Retreat From The Global (3 Viewers)

[Grey Council]

lol, thanks for reminding me Cinderella

lol, thanks for reminding me Cinderella


hanyway, here goes:
Basically, like I think I've said before, what we did is this. Teacher divided people into groups, and each group researched on the net and the critical readings available in our library. They basically became responsible for analysing a poem and presenting an evaluation of its comments on Retreat from the Global.
We did FOUR things for each poem:
1. Summary of what the poet is saying.
2. Comment on HOW the poet shapes his meaning. This includes the use of imagery and significance of such imagery eg the juxtapositioning of the pen and the gun in the Digging. Consider the structure and the rhythm as well as the effect of Heaney's diction. Try to use critics theories, but make sure you acknowledge them.
3. Comment on what stage you think Heaney is at as far as finding his identity through his poetry. Comment on the voice he uses (ie Blackberry Picking = VERY childish voice, has a particular effect, gives certain meaning)
4. Sum up with why you think this poem has been included in the study of RFTG.

That said, I can now post up my collection of Critic's views on "Digging"

PS Thats the critics. I won't give what I wrote, cause its not like I'm an authority, but I focused on the central extended metaphor thats supposed to be in the poem:
"There is a central extended metaphor of digging and roots, which shows how the poet, in his writing, is getting back to his own roots (his identity, and where his family comes from)"
Remember, this is his first poem in his first book, so don't (imho) go too far in trying to find a relation between local and global etc. lol, I hate it when english teachers look too deeply into texts, it's just ssoooo BS.

Hope that helps. Like I said, why don't you Sefton'ers get together and divide it up? There are like 7 poems, no? And I found all that critic info on the net by myself, during one period, so it can't take more than one hour each. Then, give each other all the critic info you found, and the answers to those questions, and then write an answer to this essay (or something similar, but this is what our teacher told us to write an essay on):

Choose any three poems by Seamus Heaney and discuss the contradictions (or tensions) that are an essential part of his poetry.

Don't look to me as to how that relates to RFTG, but thats our final essay on Heaney (I haven't done it yet, due in on July 21st).

lol, I'm rambling on. Sorry. Remember, don't just listen to me, I'm not very good at English (I'm a boy ) you'd be better off asking advice from someone who HAS done the course.

^_^

 

[stazi]

thanks heaps. I'm finding punishment to be a hard poem to read on its own. I find that I really have to read all of his previous work to start to understand it. Ahhh! Reporting on it Wednesday

 

[Grey Council]

well?

Was that useful at all?
@_@

 

[tonka87]

empire records

helloooo there children.. if anyone has seen empire records...*insert help here*... as ppl in the other rftg threads say it can b used as a related text.... someone plz explain how it links???

 

[Atotoi]

Hey.. do you think the movie " The Barbershop" is decent source for the topic?
You know.. Mr Wallace (pimp and all round bad guy) could be the bad of the global and Calvin himself lusts after global objects - money, a profitable recording studio and a media queens guest house??

The global corrupts him until he realises his mistake and understands that community and tradition are what counts??

I wrote that sorta stuff in my extension exam 2day... i wonder how ill go

 

[cameronS]

Heaney has perhaps the most important and relevant statements in regard to RFTG, such as the necessity of a hybrid identity that is found through a post colonial journey for a collective Irish identity (SH retreats to other locals to compare a pagan past with the secular present) - this is shown in Funeral Rights.
Mike

how is heaney retreating to other locals?

isnt he embracing the global (that which is not local, ie, not irish)?

heaney is fucking hard.

can someone, in a nut shell, describe what RFTG looks at in respect to heaney?

 

[ujuphleg]

Wow thread revival....

Heaney.... *ujuphleg shakes head* *points at glitterfairy*

 

[glitterfairy]

I've been referred to. This is a great honour. *soaks up the moment*

The generic use of the term "retreat from the global", when too often used without true understanding, can lead to a belief that all set texts within the RFTG module are concerned with an author retreating from the global to his local culture - and zip.

Heaney is far more complex than that. The only black-and-white RFTG set text I covered was Shipping News.

Let me look at these questions one by one:

how is heaney retreating to other locals?

I did not cover all of his poems, but in the ones I covered (Digging and Blackberry Picking, I didn't want to do a bog one although they really are very very good ones to use) did not show Heaney retreating to "other locals". Instead, he harkens back to memories and events of the past (such as images of his forefathers literally working their butts off) to inspire and motivate today - including himself - eg "Between my fingers...a squat pen rests. I'll dig with it"

isnt he embracing the global (that which is not local, ie, not irish)?

