Should Muslim Holidays be recognised in Australia? (2 Viewers)

[baybeejulia]

Yeah, it'll be free because Australian tax payers will be paying for you and your ten bogan children to stay off the streets. Sheila, Stan, Toby, Shazza, Rob, Paul, Shazza 2, Mitch, Jason and Tyson.

lol funny that... considering im Egyptian, and we ethnics work harder than most australians. How many aussie doctors u seen around these days?

 

[Jeee]

lol funny that... considering im Egyptian, and we ethnics work harder than most australians. How many aussie doctors u seen around these days?

You're still a bogan in my eyes.
Dirty, racist and has no idea what's going on.

Broooo, I'm Palestinian, we're smarter than all you Arabs put together. We have the highest literacy rates in the land of ze Arabs. 92.4% whilst you Gypos are at 71.4%.

Eezayik kida?

 

[Napstar]

lol funny that... considering im Egyptian, and we ethnics work harder than most australians. How many aussie doctors u seen around these days?

I see plenty of Australian doctors.

Just because getting a medical licence in Egypt consists of operating on a camel and cutting a coupon out of a cereal box, doesn't mean that Australian's are too lazy to do a proper medical degree.

The worst doctor I ever met, the most incompetent and neglectful doctor, was an Egyptian, so stfu.

 

[Napstar]

Where was that doctor death from?

We refer to him as inasero on this website.


But the real Patel was Indian.

 

[Cookie182]

Un-Australian.

Please provide a working framework of "Australian".

 

[banco55]

You're still a bogan in my eyes.
Dirty, racist and has no idea what's going on.

Broooo, I'm Palestinian, we're smarter than all you Arabs put together.

That's not saying much.

You'll notice we only have these problems with muslim immigrants. I don't hear the chinese or the vietnamese, hindus etc. asking for their holidays to be made official holidays.

 

[Jeee]

That's not saying much.

You'll notice we only have these problems with muslim immigrants. I don't hear the chinese or the vietnamese, hindus etc. asking for their holidays to be made official holidays.

I don't agree with it either. Read my previous posts matey.

 

[Cyrus the Great]

muslims built this country.

 

[Cyrus the Great]

it should be "muslim nation building day"

 

[justanotherposter]

lol why are you against me? i'm arguing the same point as you..

No, she's not. She believes that religious holidays, Muslim or not, should be abolished - and she's right. You're a xenophobic redneck who thinks there shouldn't be any Muslim holidays because them islamz is afta ya. You've made so many crackpot comments and sweeping generalisations in this thread alone that it's fucking unbelievable.

 

[Jeee]

Well im glad you do..lol extremists, my bad.
Listen, i got three muslim girls in my religion class, they are three of the nicest girls i've ever met in my life. One of which i am extremly close with. I understand that Islam means peace and that most of you do not possess bad intentions, however, my desire to prevent islamic public holidays, is part of a larger desire to prevent any possibility of having to be opressed again by 'extremists'. Simply taking precautions.

Oh shut up you ignoramus.
Lettuce use your line of argument to show you just how trivial you are...: We must supress the continuation of Christmas and those devilish xmas stocktake sales, or the Ku Klux Klan will definitely rise and take to the streets.

 

[JonathanM]

No, she's not. She believes that religious holidays, Muslim or not, should be abolished - and she's right. You're a xenophobic redneck who thinks there shouldn't be any Muslim holidays because them islamz is afta ya. You've made so many crackpot comments and sweeping generalisations in this thread alone that it's fucking unbelievable.

She's not right. The religious holidays were put in by an establishment a long time ago (believe it or not, this country did have a large Christian majority), a majority they still maintain today and are today viewed by most Australians as secular holidays. Not only this, but they're also fully integrated into society now - our calendar year runs by them, our public and (most) private schools run their terms by them etc.

