Abortion debate (3 Viewers)

[ogmzergrush]

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,10117,17564318-29277,00.html

Some choice cuts, so to speak:

* ... data from the Australian Institute of Health and Welfare shows more than 84,000 women had terminations in 2003.

* Elizabeth Sullivan, from the AIHW's national perinatal statistics unit, said there was a significant gap in abortion data in Australia.

* Abortion does not have a unique Medicare item number, so it can be difficult to gauge the number that are government-funded.

* Notification procedures also vary from state to state.

* Abortion rate is highest for women in their early 20s at nearly 33 abortions per 1000 women.

* Women in their early 40s, when fertility is reduced, had a much lower abortion rate of 6.7 per 1000 women, the lowest rate among women of child-bearing age.

* AIHW estimates put the number of abortions in NSW at nearly 32,000, the greatest in Australia.

Aside from the data consistency issues, it seems to me that the statistics don't take into account decreasing fertility in older age brackets. How can you compare the number of 20 year olds having abortions when most people in the bracket are good to go, to people 20 years older who have bits and pieces which are starting to shut down, and then expect it to be indicative of anything? Yes more young people have abortions, but perhaps it's because more young people have reproductive organs that still work. Of course, the distance between the 6.7 and 33 in 1000 seems quite large there, but I'm not well versed when it comes to infertility statistics and so on either, so personally I'm not qualified to make judgements here. Phanatical, you know everything, help us out

Also, it might be important to note that while the statistics (Ignoring accuracy issues), may seem to support your conclusion about the age bracket, you've included a rather broad generalisation, just for a change, as to the motives behind these abortions. Maybe it's because more 20 - 24 year olds are date raped, or because older people have been around dealing with morons for 20 years longer, and as such are depressed to the point where sex is no longer appealing.

 

[erawamai]

Not true. Most abortions are carried out in the 20-24 age group, among young mothers who care more about their social lives than about the right to life of the human being that they created.

You assume alot about people who you have never met and will never meet.

I'd also think it would be wiser for you to reserve your judgment on the reasoning of young mothers who choose to have an abortion. As you are a young male who, I assume is not that good at knowing females well (well enough to know their inner fears, aspirations, lusts and secrets) nor has ever been in an intimate relationship with a female, I don't think you are in the best position to guess the reasoning behind why some young women choose to have an abortion.

I also think it's mighty convenient of you to ignore all the other more valid reasons and suggest one factor and apply it to all young mothers. Not all young mothers have an abortion because they want to keep their social life. That kind of assessment shows up your personal contempt for women in general, it's also quite harsh on mothers who may abort for other more valid reasons. Many of whom would be quite offended at your ignorant characterization of young women who often painfully choose to have an abortion, and not because they want to keep their social life.

Such an assessment would be like an engineering student reasoning that
It would be like an engineer reasoning that people do music because they can't handle real life.

 

[ur_inner_child]

among young mothers who care more about their social lives than about the right to life of the human being that they created.

statistics please. the reasoning part.

 

[malkin86]

Society doesn't just need to tell them, it needs to keep reminding them. It needs to show that if you have sex outside of wedlock, then you will suffer the consequences of their actions.

Like how? Like giving children born out of wedlock less rights? (as was the case until about the 60s) After it's born, it's a child, and it shouldn't be used by society as a punishment for its mother.

How should society show young men and women that if they have sex out of wedlock, then they will suffer the consequences of their actions? (Besides the natural risk of unwanted pregnancies and moreso unwanted STDs)

 

[loquasagacious]

Obviously banner adds on BoS, bill boards along paramatta road and of course government health warnings on condoms, the pill and alcohol.

 

[MasterP]

http://www.rotten.com/library/death/abortion/

warning: explicit

 

[Not-That-Bright]

I think we should find a way to make sex alot less fun.

 

[neo o]

I think we should find a way to make sex alot less fun.

My last girlfriend managed to do that for me.

Women should have the unconditional right to rip a living thing out from inside of them, maim it and kill it. Why not? They created half of it! We all know that women want it all, and they should damn well have it.

 

[MasterP]

I think we should find a way to make sex alot less fun.

Google "Vagina Dentata."

With the aid of voodoo, you've got the ultimate excuse for abstinence.

 

[malkin86]

Obviously banner adds on BoS, bill boards along paramatta road and of course government health warnings on condoms, the pill and alcohol.