In a way, yes. As mentioned above, Heaney is not black-and-white. Unlike Proulx, there are no "goodies and baddies". My suggestion is that you read all his poems again and have a look at what he's doing with his poetry, and more importantly, analyse for yourself what Heaney things. Don't bypass cultural heritage, cultural values and the composer's historical and personal context. WHY are they writing? What are they trying to prove? All three of my set texts (Proulx, MacLeod and Heaney) had distinctly different philosophies about the state of the world and where it was going. When asked a RFTG question, you DON'T need to always say that "global is bad". Don't fall into the trap of assuming the globalisation is bad and cuts off everything, because it doesn't and you can find proof of that in Heaney's poetry. I won't tell you just yet though - I'll give you a chance to figure it out for yourself. Remember - look at personal and historical context! Culture and Values!!!

heaney is fucking hard.

Heaney and Macleod were actually my two favourite prescribed texts. Be nice! lol. Although to be blunt, I loved them most because they were shorter than The Shipping News (which I refused to finish, believing it to be a piece of tripe) and hence were chocablock full of techniques - I didn't need to sift through pages and pages and pages to get to "the good stuff".

can someone, in a nut shell, describe what RFTG looks at in respect to heaney?

Hopefully, I've lead you into a good direction already. You've probably heard this before, but it's one thing to know what to write in an essay to get the marks, it's another thing entirely to understand what you're talking about. Part of understanding is finding new things - of your own accord - to put in the essays because it is what YOU feel.

But if you're really stuck, let's look very briefly at Heaney (there will be lots of clues in this. Run on tangents! This is what we do in RFTG!)

Heaney is on one hand, an irish native, and yet he was bred in a globalised culture. He is a writer. (Personal and Historical Context Alert! Personal and Historical Context Alert!)

Heaney writes about all sort of weird things. Bogs. Turf-Cutting. Berry Picking. Such simple things, and yet not so simple. He often links events - such as rebellions and berry-picking - back to modern day and timeless morals. (Personal and Historical Context Alert! Personal and Historical Context Alert!)

My final advice is that you research everything. Heaney, like so many other poets, with often seem to just mention something that sounds odd, but students will initially brush it off, thinking it's just the composer trying to be quite clever. Heaney doesn't do that. Every single thing he refers to - no matter how little - means something. It would do any RFTG student well to do research on his personal and historical context This should not be too hard, as Heaney does not use big fat sophisticated words often

Bonne Appetit!

(Note to Susan - is this how Marcus feels all the time? There is so much more I could say - all the clues are there - and yet I KNOW the poor person is going to want to throttle me after he can't figure out what the heck I've written because it's somewhat cryptic )

And finally - I am still up for critiquing essays, if any more people wish to send them via pm or other.

 

[katie_tully]

I have to read Heany and the Shipping News over the holidays. We started with the Castle and 20th century literary theories/philosophers and related them to The Castle. It was somewhat interesting, but a term into it and I'm still unclear as to where exactly it's leading....

 

[glitterfairy]

I felt that like... and only felt somewhat confident a few weeks before Trials

 

[cameronS]

I've been referred to. This is a great honour. *soaks up the moment*

The generic use of the term "retreat from the global", when too often used without true understanding, can lead to a belief that all set texts within the RFTG module are concerned with an author retreating from the global to his local culture - and zip.

Heaney is far more complex than that. The only black-and-white RFTG set text I covered was Shipping News.

Let me look at these questions one by one:

how is heaney retreating to other locals?

I did not cover all of his poems, but in the ones I covered (Digging and Blackberry Picking, I didn't want to do a bog one although they really are very very good ones to use) did not show Heaney retreating to "other locals". Instead, he harkens back to memories and events of the past (such as images of his forefathers literally working their butts off) to inspire and motivate today - including himself - eg "Between my fingers...a squat pen rests. I'll dig with it"

isnt he embracing the global (that which is not local, ie, not irish)?

In a way, yes. As mentioned above, Heaney is not black-and-white. Unlike Proulx, there are no "goodies and baddies". My suggestion is that you read all his poems again and have a look at what he's doing with his poetry, and more importantly, analyse for yourself what Heaney things. Don't bypass cultural heritage, cultural values and the composer's historical and personal context. WHY are they writing? What are they trying to prove? All three of my set texts (Proulx, MacLeod and Heaney) had distinctly different philosophies about the state of the world and where it was going. When asked a RFTG question, you DON'T need to always say that "global is bad". Don't fall into the trap of assuming the globalisation is bad and cuts off everything, because it doesn't and you can find proof of that in Heaney's poetry. I won't tell you just yet though - I'll give you a chance to figure it out for yourself. Remember - look at personal and historical context! Culture and Values!!!

heaney is fucking hard.

Heaney and Macleod were actually my two favourite prescribed texts. Be nice! lol. Although to be blunt, I loved them most because they were shorter than The Shipping News (which I refused to finish, believing it to be a piece of tripe) and hence were chocablock full of techniques - I didn't need to sift through pages and pages and pages to get to "the good stuff".

can someone, in a nut shell, describe what RFTG looks at in respect to heaney?

