Roman Catholicism (2 Viewers)

[erin_tonkin]

My friends and I were having a discussion in class today about the Roman Catholic religion and indeed all "christian" religions. Points raised were

-how do you know if your religion is doing the right thing?
-the significance of Mary and should we need her to help pray for our sins?
-what makes a christian?
-things about candles, raising hands, laying hands, singing etc
-if Roman Catholics believe Mary is so important are they christians?
-denominations in general

This is not a chance to diss religious people but a chance for Roman Catholics and Christians to discuss differences and to understand each other.

 

[withoutaface]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

I rate Roman Catholics over Pentecostals, if it's any concession.

 

[withoutaface]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

*Roman Catholicism

*Schizophrenia

 

[erin_tonkin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

This is not a chance to diss religious people but a chance for Roman Catholics and Christians to discuss differences and to understand each other.

guys please. try to be intelligent

 

[Rafy]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

"the fault line that separates genuine spirituality from empty religious dogma"
There is no real spirituality in Roman Catholisisim. Its just a massive flock of sheep guided by a mindless dogmatic overture.
The entire concept of dogma disturbs me.

(Also see my next post further down, if you have misinterpreted my 2nd sentence)

 

[Enlightened_One]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

Interesting...

When it comes to how do you know if your religion is right I guess it comes down to a conscientious choice. i.e. Deep down you know what is right and when a conflict arises you must ask yourself what is truly right.

But, given that this society was founded upon Christian values and that they have been at work for thousands of years, and that we are raised in this society, hence isn't our conscience, our deep down feeling of what is right and wrong based upon the original teachings of Christianity anyway....

Or is there something more, do people inherently know what is right or wrong.


By the way, this is what worries me about the trend away from all things religious (Christinanity in particular). If society's morals are only a reflection of thousands of years of Christian teaching, and if each person's morals and ideals are but a reflection of that society, won't we our morals be corrupted without the guiding force of religion? Won't we all end up materialistic, petty, uncaring beings in a materialistic, petty, uncaring society?

 

[davin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

i'd think their view of the virgin mary doesn't make them "not christian" since the importance of mary is tied to jesus.

 

[erin_tonkin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

i think that people know what is right and wrong in our conciences no matter what they might say in court. yet upon understanding a book like the bible which has been round for so long and comes under so many different views.
I believe that the divisions in the christian church are needless and based on secondary points on the religion. I thought that christian people believed in jesus and that was what mattered and made them christian not going to church not taking the eucharist not lighting candles or raising ur hands etc.

I would hope that some sort of moral system might continue in society today. It seems that most government and laws are governed upon christian teaching ie love one another do not steal murder etc. although it is visible that people are becoming more materialistic, living for themselves and using posessions to cover up the fact that they might die.

Terrible_spellor. Roman catholicisim may seem like a small thing and not a REAL problem but i managed to have an hour discussion about it in which people got really worked up about and it was only ended when we all had to catch different busses to go home

 

[erin_tonkin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

there is a really interesting site on mary

http://www.carm.org/catholic/mary.htm

if u cant be bothered to go to it it talks about mary and how yes she was the mother of God and probably a very nice woman but the R.C church has turned her into what she wasnt.
they claim she was sinless
a virgin all her life
and some other things which the bible does not support.

Yeah the site can probably say it better than i can

 

[davin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

erin, i'd say you've a generally, well, naive view on it. small differences lead to big, big problems in religion. a lot of it comes down to interpretations on religion and it is something people take seriously. too much of the time, there's a focus on proving one's religion and that its infallible that the bigger picture is often missed.

Mary gave birth to Christ without having known a man's touch - that's true.
But she did have a husband. And do you really think he'd have stayed
married to her all those years if he wasn't getting laid? The nature of God
and the Virgin Birth - those are leaps of faith. But believing a wife never
humped her husband - that's just gullibility.

 

[yy]

Re: Catholicism

you should do studies of religion.
my point of view:
-you're brought up this way, faith, people tell you so
-mary gave birth to jesus, and she was supposed to be pure or something, but that's it
-christians follow the teachings of bible and believe in jesus christ
-rituals and symbols are an important part of religious experinces, but not essential, to be a true chrisitian, you just have to follow the bible and believe in jesus christ, however rituals can leave a lasting impression (should get out my SOR notes from last year)
-yes, catholics are still christians, as they believe in jesus christ
-denominations arise due to schisms over differences in interpretation of the bible and different emphasis of aspects of religion, e.g. rituals, experiences, laws

 

[frog12986]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

Here's one for you..

Are Jews a race, bloodline or religious collective?

-Most Jewish people who reside in the Holy Land do not recognise or identify themselves as Israeli, but rather as race..

-Now how can a converted follower of Judaism possibly consider themselves to be "Jewish" if the mainstream recognise it as a racial identity..

-Another question then arises.."How can a group of people that is not a race or particular bloodline be the 'chosen' people of God, if in fact it is a distinction based purely on religious grounds". Moreover, if the 'promised' land has been entitled to those of 'Jewish extract', how can that be so, when once again, it is an identity based upon religious beliefs to which many peopel are born into...

A complex and at times, confusing discussion..