I'd see that more as a warning of what could happen (but would hopefully never happen to me or anyone I know... Wishful thinking?), rather than the definitive cause->effect->consequences->suffering flow that Phanatical seems to be suggesting.

 

[erawamai]

26 Apr 1991 In a telephone interview, Michigan judge Francis Bourisseau explains that he would never grant an abortion to a minor, except perhaps for white girls raped by blacks. For some reason, this statement manages to attract wide attention.

...................

 

[hello_world]

I think all you men against abortions are fucking bastards and should try being a woman for a day.

If you're young and make a mistake by accidently getting pregnant, shouldn't you be allowed to abort that baby? you've got ur whole life ahead of you, you don't want to have to drop out of school or uni to take care of a child. you're not emotionally ready for a baby

Tony Abott is a bastard and should not be taking away a woman's right to abortion, because he has no idea.

in the poll, where is the "abortions legal" option?

 

[gerhard]

probably the current laws option

 

[philly17]

I believe men suffer just as much, I'm female and sorry but it takes two to make a baby therefore they should have a say. Young girls shouldnt be sleeping around anyway dont have sex if u cant live up to the consequences sorry. Tony Abbott is the only one sticking his head out there i say good on him go Tony!!

 

[jesscookie]

I believe men suffer just as much, I'm female and sorry but it takes two to make a baby therefore they should have a say. Young girls shouldnt be sleeping around anyway dont have sex if u cant live up to the consequences sorry. Tony Abbott is the only one sticking his head out there i say good on him go Tony!!

Men suffer just as much you think? How many men are going to stick around if she has the baby? Thats a laughable idea. You need to get a grip on reality. Some people are so closed minded.
These politicians who are trying to ban RU486 are taking away a womans right to live the way she wants, and to do with her body as she pleases.
It's 2005 now people, time to stop thinking medievally, every woman has the right to do her will with her body, whether it be piercing, tattoos or abortion. Nobody should be allowed to take that away from her.

 

[imsooverskool]

I believe men suffer just as much, I'm female and sorry but it takes two to make a baby therefore they should have a say. Young girls shouldnt be sleeping around anyway dont have sex if u cant live up to the consequences sorry. Tony Abbott is the only one sticking his head out there i say good on him go Tony!!

Could you be any more of a fucktard, i mean really, fuckwits like you are the ones who keep mysoginists like Abbot in office. I'm only going to say this once;


NO ONE HAS A THE RIGHT TO DICTATE WHAT A WOMAN OR A MAN CHOOSES TO DO WITH THEIR BODIES, ESPECIALLY NOT THE GOVERNMENT.

Assumptions that the only women who have abortions are young sluts is narrow minded and completely false. Sometimes, contraception doesnt work and women who are in stable relationships are abandoned by their partners and left all alone. Are you telling me that that woman should be forced to have a child that she doesnt want or has the capacity to take care of??? It is not just these so called 'good' women who's right to abortion should be defended, all women, no matter how promiscous they are deemed by society to be, have the right to choose.

Philomena, i hate to go back to this classic question. But just imagine for a second that your 15 again (although judging by your moronic views you are probably younger) and you are violently raped and as a result fall pregnant. Would you be happy to give birth to that child, when your still a child yourself? Before you go judging others, try to imagine yourself in their situation.Hopefully, that 1 brain cell that resides deep in the recesses of your thick skull would recognise that things aren't as black and white as you originally thought.

 

[jesscookie]

imsooverskool, you just voiced everything that i couldnt get out because i choked on my water after reading what she wrote. makes you sick that people actually think like that doesnt it?

 

[imsooverskool]

For sure jesscookie, when people (especially females) have such a fucked up way of thinking i really feel like punching them in the face. Unfortunately, the internet hasn't developed a technology that allows me to physically assault someone over a phone line, but who knows maybe one day such a technology will exist. Until that time, it is up to chicks like you and i to set idiots like that in their place!

 

[neo o]

think all you men against abortions are fucking bastards and should try being a woman for a day.

I wouldn't mind it. I like boobies. However, trolling aside...

Tony Abott is a bastard and should not be taking away a woman's right to abortion, because he has no idea.

No idea about what? Ok ok, no more trolling.

Men suffer just as much you think? How many men are going to stick around if she has the baby? Thats a laughable idea. You need to get a grip on reality. Some people are so closed minded.