This has never been such a problem that people have had to come out and make enough of a raucous bitch about it to call a press conference (and why the fuck is the media paying attention to this nut?! If I want to see people on a soap box, I'll go watch The Life of Brian). I'm sick of all you apologists. Keysar Trad made another shit mistake saying this statement. Now stop going "oooooh, he's partly right." He's not. No one has a real problem with it as long as these holidays remain to be seen by the majority of Australians not as religious holidays, despite their guise, but as secular holidays.

Trad was supposedly talking for all minority faiths in Australia. I'm pretty sure he didn't consult them before saying "It does give the impression that we are a solely Christian nation and it raises the issue of other religions too, whether you are Hindu, Buddhist, Muslim." He would have found that no one really gives a shit. And no, it doesn't give the impression. You're just making the Muslim community in Australia look even worse by dragging this issue out.

Fuck's sake, I hope they get a new spokesperson.

 

[Napstar]

I am right.

And if you don't think I'm right, consider this:

My point of contention is not that these Christian holidays exist, I couldn't give a shit if Christians want to celebrate certain days. It's that the government is forcing businesses to cease operations on these holidays. Fuck off, if you're not a Christian, or you are a Christian but you want to trade on Christmas day, that's your prerogative. The Government has no right to make people cease trading on Christian holidays, just because the government is run by a bunch of wankers.

Look, straight from the horses mouth.

Christians in politics should stfu, and if they can't, they should know well enough than to impose their bullshit on everyone else.
The Christian and Politics | Learn more about the Bible | thisisyourbible.com

Secondly, given that these arseholes will never abolish stupid Christian holidays from the calendar, it doesn't mean that every other minority in the country should demand their stupid holidays be added to the calendar either. If there is a religious holiday that you want to observe, organise with your employer to take the day off. They can't rightly say no, to do so would be discriminatory; so long as it's organised and you just haven't bothered to show up.

Suck my dick basically Jonathon, just because these holidays were put in place by an establishment a long time ago, doesn't mean they still belong. You contradicted yourself anyway, you've just said Christians hold a majority today but most Australians view these holidays as secular. No they don't you fucking twat. What do all Australians, religious or not, identify Christmas and Easter day with? It's sure as shit not the Winter Solstice is it.

 

[Rasengan2dabalz]

We let these muslims into our Australia, and because of their fucking religion - most of them resort to using violence to make a point (plans to bomb the mcg, plans to attack army barracks etc) - which is a result of their religion clashing with the western type of culture/society. And now they want us to recognise one of their holidays! Why should we let this happen? Encouraging them to take days off and embrace their religion to another degree is only going to make matters worse.

And before one of you hippy's reply about "Not all muslims are bad", Yeah i know this, but because so many muslims are extremesitsts compared to other religion, they are a threat to everyone.

*end rant*

 

[Omie Jay]

And before one of you hippy's reply about "Not all muslims are bad", Yeah i know this, but because so many muslims are extremesitsts compared to other religion, they are a threat to everyone.

*end rant*

yea, all the prominent ones that appear on tv and the news are the extreme ones, and they give normal muslims (who dont appear on the news and who hate their guts) a bad name.

sux when that happens.

 

[Jeee]

most of them

Kewl move guy, making sweeping generalisations.

And before one of you hippy's reply about "Not all muslims are bad", Yeah i know this, but because so many muslims are extremesitsts compared to other religion, they are a threat to everyone.
*end rant*

Shit rant. Not even factual.

 

[Cookie182]

Kewl move guy, making sweeping generalisations.



Shit rant. Not even factual.

I'd argue that strict adherence to any religious doctrine is extreme.

The nature of Islam is that it is very much an extreme view. It makes huge claims for itself and suppresses criticism, albeit kills its own people for apostasy if Islamic law is in place.

