Accounting Cadetships (4 Viewers)

[turtleface]

going off-topic a bit... has anyone applied for a winter vacation position at the big 4 and how was your interview?

everyone i know who applied got rejected. only 1 got an interview, but was rejected too.

 

[M@C D@DDY]

everyone i know who applied got rejected. only 1 got an interview, but was rejected too.

just wondering which firm did your friends apply to? i had an interview at KPMG on friday, just wanted to see who else applied and btw do you guys know if the process is the three step as per the website? like you know first interview, then assessments and then final??

 

[turtleface]

this was in melbourne so it was only KPMG and Deloitte

Everyone got rejected, and some of them were good candidates too...

I'm not sure whats happening with Big 4 recruiting...theres the impression that a lot of people getting in are like indifferent students who dont even know if they want to do Accounting.

 

[Meads]

You gotta be willing to give up your social life... and then take it back slowly I was talking to my mate today about it (he's from another Big4 firm) and he has a pretty good social life. But don't go expecting to be a full socialite once you start a cadetship because it just ain't gonna happen.

And I'm starting 2nd half of the year; also at PwC.

Are you kidding!? A Cadetship is a social life! Friday night drinks.................

 

[blackfriday]

if i had that many cymbals, that would be my social life...

 

[blackfriday]

actually to think about it i do have that many cymbals but not enough stands...back to accounting...

 

[seremify007]

Are you kidding!? A Cadetship is a social life! Friday night drinks.................

Shh... better to let them go from thinking it'll be crap and getting a good bit of fun; than the other way round and being disappointed don't you reckon?

 

[Malazn Pleasure]

Are you kidding!? A Cadetship is a social life! Friday night drinks.................

cadetships involve heaps of social life, especially soclising with your work mates on friday nite drinks, end of month drinks, social events, and major events like christmas parties, and end of financial parties. the bigger the firm, the more parties u get coz they can afford it more.

i done cadetship for 3yrs now, and i graduate end of the year, its pretty good. i hv had a pretty good social life as well as work experience. its all about effective time management. i started out as a cadet 2yrs ago and now im a senior......(and still in uni). its good to tell people older than you what to do!

another reason why cadetships r good is that it prepares you for CA program. cadets are use to working 830-5pm and then going off to uni at night. This is bascially what CA involves. Fresh grads find CA harder than cadets in the fact that they are not use to the 830-5pm work then studying at night. Generally cadets are better time managers than fresh grads. I speak from experience.

 

[seremify007]

I never thought about that aspect of preparation for CA with the work/study! Btw, do you really need to say "5th largest Accounting firm"? Wouldn't it be easier to just say BDO? LOL...

 

[ishq]

I never thought about that aspect of preparation for CA with the work/study! Btw, do you really need to say "5th largest Accounting firm"? Wouldn't it be easier to just say BDO? LOL...

So many firms compete for the '5th largest' title. Is it BDO, Grant Thornton....?

 

[turtleface]

I think internationally its BDO due to the size of BDO Siderman (?sp) LLP. Locally its pretty much equal 5th (PKF exceeds it in terms of revenue by just a couple of million), but this is not counting WHK Group(Investor Grp.), which though it is only beaten in revenue by the Big 4, its not really a firm so it doesn't count.

 

[¬_¬]

According to trusty BRW; in Australia, according to Budgeted Fees for 04-05, PKF was on 108.5m with 110 partners (Rev per partner of 986,364) and BDO was 102.0m with 95 partners (Rev per partner of 1,073,684); so that leaves PKF ahead slightly. Not taking into account Investor Group as turtleface pointed out, that would leave PKF in 5th and BDO 6th.

Source: BRW, p70, July 28-Aug 3, 2005

However, also according to BRW, worldwide, BDO is ranked 5th with revenue of 3,017m (US) and having 621 offices in 105 coutnries, and Grant Thornton about 33% behind on 2,092m (US) in 6th with 504 offices in 109 countries.

Source: BRW, p71, Aug 18-Aug 24, 2005

 

[ishq]

Okay - in terms of getting 'you first experience' in the industry, do you think its better to go to a chartered firm or the accounting division of an IB? I mean - first year - so no real hard core choice about where you want to end up.

 

[seremify007]

Depends on what you really want to do I suppose. A foot in the door of an IB is better than nothing- especially if you really wanna work in IB later on. That being said, the work experience you gain from a large chartered firm won't exactly hold you back from future job opportunities either.

 

[turtleface]

yeh true, I've come to realise IBanks are overrated. The salaries they are able to pay is cause their revenue per staff is 4X that of Accountants. People are unwilling to pay for audits due to them not seeming to add value, yet are willing to pay heaps for M&A and shit. the danger is though, when economic activity goes south, and MA goes with it, IBanks are screwed, just like in the early 90s. Still, thats not to say the economy will go crap.

I think CFO of IBanks are more often ex big 4 than grads risen up (I have no proof, just guessing), though Controllers/FM's may be. Those bottom of the heap to top honcho stories are rare. The only one I can think of is John Fletcher (Coles Myer CEO) who was a grad Accountant at Brambles and rose to become Brambles CEO

actually...come to think of it, Frank Halloran (CEO of QBE insurance) was a grad accountant at QBE too ( ithink) -edit:no I'm wrong, he was a coopers lybrand auditor. Trevor O'Hoy was the grad accountant at CUB/Fosters.

 

[seremify007]

I think when you factor in the working hours of IB, the pay probably isn't that much greater than accounting; but IB looks a lot more stressful where a mistake can be extremely costly.

 

[turtleface]

lol true a la Frank Quattrone

but Accounting's pretty risky. I remember when Enron got screwed, EVERY Andersen equity partner in the whole world had to pay $1 million each lol (for damages). lol thats 2 years of after tax salary gone.

edit: ahahaha i just realised (ok its not really funny, quite sad actually) if you were are a new Andersen equity partner, you would of have to had paid like 1 or so million (to invest into the partnership) and another 1 million in damages payments before you've earned a cent.

 

[seremify007]

LOL good point. That happened with KPMG not too long ago in the US as well.

But nonetheless, that's the way the cookie crumbles. As a partner, you're supposed to check on the activities of the other partners and make sure noone is ****ing around.

Btw when I said risky, I was actually more thinking... if you make a bad call in an IB, I'd say your job is alot more on the line than in say... audit where you missed something small/immaterial.

 

[sikeveo]

yeh IB is overrated. 70 hour weeks for 70k at the start. Ends up pretty shitty per hour rate.

 

[Meads]

You don't have to 'buy into' big 4 partnerships, that is only the case in law firms.