What UAI did you get? (1 Viewer)
- Thread starter mercurydrinker
- Start date
Lee
Member
Originally posted by Lazarus
I collected quite a few results when I was creating LazSeeker at the end of last year.
please tell me you didn't take them off the top of your head though
Lee
Member
oh good!. for a second there i actually thought you were like you assume a super god thingo...
Your mark of 79 would have been scaled down to ~77.75 which is reasonably good in terms of scaling (most courses are scaled down more). It's the equivalent of a 90 in Business Studies, an 84 in Biology or a 77 in Chemistry (going by the stats from last year).
You can play around with LazSeeker for more info.
You can play around with LazSeeker for more info.
Hang on....the 90 doesnt mean crap as its the percentile in the state and the scaled mark that matter...to get 90 in business you have to come top 7% in the state for business, to get 79 in SDD you have to come top 8% in the state for SDD
Is it easier to come top 8% in SDD compared to top 7% in business?
If the answer is no then I dont really see the advantage of doing SDD over business
my point is.......SDD got hard done by in scaling last year
Is it easier to come top 8% in SDD compared to top 7% in business?
If the answer is no then I dont really see the advantage of doing SDD over business
my point is.......SDD got hard done by in scaling last year
Lee
Member
i don't understand any of it....
in very simple terms can someone tell me what is scaling and why they do it.
in very simple terms can someone tell me what is scaling and why they do it.
Originally, the TER existed. It was a rank. It ranked you against everyone else doing the HSC.
Now, we have the UAI. It, too, is a ranking. You are ranked against everyone in the state who completed Year 10 with you. This includes everyone doing the HSC as well as those students who chose not to go on to Year 12 (their ranks are estimated).
As the UAI is a rank, it is better for students to achieve an average mark and beat a large portion of the state than to achieve an above average mark and beat a small portion of the state. The student's ranking in the first scenario would be higher.
You are competing against the other students in the state.
Case A:
You are doing a course that is done by smart students who tend to go well in most of the courses they take. It is harder for you to obtain a high ranking.
Case B:
You are doing a course that is done by not so smart students who tend to not go so well in most of the courses they take. It is easier for you to obtain a high ranking.
The scaling process is designed to compensate for this imbalance between courses so that students are neither advantaged nor disadvantaged by the courses they choose.
The marks of every course are standardised to a mean of 25 and a standard deviation of 12 (on a 1-unit basis) so that rankings can be compared between courses. However, the UAI is a rank and must be calculated from student results. You cannot 'add' or combine these standardised rankings, because that would advantage students who did case B courses and disadvantage students who did case A courses.
To overcome this, the course marks are scaled, and these differences are eliminated.
All case A courses will be scaled up and all case B courses will be scaled down.
Once this scaling has occurred, the marks for all courses will be in the same 'currency' and it is possible to compare marks across courses. A 'scaled aggregate' is calculated for each student by adding the marks of their best 8 units to the marks of their best 2 units of english. These scaled aggregates are ordered from highest to lowest, and all students are given an appropriate UAI ranking.
To use an analogy - when the TER was calculated, the top 0.025% of students in this list of scaled aggregates would be given a TER of 100, and the next 0.05% would be given a TER of 99.95, and the next 0.05% would be given a TER of 90.90, etc.
It is slightly different with the UAI, because all the students in the age group cohort are included in the ranking process, but the concept is similar.
Does that help?
Now, we have the UAI. It, too, is a ranking. You are ranked against everyone in the state who completed Year 10 with you. This includes everyone doing the HSC as well as those students who chose not to go on to Year 12 (their ranks are estimated).
As the UAI is a rank, it is better for students to achieve an average mark and beat a large portion of the state than to achieve an above average mark and beat a small portion of the state. The student's ranking in the first scenario would be higher.
You are competing against the other students in the state.
Case A:
You are doing a course that is done by smart students who tend to go well in most of the courses they take. It is harder for you to obtain a high ranking.
Case B:
You are doing a course that is done by not so smart students who tend to not go so well in most of the courses they take. It is easier for you to obtain a high ranking.
