No more DFEE?? (3 Viewers)

[BackCountrySnow]

Is the rudd gov't getting rid of dfee places??
if so, will it apply to us 08ers?

 

[Arithela]

i heard about that too and was also wondering if it is really going to apply next year for us 08ers. if they do abolish dfee places, i wonder what will happen to cut-offs? more CSP places available = lower cut-offs?

 

[withoutaface]

Probably slightly lower cutoffs, but yes, International students now have access to an option which you don't

 

[Arithela]

are they getting rid of dfee places for SURE?

 

[Triangulum]

are they getting rid of dfee places for SURE?

It has consistently been ALP policy and Julia Gillard mentioned that it was on the agenda a couple of months ago, but there hasn't been any legislation yet.

 

[jackmurray1989]

I can't wait for DFEE places to be abolished and have univerity places based on merit.

 

[BackCountrySnow]

if they do abolish dfee places, i wonder what will happen to cut-offs? more CSP places available = lower cut-offs?

yeah, that's my guess.

International students now have access to an option which you don't

could you please explain further??

 

[jackmurray1989]

could you please explain further??

He's saying that international students have the 'option' of full-fee courses and that's not fair because Australian students were born in the lucky country and therefore have right over anyone else, but that's bullshit because it's not an option. They have to pay full-fee.

This debate always comes up every few months and the people with the rich daddies say that DFEE places are fair and legitimate and anyone else with half a brain argues that university places should be based on merit.

The Rudd government will reimburse the universities all the funds they'll lose from having all CSP places, so there's no authoritative argument for DFEE places. But don't try telling that to anyone from the Eastern suburbs.

 

[Loz_metalhead]

What about the people who get just below the cut off? Did you ever think of that? International students who can hardly speak a word of English have an advantage because their parents will pay for them to come here.

 

[Loz_metalhead]

I would also like to see Australian citizens in our uni's.

 

[jake2.0]

If you get below the cut off, you get below the cut off i suppose. I'd like to see them fill courses up with australian students before accepting international students, use them as a filler or something.

You realise that your HECS fees will rise if the amount of full fee paying domestic/internationals decreases. Sure the government is saying that they'll reimburse the funds lost due to the DFEE cut but the unis won't survive if international student places are cut.

And whats with all you guys so opposed to having international students around in uni? I mean sure they might not speak the most fluent english but most (if not all) and hold up their end of the conversation, and dare i say are much nicer then some of the local slobs who think they are king shit.

 

[Gay Captain]

He's saying that international students have the 'option' of full-fee courses and that's not fair because Australian students were born in the lucky country and therefore have right over anyone else, but that's bullshit because it's not an option. They have to pay full-fee.

This debate always comes up every few months and the people with the rich daddies say that DFEE places are fair and legitimate and anyone else with half a brain argues that university places should be based on merit.

The Rudd government will reimburse the universities all the funds they'll lose from having all CSP places, so there's no authoritative argument for DFEE places. But don't try telling that to anyone from the Eastern suburbs.

everything i want should be free because i don't much fancy the eastern suburbs or the folks who reside there

if we were all poor at least i wouldn't have to be insecure about my lack of ambition and work ethic

 

[Loz_metalhead]

And whats with all you guys so opposed to having international students around in uni?

Alot of them go back to their home country and do not contribute to the Australian labour force

 

[blue_chameleon]

Alot of them go back to their home country and do not contribute to the Australian labour force

All the Big4 accounting firms (with exception to PwC), are allowing starting from this year, recruitment of International Students.

OH NOES, THEY'RE COMING!

 

[aileenli]

Well, make it such that people who want to DFEE go to special DFEE universities - like BOND etc. It makes it easier for the employer to decide which student bummed out their HSC and has a rich daddy to pay for everything.

On the other hand, there isn't much of a difference between DFEE and CSP students - apart from the fact that CSP students happen to ace their HSC and pay a subsidised fee. Also, the HSC is a shit indicator of a person's intelligence, so you can't exactly say that the person who gets in on 'merit' is better than the next full fee paying domestic/international student. In the end, the CSP, DFEE, and INT student all sit the same exam.

(UNLESS its Macquarie University, which has this shitty little loophole called SIBT)

 

[blakegman]

Also, the HSC is a shit indicator of a person's intelligence, so you can't exactly say that the person who gets in on 'merit' is better than the next full fee paying domestic/international student. In the end, the CSP, DFEE, and INT student all sit the same exam.

If they weren't better, they wouldn't have achieved the marks to get CSP opposed to a DFEE. Might not be smarter or more intelligent, but they are better which is what matters really.

 

[el gwapo]

...and what matters is quite frankly flawed system that rewards memorization and the ability to hire $80/hour tutors.

 

[BackCountrySnow]

...and what matters is quite frankly flawed system that rewards memorization and the ability to hire $80/hour tutors.

not all subjects reward memorisation all that well though..
I agree with your second point though, a lot of kids don't really have an outstanding ability in their subjects but are still able to do quite well due to the help of their tutors.

 

[PF]

...and what matters is quite frankly flawed system that rewards memorization and the ability to hire $80/hour tutors.

1 of the hsc subjects most famous for scaling: mathematics ext 2, pure memorization here would almost guarantee you a fail. not everyone tutors, and tutoring doesn't guarantee you higher marks. some students overload with tutoring and it weighs them down instead. in my hsc year -

http://www.smh.com.au/news/national/full-marks-for-trying-but-100-doesnt-guarantee-place-at-uni/2006/12/20/1166290613847.html

Michael Krigstein of Moriah College is also hoping his 100 will arm him for entry into medicine.

His mother: "I'm proud to say that he got that mark without any outside coaching," she said. "He's very bright and he worked very hard. It just shows you can get 100 without tutoring."

lol he was obviously psychotically smart.. that is crazy.. but if 80$ tutors would guarantee anyone higher marks, how did he get to the top? shouldn't every 100'er have had five-star tutoring?

 

[scarybunny]

...and what matters is quite frankly flawed system that rewards memorization and the ability to hire $80/hour tutors.

So true. It's funny because those who rely on tutors end up having a really hard time at uni because (shock) they're not getting spoon-fed. I mean the HSC is already a ridiculous regurgitationfest, but tutors pretty much tell you exactly what to write.

The worst thing is kids getting tutors to get into OPPORTUNITY CLASSES. Fuck off, average kid's parents. Leave the OC classes to the actual advanced kids, who can keep up with the work.

Grr tutors.

Edit- to above, some people are actually smart. People need tutors to tell them what they couldn't figure out for themselves.