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Post election thoughts (2 Viewers)

Not-That-Bright

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Why so negative? I thought labor had the positive supporters.
Even if labor had won, i would have welcomed their parties fresh views, however they lost.

I keep seeing negative reasons for the reason the coalition won from the labor supporters, to you people is it impossible to believe that informed voters thought it through and decided that howard was better.. for the 4th time? or every time have we just been tricked?
 

Bone577

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Rorix said:
OH I THOUGHT YOU MIGHT KNOW SOMETHING ABOUT THE US BEFORE YOU WANTED TO ENTER INTO A PRESIDENTAL DISCUSSION

MY BAD

I don't want to enter a presidential discussion. Kerry and Bush is irellevant to me. Democrat and Republican have both committed some of the worse atrocities on earth.

I wan't to enter a debate about US foreign policy.
 

Not-That-Bright

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That is because people are willing to pay those huge ammounts to live in sydney, we don't have a right to live where ever we want.

Perhaps if you don't like the housing prices in Sydney you should move out to the country where it's cheaper? because there is a person willing to pay that price..there's no way to stop that.
 

Rorix

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Well you see, Zahid doesn't want George Bush to win. I wanted to debate him on the subject.


Then you came in and said ID LOVE TO TALK ABOUT 1980
 

jameseginton

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Oh Biff,
What happened? Please! It was not half obvious the coalition was going to get back in a month ago. Let us not forget they won the last election with 48.5% of 2 party prefered now they had over 50%. The Australian public arent sutpid, why change when everthing is going well. Look back at history, 4 political changes in 60 years. We dont forget people pasts quickly either, do we biff? We need to get rid of telstra as well, either own it whole or not at all, its bullshit anyway. So i hope we hold power in the senate. Managed to dampen the greens as well. Let us not forget the green prob felt they were the next democrats. The democrats had a swing against of 4.9%, but the greens only 2%. Didnt even pick up a lower house seat. Biff should have realised he could only win if he came from the far left not sit on the fence between the left and right. Maybe now we will see Biffs true colours come through, you idiots should have supported Beazley
 

astro

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i suppose its time to roll out the increase in hecs fees and less opportunity for all.....at least the electorate i live in is still labor....
 

Bone577

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Rorix said:
Well you see, Zahid doesn't want George Bush to win. I wanted to debate him on the subject.


Then you came in and said ID LOVE TO TALK ABOUT 1980

I don't want either of them to win.

The problem is Aus supporting the US. Which in consideration of their track record since WW2 is very disheartening. It is only logical to put it into the context of US foreign policy history. But if you prefer we can concentrate on purely contemporary matters, even if they are just the continuation of past policy.

Less personal attacks and more debating thanks.
 

Generator

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Not That Bright, have you even addressed the Senate issue in any of your posts?
 

walrusbear

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Ziff said:
Quotes from International Commentaries:





This is why I believe that the majority of Australians uncritically believe in Howard and have continuously re-elected him:

From my experience, I think the vast majority of Australians have a few fundamental problems;

1. No matter how much australians espouse "egalitarianism" they really don't believe in it. In theory there's a belief in a classless society, but this doesn't really mean anything when a user-pays system emerges in primary, secondary and tertiary education as well as in the health sector. If you believe you have a right to be able to pay for better treatment than the next person you have adopted the stance that a class-based society is good. To use a political tool here, that's very "unAustralian"! Yet, Howard tries to reconcile these two views through a cunning tactic, a money-based class system is OK, however, one that rewards intellectial and critical thought is not. This can be seen through the media who have no exercised criticism of the government (and to that extent have not been very critical of the opposition either). In NSW at least, the term extends to wanting to demolish State Selective Schools in some areas (this is a recurring theme in Wollongong) and yet, private schools are protected.

2. Australians have an enormous inferiority complex. They fear anyone or anything better than them in regards to sport or intellectually. This is particularly shown in the intellectual aspect, deep down they know sport doesn't beat intelligence. Hence we have the tall poppy syndrome, Australians say or at least deep down think, "Fuck, that person is smart! I hate them!" They will then make every attempt to drag them down. This may not apply to some people, particularly those in private schools or selective schools who are sheltered from such attitudes (except in the media), but it does exist and it is rife amongst the majority. I was once a victim, however, since high school I have been reasonably sheltered (as it is a selective high school).

3. Australians are on the whole ignorant. They will accept any propaganda and they refuse to check facts. They don't read widely but most importantly, on the whole - they don't care. They lack passion (the Europeans and even the Americans have passion about many subjects, particularly politics). Australians revile passion, that is why I believe a lot of attacks have been launched by the conservatives and Liberals against Latham's passionate stances and some what expressive arugments. I also think that his well considered arguments were ignored whilst what the people focused on was his passionate stance which, they inherently revile because they have no passion about anything themselves. I think Keating was the only one who tried to challenge this tall poppy syndrome and inject some culture into the nation, however, he didn't do it well enough and was instead attacked, cut down and deposed by Howard.

4. Howard makes the majority, who are ignorant, comfortable. He comforts them in regards to their past e.g. black armband v. white blindfold versions of history. He comforts them in the present by lying to them and telling them "oh it's all ok". He comforts their future "Latham will make interest rates go higher! Only i can protect you!" At the same time he asserts he is the only one capable of protecting Australia's national interests, best interests, interest rates, defence and so forth and he has run a very good propaganda campaign around it.
These are my observations, however, I find them extremely dangerous to the well-being of the nation and its potential to progress. I deplore the constant harrassment of those with critical thought or intelligence, and no, I don't mean this in terms of "wow, you vote Liberal, you're smart!" or "Oh, Labor voter, you're obviously not self-centred!" but I mean it in terms of being able to evaluate and judge the actions of people around you, the biases inherent in political statements, newspapers and in fact writings of any kind (yes, there's bias in this very diatribe as well as in whatever you respond with! Get over it!).