 

[walrusbear]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

There is no real spirituality in Roman Catholisisim. Its just a massive flock of sheep guided by a mindless dogmatic overture.

i'd wager that's just plain wrong
it has a fair share of fundamentalists much like any other but countless theologians and spiritually centred clergy/lay people exist in the catholic church
as much as any other

 

[nwatts]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

i'd wager that's just plain wrong
it has a fair share of fundamentalists much like any other but countless theologians and spiritually centred clergy/lay people exist in the catholic church
as much as any other

Fundamentalism isn't about being led mindlessly. You haven't refuted or commented on Rafy's comments at all. Besides, because of Catholicism's deep roots in tradition, there are far more latent and spiritually-void "members" of the church than any other denomination.

 

[davin]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

Here's one for you..

Are Jews a race, bloodline or religious collective?

-Most Jewish people who reside in the Holy Land do not recognise or identify themselves as Israeli, but rather as race..

-Now how can a converted follower of Judaism possibly consider themselves to be "Jewish" if the mainstream recognise it as a racial identity..

-Another question then arises.."How can a group of people that is not a race or particular bloodline be the 'chosen' people of God, if in fact it is a distinction based purely on religious grounds". Moreover, if the 'promised' land has been entitled to those of 'Jewish extract', how can that be so, when once again, it is an identity based upon religious beliefs to which many peopel are born into...

A complex and at times, confusing discussion..

aside from horribly off-topic, you also have no actual arguement, and ignore that many secular people label themselves as Jewish even though they are not actually religious, as while not typical, Jewish is a term that has both a religious definition and a definition referring to a specific ethnic group.

 

[walrusbear]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

Fundamentalism isn't about being led mindlessly. You haven't refuted or commented on Rafy's comments at all. Besides, because of Catholicism's deep roots in tradition, there are far more latent and spiritually-void "members" of the church than any other denomination.

fundamentalism is a word i'd use for that strain of 'dogmatic' thinking because it dwells in literalism
it's an unfair word but i use it because i don't like fundamentalism

if you look at Rafy's original post he suggests that there is 'NO' spirituality and that it's 'JUST' full of 'mindless sheep'. no ones going to deny the existence of such people, but i have issues with how absolute his points are.

you yourself have finished your post with another generalisation that's incorrect. how can you prove that there is more of this thinking in catholicism than other christian denominations? pointing to the 'traditions' of catholicism is no argument.

i'd be interested to know what you mean by 'spirituality' - as i'd argue that many of the younger christian denominations skirt this part of religious practice.

 

[nwatts]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

fundamentalism is a word i'd use for that strain of 'dogmatic' thinking because it dwells in literalism
it's an unfair word but i use it because i don't like fundamentalism

if you look at Rafy's original post he suggests that there is 'NO' spirituality and that it's 'JUST' full of 'mindless sheep'. no ones going to deny the existence of such people, but i have issues with how absolute his points are.

you yourself have finished your post with another generalisation that's incorrect. how can you prove that there is more of this thinking in catholicism than other christian denominations? pointing to the 'traditions' of catholicism is no argument.

i'd be interested to know what you mean by 'spirituality' - as i'd argue that many of the younger christian denominations skirt this part of religious practice.

walrusbear, you'd argue till the cows came home. You need to - a) start from the letter A in an english dictionary and work through the entire thing, b) learn to keep your mouth shut when you have no clue on the topic at hand, and c) learn to revise over your posts before they're submitted.

Anyone with the most menial level of understanding into Catholicism and/or Christianity could rip your crap apart in an instant. So do everyone a favour and don't confront anyone with it again? Unless, of course, you change your ways according to my 3-point plan outlined above.

 

[walrusbear]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

why don't you actually argue a point?
since my points are so obviously incorrect and anyone with menial knowledge could supposedly 'rip my crap apart' why don't you go for it?

i don't pretend to know everything but i have a fair amount of exposure to catholicism and many people involved in it
i'm suggesting most people here are operating off a common stereotype of 'catholicism' or at best one highly emphasised segment of a very large church

 

[walrusbear]

-how do you know if your religion is doing the right thing?

i think the notion of a particular religion being 'right' more than others is beside the point
there obviously is no 'right' religion
at the core of all of them is an approach to living that i think is summed in the christian traditions by 'love god and love others'.
the differences between religions seem peripheral and almost trivial outside of this goal. the cultural associations and rituals of each religion is really a framework for expressing spirituality.
i think sometimes the newer christian denominations get bogged down in the semantics of dogma and ritual. to the point where churches like hillsong seem to fetishise the act of worship itself.

 

[lucky8star]

Re: Roman Catholisisim

I love the banner ads on this page. Its quite true as well.

"the fault line that separates genuine spirituality from empty religious dogma"

There is no real spirituality in Roman Catholisisim. Its just a massive flock of sheep guided by a mindless dogmatic overture.

The entire concept of dogma disturbs me.

I am R0oman catholic, and do I see myself as religious? I probably do.. But my faith does NOT lack spirituality and NOOOO we are NOT a massive flock of sheep quided by a mindless dogmatic overture. You obviously don't understand the Catholic Faith.

By the way, are there any yound catholics out there? Can't wait till WORLD YOUTH DAY 2008, IN SYDNEY W000T!!