Actually, in a situation like the one that you're describing all the power is in the woman's hands. The ball is in her proverbial court. The man has no say in the outcome, but no matter what she chooses he'll have to make quite a few sacrifices himself to pay maintenance. Don't you think that that is a little harsh in a situation where both parties share the risk equally (unprotected sex).

These politicians who are trying to ban RU486 are taking away a womans right to live the way she wants, and to do with her body as she pleases.

They aren't trying to ban RU486. They are trying to restrict the sale of the drug, because they believe it has caused deaths overseas. This will restrict, but not prevent access. I think that YOU are the one who doesn't know what they're talking about.

It's 2005 now people, time to stop thinking medievally, every woman has the right to do her will with her body, whether it be piercing, tattoos or abortion. Nobody should be allowed to take that away from her.

NO ONE HAS A THE RIGHT TO DICTATE WHAT A WOMAN OR A MAN CHOOSES TO DO WITH THEIR BODIES, ESPECIALLY NOT THE GOVERNMENT.

If you're young and make a mistake by accidently getting pregnant, shouldn't you be allowed to abort that baby? you've got ur whole life ahead of you, you don't want to have to drop out of school or uni to take care of a child. you're not emotionally ready for a baby

Should she have the right to kill something which could be alive? What's the greater crime? Killing something which may be alive or encroaching upon a woman's "freedoms". I'd argue that the mere possibility that a woman may be killing a living thing should justify at the very least, stringent restrictions upon the practice.

Philomena, i hate to go back to this classic question. But just imagine for a second that your 15 again (although judging by your moronic views you are probably younger) and you are violently raped and as a result fall pregnant. Would you be happy to give birth to that child, when your still a child yourself? Before you go judging others, try to imagine yourself in their situation.Hopefully, that 1 brain cell that resides deep in the recesses of your thick skull would recognise that things aren't as black and white as you originally thought.

Just to make your scenario completely improbable, let's make it an 11 year old girl, raped by her father, whom has three different kinds of genetic diseases all of which the child is likely to inherit. WOULD YOU ABORT?

PS: Could someone explain to me how you can murder an unborn foetus, yet at the same time a woman can willingly choose to terminate it?

 

[imsooverskool]

I wouldn't mind it. I like boobies. However, trolling aside...


No idea about what? Ok ok, no more trolling.


Actually, in a situation like the one that you're describing all the power is in the woman's hands. The ball is in her proverbial court. The man has no say in the outcome, but no matter what she chooses he'll have to make quite a few sacrifices himself to pay maintenance. Don't you think that that is a little harsh in a situation where both parties share the risk equally (unprotected sex).


They aren't trying to ban RU486. They are trying to restrict the sale of the drug, because they believe it has caused deaths overseas. This will restrict, but not prevent access. I think that YOU are the one who doesn't know what they're talking about.






Should she have the right to kill something which could be alive? What's the greater crime? Killing something which may be alive or encroaching upon a woman's "freedoms". I'd argue that the mere possibility that a woman may be killing a living thing should justify at the very least, stringent restrictions upon the practice.


Just to make your scenario completely improbable, let's make it an 11 year old girl, raped by her father, whom has three different kinds of genetic diseases all of which the child is likely to inherit. WOULD YOU ABORT?

PS: Could someone explain to me how you can murder an unborn foetus, yet at the same time a woman can willingly choose to terminate it?

Are you alluding to my given example as being improbable????? This exact situation happened to a very close friend of mine when i was in grade 10- are you telling me that she should have given birth to the child that was created out of such violence? No fucking way should a woman have to put herself through such emotional turmoil and im sorry but as a male you could NEVER understand what she went through. As a male, you would never have to face the prospect of getting pregnant and being left to raise the child all alone-

SO AS A MALE YOU HAVE NO FUCKING RIGHT TO CAST MORAL JUDGEMENT ON WHAT A WOMAN DOES WITH HER BODY. There is nothing that infuriates me more than someone passes judjement when they could never understand where the person they are judjing is coming from

As for your last question; when someone is charged with the murder of an unborn foetus it is becuase the accused inflicted violence upon a woman, removing her right (yes her right) to choose if she wanted a child. Comments like that are ludicrous argument only raised in an a vain attempt to prove that abortion is the same as muder, frankly neo i thought you had more intelligence