Shooting Brazillian man was a "mistake" (4 Viewers)

[tattoodguy]

why when we as civilians, we make mistakes - sometimes make assumptions etc and take actioins we have to face the consequences.

Even if they yellled out and siad they were police? so fucking what? There is no justification for what they did.

They should all be killled. How can we have a system where the people who enforce the laws etc and to keeep order, are never accountable?

police should be more accountable than average citizens.

What fucking dogs to hold an unarmed innocent man down and blow his brains out. And they try and blame it on the guy.

This proves my point - they show no regard for civilians, and they never take responsibility.

You condem people for rioting against police, but when they can do what they want to citizens with immunity, lie and exagerate to protect themselves - IF we dont have protection from the police and they arnt made accountable - you cant blame people for rebelling.

 

[Generator]

Brazilian's family claim police altered their story

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,22989-1711303,00.html

The family claim that Mr Menezes’s death forced Scotland Yard to change its shoot-to-kill orders. In yesterday’s arrest in Birmingham, the family point out that police used a Taser stun gun. They want to know why a similar weapon was not used last Friday.

According to reports, the policy in London is still shoot to kill if the person is considered to be a suicide bomber, with Commissioner Blair publicly stating his belief that the Birmingham police were stretching their luck in using a taser to subdue the suspect.

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

If he knew that it was a cop, there would be no reason to run away. He wasn't doing anything illegal.

exactly. which is why they shot him, because what he was doing made no sense.

 

[braindrainedAsh]

In the witness accounts I read, he was cornered on the train, so they could have used a tsaser to immobilize him. There is no excuse for this in my opinion, no excuse at all.

 

[supercharged]

exactly. which is why they shot him, because what he was doing made no sense.

What he was doing made no sense? Why wouldn't you run if plainclothes gunmen pulled their weapons on you? It's quite possible that he didn't realise that the men after him were policemen.

 

[gordo]

wat if they shot to wound and then the guy blew himself up and killed all the police and 150 commuters around him except the guy that shot him

would the guy sleep better at night in that instance or shooting to kill

 

[supercharged]

wat if they shot to wound and then the guy blew himself up and killed all the police and 150 commuters around him except the guy that shot him

would the guy sleep better at night in that instance or shooting to kill

That's just stupid. wat if police just shoot anyone at random because they might be terrorists? Who knows, even the guy crossing the street next to you could be a terrorist, lets pull our guns at him and if he runs, shoot him.

And 150 people! you would need a big truck bomb for that level of damage.

 

[tempco]

it's not fair to make judgements based on the fact that the deceased was not a terrorist.

instead, consider the events that led to the conclusion made by the group of officers that he was a terrorist suspect carrying a bomb that he was going to use to blow up a train.

 

[heybraham]

Hypocrisy

we condemn terrorists for killing innocent civilians
yet we say it's alright to shoot an innocent suspect 5 times in the head (somethign like that)

are we hypocrites?

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

we condemn terrorists for killing innocent civilians
yet we say it's alright to shoot an innocent suspect 5 times in the head (somethign like that)

are we hypocrites?

Honestly. I shudder when people make comparisions like this, its a wonder that someone manages the ability to write yet somehow bypass the ability of having any sense. I am going to say the absolute obvious, but it seems people like heybraham need such simple information: The terrorists are out to kill the innocent people, they are attacking. the police in this case didn't find it fun, but given their circumstances thought he was about to harm others, they were defending. If you can't see past the end result and not explore the reasons behind it all, then your clearly are an idiot.

As i said, the police said it was regrettable and were clearly upset. they used far more words than merely shrugging it off as a mistake. If some people still believe the latter, then i suggest you do some reading before you make such stupid comments. I admit, there are questions as to why they let him go as far as he did if he was under suspicion, and the people responsible for that should be questioned and something should be released about that, but the policemen that did the shooting were given a situation that looked very wrong. He ran, and the police did say who they were.

Its easy to say now that it was wrong and the police should be charged, but he could easily have had a bomb, and his behaviour was just plain weird. If we had your way and the police pussy footed around, then people could have been killed.

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

Could you classify what you mean as "terrorists"?

If terrorists are out to kill innocent people then America is the biggest terrorist organisation in the world. They have killed countless INNOCENT Iraqi civilians.

Would you stick to one bloody argument at a time you moron. How does this relate to the case of the Brazillian man? The point is, the police thought he had a bomb with him. Your wankerish attempt to let fly any proposition that has 'terrorism' is pathetic. How is this even related to my argument? 'Americans are terrorists, therefore the police shouldnt have shot the guy?' 'Americans are terrorists therefore they should have let him go?' No really, please give me a clear sentence with how it ties to what i was saying? Because obviously there are implicit premises in how that relates to what i was saying that only your logic understands.

You are the idiot Cyan phoeniX. You are the one justifying the police shooting an innocent man five times in the head. And if the police had "pussy footed around" that man would still be alive.

No, i am justifying that it is wrong to let a suspected terrorist get away and it is wrong (more stupid actually) to run from the police like that. Now if your mind can handle that simple premise, lets continue to the situation which you fail to understand, rather you judge things as they are seen now. He ran and he was told to stop by police who told him that they were police. What people like you fail to see is that the police cant read minds. Your arguments are relevant now, but you cant manage to see into the circumstances that it took place in. He ran and they ran. Why should the police have stopped? Why should they have pussy footed around a person that had been under suspicion. To scream out 'because he is innocent' again you fail to see within a situation. What do you propose they had done? I never said it was right to shoot him 5 times, but its irrelvant how many times they did it. They kill him or not. They dont, then in their mind and in their situation he would have blown up the bomb.