Islam is plain and simple- it’s the final revelation from god. The rest are wrong. If you are a Muslim, you accept the claims of the Qu'ran and the Hadiths in their entirety, you live in an absolute world governed by universal rules and believe a paradise (or hell for a bad Muslim) awaits. To say anything less is non-Islamic. Most of you "Australian born/bred" Muslims are not TRUE Muslims if you say that you "give and take" with your practices yet still engage in much secular activity/don't take it all that serious. I apply the same criticism to "liberal Christians" who sometimes don't even accept that JC is the son of god, yet just claim to be Christian because they are "inspired by the moral philosophy of love your neighbour"- that's simply humanism though.

We have to at least have some set standard by which we can say someone belongs to a "religious label":

Being a good Muslim is about obedience and discipline, following the life of that the Prophet Mohammed (Peace Be upon Him) revealed as god’s path. “Islam” itself means spiritual surrender to god- this is meant to be “the ultimate peace”.

This is not a discriminatory opinion but rather a factual observation. True Islam is being practiced in the Middle East, under Sharia law. To compare Islam to anything less should be heresy for you. I think deep down most "Lebanese-born" Aussies who are Muslims know that in its true form, it’s an extreme religion to practice at the micro-level (which is what it should be done at, if you truly believe it!)

Look at the way of life in all those countries- religion dictates it. Islam is not a "Sunday morning philosophy"- it's a fundamental way of life for millions. Many "terrorists" sadly are probably 'good' people, yet they are indoctrinated into extremely hardline strict interpretations and simply following the calling of their holy book. In reviews I have read from scholars, most see not much difference between everyday practice of Islam in say Iran/Saudi and the "extremist" (terrorist practices) - they are separated little more by physical action. Read Ayaan Hirsi Hussan “Infidel” for a good insight (and honest) in growing up as a muslim in NE Africa- most children are raised to superstitiously “hate” the west, the sentiment among many communities was NOT condemnation of 9/11 (i.e. “lets blame the Jews” at the least not ourselves and in some cases "they deserved it").

This does obviously not just apply for Islam- as the true nature of any religion is extreme if properly practiced. Ask yourself, why shouldn’t it be? If you truly believe it to be the word of the almighty, other earthlings who dissent have little value.

The reason I call out Islam as being more extreme then any other religion in today’s context is it has much less “liberal” movements. Islam (despite the obvious divide) is still in a fairly “pure” form compared to Christianity. There is little doubt over how to live a “good” Muslim life and many governments are full on theocracies, the very definition of extremism.

Orthodox Jew sects in some communities also live extreme lives as well, as do many hardline American Christians, yet most of the governments in these nations are secular.

 

[Jeee]

I'd argue that strict adherence to any religious doctrine is extreme.

The nature of Islam is that it is very much an extreme view. It makes huge claims for itself and suppresses criticism, albeit kills its own people for apostasy if Islamic law is in place.

Islam is plain and simple- it’s the final revelation from god. The rest are wrong. If you are a Muslim, you accept the claims of the Qu'ran and the Hadiths in their entirety, you live in an absolute world governed by universal rules and believe a paradise (or hell for a bad Muslim) awaits. To say anything less is non-Islamic. Most of you "Australian born/bred" Muslims are not TRUE Muslims if you say that you "give and take" with your practices yet still engage in much secular activity/don't take it all that serious. I apply the same criticism to "liberal Christians" who sometimes don't even accept that JC is the son of god, yet just claim to be Christian becuase they are "inspired by the moral philosophy of love your neighbour"- that's simply humanism though.

We have to at least have some set standard by which we can say someone belongs to a "religious label":

Being a good muslim is about obedience and discipline, following the life of that the Prophet Mohammed (Peace Be Upon Him) revealed as god’s path. “Islam” itself means spiritual surrender to god- this is meant to be “the ultimate peace”.

This is not a discriminatory opinion but rather a factual observation. True Islam is being practiced in the Middle East, under Sharia law. To compare Islam to anything less should be heresy for you. I think deep down most "Lebanese-born" Aussies who are Muslims know that in its true form, it’s an extreme religion to practice at the micro-level (which is what it should be done at, if you truly believe it!)

