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Wagner (1 Viewer)

Iron

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I stumbled across The Ring cycle, and it's freaking consuming me.
Similar plot to Lord of the Rings.
Not opera
Not classical
Not really Nazi
Fucking fantastic. Height of Western Civilisation.

Any other Wagnerheads? If not, I encourage you to avoid him.
he's my precious (etc)

 
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Iron

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Philistine!

When it comes to music, there's only Beethoven and Wagner.
This is common knowledge
 

Iron

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No, the Russian's are essentially degenerate
 

_dhj_

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The best period is Baroque
Best composer is Scarlatti
 

Iron

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_dhj_ said:
The best period is Baroque
Best composer is Scarlatti
If it's not Baroque, dont fix it. a-hawhawhawhawhaw
But i'm slightly ashamed to admit that Scarlatti is alien to me dear dhj
Give me the romantics anyday.
 

_dhj_

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Iron said:
If it's not Baroque, dont fix it. a-hawhawhawhawhaw
But i'm slightly ashamed to admit that Scarlatti is alien to me dear dhj
Give me the romantics anyday.
ahhahaa... I'm not a big fan of the romantics tbh. Baroque period produced better music because they were limited by the instruments they had at the time (e.g. harpsichord, organ) the beauty had to be intrinsic in the score. Romantics relied mostly on the technological advances that allowed music to be played faster and louder, and you kinda lose some of the musical subtlety.
 

Iron

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_dhj_ said:
ahhahaa... I'm not a big fan of the romantics tbh. Baroque period produced better music because they were limited by the instruments they had at the time (e.g. harpsichord, organ) the beauty had to be intrinsic in the score. Romantics relied mostly on the technological advances that allowed music to be played faster and louder, and you kinda lose some of the musical subtlety.

And I say the Romantics brought greater, more intense emotional expression than your stuffy old rigid clergymen!
 

Iron

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Iron said:
Philistine!

When it comes to music, there's only Beethoven and Wagner.
This is common knowledge
On second thoughts, this list must include Mahler. I have fought him long enough. You win Gustav!

 
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I saw a Wagner opera a few months ago...Tannhauser I think it was called.

Pretty unoriginal and boring :(



I'd have to agree with dhj though - romantics ftw...and also Ravel.
 

Iron

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Silver Persian said:
I saw a Wagner opera a few months ago...Tannhauser I think it was called.

Pretty unoriginal and boring :(



I'd have to agree with dhj though - romantics ftw...and also Ravel.
Wagner changed everything about music. He is the architect. If you found nothing great about the Pilgrim's chorus, then your tastes are corrupted beyond repair.
 
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Why have you gone from left leaning humanist relativist type character to parodying social conservatives iron?? :(
 

Iron

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I dont know Silver Persian. I often ask myself the same question. Alone at night, the glaring eye of introspection cannot be fought back. I guess balance has always been important to me. I've always seen it as an almost sacred duty to hear out the other side in silence and with respect. If i'm honest, I think that i'm discovering that conservative arguments are more in line with my world view - and that world view is taking a more solid and confident shape.

I believe in God and I believe in fundermental human rights. I dont think the two can be satisfactorily seporated. I also am softening on the argument that government is good, when the total balance sheet of history suggests that more government is always bad. Local organisations, community, family, childhood friends - these are the pillars on which a society is founded; not an enlightened leader lecturing them on how to live.

To further bear my soul, i've never felt fully comfortable in this era. I also think that it is a duty to resist things that seem degrating to me, such as pornography, masturbation, excessive satire, unrefined music, binge drinking, faithlessness, apathy. I am very adamant that Western societies have been corrupted by commercialism and materialism. If youre young and good-looking, the world is your oyster; the rest depends on what little effort you want to expend. But if youre unattractive and/or old, then people dont want to know you, and theyre not very subtle about it either. We've been conditioned to want only what is new, fresh, perfect, convenient - what serves our interests above all else.

Compassion has always been crucial to my life due to my faith. Being at uni for 3 years, I notice how desporately lonely a great deal of people are. Everyone just wants to be loved, have intimacy with a foundation of friendship. I think we've forgotten a lot of manners - how to meet people, be charming, respectful. Most people are totally insensitive to the basic wants of others. We've forgotten how to reach out to people and form true bonds of true friendship, for friendship's sake. People want depth, they want something much richer than a new product, whether that be a thing or a person. I do my best to bring that back, but i am uncompromising in my values. I think it was Churchill who said "Never give in, never give in, never; never; never; never - in nothing, great or small, large or petty - never give in except to convictions of honor and good sense." When it comes to the state of our world, I think that it's as important as it ever has been to stick to your faith and morals. As one of my fav bible verses goes, "Oh Lord, your sea is so great/ and my boat is so small"

...but everyone here seems to think i'm always joking.
 

_dhj_

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Iron, even though I am an atheist I agree with most of your observations on the human condition. I think the search for human connection, understanding, emotions, vignettes in time that will forever be sewn in one's memory etc. ought to take priority over the search for objective meaning, truth, structure and order. The content of the world view that one shares with others is less significant than the phenomenon of the other actually understanding what is being shared. Perceiving, understanding, learning are more important to me than judging, criticizing and fighting against.
 

Iron

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Well put old fiend. Well put.
For what it's worth, i'm obviously in agreement with you on an overwhelming majority of things. Youre a rare sort of guy. A man of substance and depth. In all honesty, i've felt for some time that, to me, youre probably the most real person on this site. I've known this ever since you surprisingly posted very intelligent things in this very thread. I applaud your compassion, your pragmatism, cool-headedness, ocean of knowledge and unblinking bravery against certain vicious spitting vipers.
To go the further unnecessary step, under different circumstances i'd like to marry you and raise a family together while jointly running a suburban practise.
 
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Iron

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Incidentally, i'm more and more of the opinion that Wagner is evil, though brilliant. His relationship with Nietzsche (and the sordid letters between them) has confirmed this to my mind. His music is more egotistical than Beethoven's. Wagner's intimidating body of work is ultimately a tribute of man's awesome capacity to worship himself. It's dark, it's hypnotic, it's the work of the greatest magician the world has known.
I never had a problem with this and indeed admired the boastful genius. Now i'm not so sure that it's the best and only thing in the world.
 
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