul]

There's often quite a disconnect today between many Catholics and the Catholic heirachy. So you might have Catholic Bishops and Cardinals saying and preaching one thing, but meanwhile the lay person believes something completely different. For example there was a bit of friction in the 2004 US presidential election when John Kerry (who is a Catholic) disagreed with the Pope's position on abortion.

Also, a lot of people are Catholic on paper, but may go to Church only one or two times a year. A lot of them would feel antagonistic towards the Catholic Church due to its compliance with the Franco regime. However, there is still a very religious core of Catholics in Spain and they are the ones opposed to the changes.

 

[White Rabbit]

I'm all for having gay rights in the form of civil unions, adoption and all the legal rights associated with being legally 'bound' to another person.

That said, I don't think 'Gay Marraiges' should exist. Enter into Unions, have ALL rights applicable to hetrosexual couples extended to homosexual couples, but marriage has always been something conected with the church, and is a union between a male and female. I know that many see this idea as out-dated, but it's how I feel. I have many gay friends, and would love to see them happy and joined to someone someday, but preferably through a civil union, in which they are recognised the same way under the law as those who are married, and have the rights applicable to joined couples under the law, but I don't think marriage is the answer.

*waits for the flames to begin*

 

[HotShot]

organising marijuana is way to go! First legalize marijuana then the GAYS!. The world would beso much better with legalized drugs, terrorists will be happy and saddam and bush would be glad to. The communists will be euphoric and the penguins too,

 

[Xayma]

And this isn't coming from the opinion of someone who hates gays..

Yet you oppose giving them rights?

You oppose giving rights to the disabled? Elderly?

 

[Generator]

The concept of marriage is dynamic, and culturally diverse, so to 'tie it down' as a religious/abrahamic institution of traditional value doesn't make much sense in the wider scheme of things. However, that's not going to stop people using such an argument.

I'm sure that neo_o will respond soon (this must be the fourth? thread discussing the issue of gay marriage in general).

 

[neo o]

The concept of marriage is dynamic, and culturally diverse, so to 'tie it down' as a religious/abrahamic institution of traditional value doesn't make much sense in the wider scheme of things. However, that's not going to stop people using such an argument.

I'm sure that neo_o will respond soon (this must be the fourth? thread discussing the issue of gay marriage in general).

I've been watching this thread keenly , TBH the legislation in Canada and Spain changes nothing, what's good for Canada and Spain isn't necessarily good for Australia (for anyone keen on saying that it is, using the same logic I could justify that Saudi laws outlawing homosexuality should be applied here).

Anyway, rehashed arguments :

1) Giving an additional right to a minority group which demeans the traditional values of others is naughty. Draws parallel with allowing polygamy for Mormons.
2) Allowing couples in "unique" relationships to adopt is also naughty, the welfare of the child must always be paramount. There is no credible proof that such an adoption WOULDN'T (or would really) harm a child. IMO it isn't something which wouldn't gel with Australians in general anyway.
3) Purpose of marriage argument.

Homosexual couples in Australia currently have as many rights as any de facto couple (which are quite broad in NSW). If they want the same legal privelages as a married couple, IMO they should be welcome to them... under a civil union, which doesn't impinge upon the values of other people.

 

[Xayma]

1) Giving an additional right to a minority group which demeans the traditional values of others is naughty. Draws parallel with allowing polygamy for Mormons.
2) Allowing couples in "unique" relationships to adopt is also naughty, the welfare of the child must always be paramount. There is no credible proof that such an adoption WOULDN'T (or would really) harm a child. IMO it isn't something which wouldn't gel with Australians in general anyway.
3) Purpose of marriage argument.

Homosexual couples in Australia currently have as many rights as any de facto couple (which are quite broad in NSW). If they want the same legal privelages as a married couple, IMO they should be welcome to them... under a civil union, which doesn't impinge upon the values of other people.

The mormon group broke apart from polygamy awhile back. What is interesting is the USA largely ignored breakaway polygamy until child abuse allegations came in.

 

[2sense]

Gay Marriage should be condemned. Gay people have the right to be gay but the definition of marriage is a union between a man and his wife. We can't just change the definition of a marriage to suit a minority group.

 

[paper cup]

ah huh and I think that argument is rather relevant to Australia as well. Because we're situated in the Asia Pacific where a lot of countries have not accepted homosexuality (Malaysia, Singapore and so on) legitimising gay marriage here wouldn't be good for diplomatic relations.
But like Gen has said, done many times. thread starter should have dug up old thread and posted there.

 

[Xayma]

Cherryblossom that is rather poor reasoning. Should middle eastern countries hold back on giving rights to women because their neighbours condem it?