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

Exactly man. People have to realise their is no justification for shooting an INNOCENT, UNARMED man five times in the head based on the conclusion he could be a "terrorist".

Proof that you cant see into a situation. He wasn't thought to be innocent or unarmed at the time. It is almost like you think they did it for shits and giggles.

 

[supercharged]

but he could easily have had a bomb, and his behaviour was just plain weird. If we had your way and the police pussy footed around, then people could have been killed.

His behaviour was just plain weird? What was weird about him?

He was just an innocent electrician doing his job who according to the cops, happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. Does simply wearing a jacket mean you've got a bomb and deserve a public execution? If that's the case, the police will be shooting plenty more people

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

Ok fuckwit, let me explain this to you.

You say that it is wrong to let a suspected terrorist get away. I didn't say that is was wrong. You then say it was stupid of him to run away. What your pissweak mind has failed to grasp is that HE WAS FROM BRAZIL. HE COULD NOT SPEAK ENGLISH. A person who had a crowd of people rushing at him and carrying guns in a situation in which he had absolutely no idea what they were doing, decided to run. A completely normal reaction, if you're sane.

You then say,why should the police have stopped? One which I agree to, they shouldn't have stopped. But instead of shooting him five times in the head, they could have shot him in the leg to prevent him from running.

You then touchingly conclude that it is irrelevant how many times they shot him. And to that I say you are a arsehole.

Good. You agree that the police should not have stopped. As i continue to say, it was tragic, but to put it bluntly, him being Brazilian, and in fact his whole circumstances of not being able to speak or understand english meant jackshit from the polices' perspective at that given moment. Your the one criticising the police, so you need to look at it from their perspective.

And i must stress out your pussy-footing approach and its options:
Thing is, if you shoot a guy in the leg, you will have to do it for a reason. You either think he is a terrorist or he isn't, there is no in-between. And by shooting him in the leg your saying he is a terrorist, which is risky because he can still blow people up. The police could either let him go or shoot to kill and kill him right. limited options really, but their situation required it. And counting bullets is just stupid.

Oh, and I still want to know the relevance of the 'US being terrorist' crap you talked about while quoting me. Or was that just to fill in the gaps to your ramble? Obviously the latter as you seemed to have ignored that.

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

His behaviour was just plain weird? What was weird about him?

He was just an innocent electrician doing his job who according to the cops, happened to be at the wrong place at the wrong time. Does simply wearing a jacket mean you've got a bomb and deserve a public execution? If that's the case, the police will be shooting plenty more people

i was talking about him running away. It would seem weird in the view of the police. I'm not touching on the rest, because the police didnt know that.

 

[tempco]

the possibility that the police were more likely to shoot someone because of the current situation is the thing that bothers me. it's quite possible that the person who did shoot him was caught in the moment, and didn't think things through - more of an emotional reaction, you could say. i mean, him shooting the guy 5-6 times in the head could possibly have come as a surprise to the other officers. this is where the pinning down of the suspect falls into place - why would they pin him down to shoot him in the head (as opposed to apprehending/arresting him) rather than just shoot him and avoid the risk of being hurt by the possible detonation of the bomb? (that's a whole lot of "possibles" )

that's the thing that bothers me the most. and hopefully, the investigation will paint a clearer picture of the events, assuming all parties involved are honest.

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

http://shakykaiser.com/blog/images/NottingHillGate.jpg

just a nice handy hint from the very kind people at the station. Could have been written better, but weh.

 

[NoOb_ceNtRAL]

i was talking about him running away. It would seem weird in the view of the police. I'm not touching on the rest, because the police didnt know that.

i can c wat the police were thinking. but RUNNING AWAY IS A NORMAL REACTION when like guys wif guns are after u!!! juss like freezing when on the road being approached by a speeding car!
dats not all! da guy wasnt even shot at a distance!!! he was tackled to the ground and then shot on the head 5 times!!! almost point blank range!!! this was the account frm witnesses. there is no explanation for it!

i reckon dis kill now think later iz a bullshit system. my sympathy towards the brazilian guy's relatives.

 

[tempco]

http://shakykaiser.com/blog/images/NottingHillGate.jpg

just a nice handy hint from the very kind people at the station. Could have been written better, but weh.

"...or look a bit foreign."

 

[Cyan_phoeniX]

i can c wat the police were thinking. but RUNNING AWAY IS A NORMAL REACTION when like guys wif guns are after u!!! juss like freezing when on the road being approached by a speeding car!
dats not all! da guy wasnt even shot at a distance!!! he was tackled to the ground and then shot on the head 5 times!!! almost point blank range!!! this was the account frm witnesses. there is no explanation for it!

i reckon dis kill now think later iz a bullshit system. my sympathy towards the brazilian guy's relatives.

I also have sympathy towards the guy and his relatives,and agree that he may have ran as a natural reaction! Just because i think that the police had to do what they did (which seems to be a minority view), doesn't mean i think he deserved it and doesn't take away the tragic part about it. And i equally hate the system, but i can't see much of an alternative. None of us are safe with this system, but i just think that we should blame the police's options on the scumy terrorists and not on the police themselves.