Hopefully, I've lead you into a good direction already. You've probably heard this before, but it's one thing to know what to write in an essay to get the marks, it's another thing entirely to understand what you're talking about. Part of understanding is finding new things - of your own accord - to put in the essays because it is what YOU feel.

But if you're really stuck, let's look very briefly at Heaney (there will be lots of clues in this. Run on tangents! This is what we do in RFTG!)

Heaney is on one hand, an irish native, and yet he was bred in a globalised culture. He is a writer. (Personal and Historical Context Alert! Personal and Historical Context Alert!)

Heaney writes about all sort of weird things. Bogs. Turf-Cutting. Berry Picking. Such simple things, and yet not so simple. He often links events - such as rebellions and berry-picking - back to modern day and timeless morals. (Personal and Historical Context Alert! Personal and Historical Context Alert!)

My final advice is that you research everything. Heaney, like so many other poets, with often seem to just mention something that sounds odd, but students will initially brush it off, thinking it's just the composer trying to be quite clever. Heaney doesn't do that. Every single thing he refers to - no matter how little - means something. It would do any RFTG student well to do research on his personal and historical context This should not be too hard, as Heaney does not use big fat sophisticated words often

Bonne Appetit!

(Note to Susan - is this how Marcus feels all the time? There is so much more I could say - all the clues are there - and yet I KNOW the poor person is going to want to throttle me after he can't figure out what the heck I've written because it's somewhat cryptic )

And finally - I am still up for critiquing essays, if any more people wish to send them via pm or other.

wow thanks a lot, does bos.org have a reputation system?

so, heaney is retreating to other locals to ultimately emphasise the importance of the local. right?

because he talks about european history (global) to highlight the contemporary "troubles"...so, he retreats to a global history in order to understand what is currently happening? and he does it with the norse history as well to highlight the cyclical idea of violence....something like that :|

 

[glitterfairy]

wow thanks a lot, does bos.org have a reputation system?

****
Yes it does! That little scale figure on the right - but I can't tell you anymore, in case someone things I'm begging for reputation
****

so, heaney is retreating to other locals to ultimately emphasise the importance of the local. right?

****
Hmm... not really. Heaney is sort of half-local himself. And if you read all the poems again, most of them link back to his own personal/historical culture slash culture/values. It's not retreating to "other" locals like Quoyle does in Shipping News. As I've said before, Heaney is NOT black and white like Proulx and MacLeod. Heaney ALSO does NOT take an active stance on the "local is good" or "global is good" or "local is bad" or "global is bad" arguement.

It's so important in RFTG to look beyond the words. What motivated the composers to write this? Heaney, unlike Proulx, does NOT say blatant things like "global is bad", in fact, I'd almost go so far as to say that he's careful not to.
****

because he talks about european history (global) to highlight the contemporary "troubles"...so, he retreats to a global history in order to understand what is currently happening? and he does it with the norse history as well to highlight the cyclical idea of violence....something like that :|

****
European history? Norse history? Dude, where are you pulling this out from? lol.

I didn't do any of the really "violent" or "dark" poems so a lot of this political stuff is really sort of out of my league. What I do suggest however, is to do some research. What culture does Heaney belong to? Well, he was born in Ireland, near Belfast (if not in Belfast), but educated elsewhere. That sentence alone has a lot of clues - for example, when someone mentions the word "Belfast", what does one think of?

I'm sorry to keep you guessing again, but you HAVE to think. So much of my EE1 essay was non-contextual (that's fancy EE1-speak for "I didn't use many quotes"). I talked a LOT about personal and historical context, because that's what motivated the composers - inspired them, and what to put into their work. A really good RFTG essay will show a lot of sophisticated thought beyond the words. Heaney, for example, has so much in it - in almost every single line (even though he doesn't use big fat words) there's something simple that might be a metaphor, might represent something. THAT is what you have to research. Why is he talking about that? Think further - get into Heaney's head. Try to get a grasp of what the composers are talking and thinking about, what they're trying to say. If the message was such a simple "global is bad, local is good", then they really could just say so - but Heaney doesn't (although I've always though Proulx does, but that's just me).

Is that helping you out any more?

 

[cameronS]

there are a lot of examples of norse and greek mythology and typical european history in his poems, let me find you some examples.

personal heliocon, narcissus - greek mythology, Mount helicon - greek mythology

Funeral Rites - norse history, vikings - "chambers of boyne" refers to an ancient burial site (where someone called gunnar was buried - paganist). Gunnar was also murderd, and not avenged, this halted a long history of violence (paralleled to the sectarian "troubles")

Tolland Man - denmark and bog bodies - uses a non local history to explain and compare to irish history.

Punishment - same as tolland man

 

[glitterfairy]

Hmm that is true - although with the exception of the greek references, I personally feel that Heaney refers to his Celtic heritage more than anything else - which very possibly encompasses greek and norse elements. The dude is irish, after all.

 

[mmoonniiqquuee]

The shipping news is quite possible the most poetic book I've ever read.

I absolutely loved it.



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