To be truthful, as I have stated in a previous post, I am afraid of what might happen. Not only in terms of the destruction of many of our social services, but in what Australia may become. It is entirely likely that Australians will continue to subside further into a laziness and uncritical acceptance of propaganda from the government and others that they will fall so far into a pit of dispair they may never come out.
fucking very well put dude!
very pertinent
a lot to think about, but the liberal party supporters will chew on semantics and choose to use a google stat to support their facile argument
 

Scanorama

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Not-That-Bright said:
That is because people are willing to pay those huge ammounts to live in sydney, we don't have a right to live where ever we want.

Perhaps if you don't like the housing prices in Sydney you should move out to the country where it's cheaper? because there is a person willing to pay that price..there's no way to stop that.
So you are basically Sydney is for rich people and rich people only? That's where I grow up and a house should be affortable for us as well., not just some very rich people. My point is the interest rate will go up eventually, and it could be in the very bear future.
 

Not-That-Bright

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... are you claiming that everyone should be allowed to live where ever they want?
I wan't to live right on the gold coast, i can't afford it tho.. please make it cheaper.
Come on lol

I figured i'd write a slightly more detailed response.

Education plays a vital part of it. Bad education means bad citizens.
And some people obviously believe the Liberals have a sound education policy (remember those old folks do have children, education is an issue to them)

It means less competitive and eventually the reputation of the country will be damaged and people stop investing in Australia
Again.. Howard has his policies on education, he isn't sacraficing education for the economy.

Likewise to medical.
Medicare Gold would mean the rest of us will have an even harder time getting a bed.


Think about this, it is almost impossbile for us to buy a house in Sydney.
That is because people are willing to pay those huge ammounts to live in sydney, we don't have a right to live where ever we want.

Perhaps if you don't like the housing prices in Sydney you should move out to the country where it's cheaper? because there is a person willing to pay that price..there's no way to stop that.

Back to the point, if the interest rate decides is time to go up, Howard and Costello can't do anything about it.
It will go up to slow down the housing market, lowering prices. Liberals never claimed to be able to stop that.
 

Rorix

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Bone577 said:
I don't want either of them to win.
IS THAT YOUR INFORMED DECISION? WOULD YOU LIKE TO DEBATE DOMESTIC US POLITICS?

It is only logical to put it into the context of US foreign policy history.
No, you'rer just saying that because it's the only thing you 'know' about.

But if you prefer we can concentrate on purely contemporary matters, even if they are just the continuation of past policy.

Less personal attacks and more debating thanks.

You obviously don't know shit about domestic US politics, so you'll just be talking about Iraq/Afghanistan. I want someone who actually knows relevant issues.


I'll try less personal attacks if you try being less dumb.
 

jameseginton

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Gough Whitlam said:
So you are basically Sydney is for rich people and rich people only? That's where I grow up and a house should be affortable for us as well., not just some very rich people. My point is the interest rate will go up eventually, and it could be in the very bear future.
Did you learn that from Whitlam? The only thing that he provided that has lasted is free student travel which i cant access anyway
 

Raiks

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I'm not a huge political obsessed person although I do tend to vote liberals, but the main thing I love about the Libs winning was that we can tease asqy over it :D :p
 

Not-That-Bright

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I wonder if people like Rorix, Asquithian can debate like this face to face.
If so, god help the future of political debates..

BTW I didn't see one, but was there ever a debate between John Howard & Latham?
 

Bone577

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Rorix said:
IS THAT YOUR INFORMED DECISION? WOULD YOU LIKE TO DEBATE DOMESTIC US POLITICS?



No, you'rer just saying that because it's the only thing you 'know' about.




You obviously don't know shit about domestic US politics, so you'll just be talking about Iraq/Afghanistan. I want someone who actually knows relevant issues.


I'll try less personal attacks if you try being less dumb.

The issue is Aus support for US foreign policy. Now do you want to debate on it?

I dont mind arguing about Cuban embargoes or US support for Israel or any number of current issues that aren't Afganistan/Iraq. As i said take your pick.
 

Rorix

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Bone577 said:
The issue is Aus support for US foreign policy. Now do you want to debate on it?

NO

ITS FUCKING NOT


HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO TELL YOU THIS

FUCK I LEAVE FOR TWO DAYS AND MORONS BACKWASH FROM THE TOILET

THE ISSUE IS
ZAHID SAID
IF BUSH WINS WE'RE ALL DOOMED
I SAID
ILL DEBATE YOU
HE SAID
SURE
THEN YOU SAID
HAY GUYS DOES ANYONE WANT TO HEAR ME BULLSHIT ON ABOUT SOME SHIT FROM THE 1980S NO-ONE CARES ABOUT
 

Bone577

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Rorix said:
NO

ITS FUCKING NOT


HOW MANY TIMES DO I NEED TO TELL YOU THIS

FUCK I LEAVE FOR TWO DAYS AND MORONS BACKWASH FROM THE TOILET

THE ISSUE IS
ZAHID SAID
IF BUSH WINS WE'RE ALL DOOMED
I SAID
ILL DEBATE YOU
HE SAID
SURE
THEN YOU SAID
HAY GUYS DOES ANYONE WANT TO HEAR ME BULLSHIT ON ABOUT SOME SHIT FROM THE 1980S NO-ONE CARES ABOUT

And we are doomed because of US domestic policies?
 

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