The scaling process is designed to compensate for this imbalance between courses so that students are neither advantaged nor disadvantaged by the courses they choose.
The marks of every course are standardised to a mean of 25 and a standard deviation of 12 (on a 1-unit basis) so that rankings can be compared between courses. However, the UAI is a rank and must be calculated from student results. You cannot 'add' or combine these standardised rankings, because that would advantage students who did case B courses and disadvantage students who did case A courses.
To overcome this, the course marks are scaled, and these differences are eliminated.
All case A courses will be scaled up and all case B courses will be scaled down.
Once this scaling has occurred, the marks for all courses will be in the same 'currency' and it is possible to compare marks across courses. A 'scaled aggregate' is calculated for each student by adding the marks of their best 8 units to the marks of their best 2 units of english. These scaled aggregates are ordered from highest to lowest, and all students are given an appropriate UAI ranking.
To use an analogy - when the TER was calculated, the top 0.025% of students in this list of scaled aggregates would be given a TER of 100, and the next 0.05% would be given a TER of 99.95, and the next 0.05% would be given a TER of 90.90, etc.
It is slightly different with the UAI, because all the students in the age group cohort are included in the ranking process, but the concept is similar.
Does that help?
They'll still be scaled up.
It doesn't matter how well the student is doing in a course, it only matters how difficult it is for the student to do well in that course. (where 'doing well' is defined as achieving better than a large percentage of the state)
That difficulty is influenced by the abilities of the other students taking the course. If a student does really well in a case A course, imagine how well they could have done in a course with only average or below average candidature! Scaling is there to compensate.
It doesn't matter how well the student is doing in a course, it only matters how difficult it is for the student to do well in that course. (where 'doing well' is defined as achieving better than a large percentage of the state)
That difficulty is influenced by the abilities of the other students taking the course. If a student does really well in a case A course, imagine how well they could have done in a course with only average or below average candidature! Scaling is there to compensate.
Lee
Member
so my understanding is the z-scores foir each course are changed (scaled) up or down according to how difficult the course is compared with other students. ie if the course is easy and the average is high so the make the average higher, thereby decreasing your mark compared to thers. and if the course is hard they take down the avaerage?. still a little conmfusing. the then what? average out all the z-scores for each student?
what i'm not understanding is why they compare marks to all subjects to determine ranks in other subjects.
what i'm not understanding is why they compare marks to all subjects to determine ranks in other subjects.
souldancer
Member
ok james, heres one for u. u said the uai is calculated based on the marks of the people u did year ten with?
im repeating year 12 this year, so is my uai calculated against those i did yr ten with, or the people the rest of my year did year ten with?
im repeating year 12 this year, so is my uai calculated against those i did yr ten with, or the people the rest of my year did year ten with?
Lee -
It's not how difficult the course is, it's how difficult it is to beat other students doing that course.
I don't know how to explain it any better - read through the documents on the website gain (specifically, 'Scaling and the UAI') and see if you can come up with some more direct questions.
souldancer -
Your UAI would be determined against the people the rest of your year did Year 10 with.
It's not how difficult the course is, it's how difficult it is to beat other students doing that course.
I don't know how to explain it any better - read through the documents on the website gain (specifically, 'Scaling and the UAI') and see if you can come up with some more direct questions.
souldancer -
Your UAI would be determined against the people the rest of your year did Year 10 with.
Transcendant
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excel
What if you did average or slightly below average in the internal assesments but got all band 5-6's in the external assesments?
What if you did average or slightly below average in the internal assesments but got all band 5-6's in the external assesments?
that shows that ppl need not give up if they have a crap ranking and crap trial results...
look at my story, i did SDD last yr and was ranked 13th from memory, but I ended up getting the same HSC mark of 79 as the persons ranked 2nd and 3rd, simply because I outperformed them in the HSC exam
look at my story, i did SDD last yr and was ranked 13th from memory, but I ended up getting the same HSC mark of 79 as the persons ranked 2nd and 3rd, simply because I outperformed them in the HSC exam