Look at the way of life in all those countries- religion dictates it. Islam is not a "Sunday morning philosophy"- it's a fundamental way of life for millions. Many "terrorists" sadly are probably 'good' people, yet they are indoctrinated into extremely hardline strict interpretations and simply following the calling of their holy book. In reviews I have read from scholars, most see not much difference between everyday practice of Islam in say Iran/Saudi and the "extremist" (terrorist practices) - they are separated little more by physical action. Read Ayaan Hirsi Hussan “Infidel” for a good insight (and honest) in growing up as a muslim in NE Africa- most children are raised to superstitiously “hate” the west, the sentiment among many communities was NOT condemnation of 9/11 (i.e. “lets blame the Jews” at the least not ourselves and in some cases "they deserved it").

This does obviously not just apply for Islam- as the true nature of any religion is extreme if properly practiced. Ask yourself, why shouldn’t it be? If you truly believe it to be the word of the almighty, other earthlings who dissent have little value.

The reason I call out Islam as being more extreme then any other religion in today’s context is it has much less “liberal” movements. Islam (despite the obvious divide) is still in a fairly “pure” form compared to Christianity. There is little doubt over how to live a “good” muslim life and many governments are full on theocracies, the very definition of extremism.

Orthodox Jew sects in some communities also live extreme lives as well, as do many hardline American Christians, yet most of the governments in these nations are secular.

tl;dr

All I know is from what I've skimmed + some of your previous posts, that you have a whole lot of it wrong. I stress that Islam as practiced over-the-seas in countries such as Saudi Arabia for example, is not 'true' Islam. The way they govern their people is fallacious and contradictory.
You either understand that line of information or not. Not much else can be said.

And no, Islam when properly practiced is not extreme. If it were practiced properly, I guarantee you crazy Islamic fundies would be non-existent.
Plus, Ayaan Hirsi is an annoying little bitch who got a little confuzzled between Islam and what her crazy shit tribe do.

 

[Cookie182]

tl;dr

All I know is from what I've skimmed + some of your previous posts, that you have a whole lot of it wrong. I stress that Islam as practiced over-the-seas in countries such as Saudi Arabia for example, is not 'true' Islam. The way they govern their people is fallacious and contradictory.
You either understand that line of information or not. Not much else can be said.

And no, Islam when properly practiced is not extreme. If it were practiced properly, I guarantee you crazy Islamic fundies would be non-existent.
Plus, Ayaan Hirsi is an annoying little bitch who got a little confuzzled between Islam and what her crazy shit tribe do.

Once the apologist, always the apologist.

Obviously you can't be reasoned with. Try reading my full post and my other posts are always of the highest quality unlike your bias.

Islam was born and bred over there- I'm not saying that certain aspects aren't politicised i.e. the Shiite v Sunni split, a monarch ruling in Saudi, but you are quite very wrong. You’re bringing your Australian conceptions of secular freedom and thinking into it. It's exactly the same with liberal Christians"- I personally don't buy it. You either accept the fundamental "truths" of a philosophy or don't identify with it.

I am arguing that Islam in its nature is an extreme claim to make and the nature of practice is extreme if taken seriously. Are you questioning the legitimacy of Sharia law or actually suggesting the Qu'ran should not be taken literally? You should be stoned under a "true" paradigm.

Fulfilling the 5 pillars is a lifelong commitment- it’s not a day-time philosophy. Any one that lives and breathes an absolutist world-view down to the microcosm is extreme. Islam has no real recognised liberal movements. That is, try advocating for women's rights or homosexuality under Mullah’s over in the Middle East.

Yeah Ayaan is so confused...did you read the parts where she moved "out" of her tribe and into the Islamic world. That is, attending a muslim school during the rise of the Muslim Brotherhood in Kenya, her time in Ethopia (and the perceptions of Christians), the time in Saudi...that wasn't Islam either ey?

 

[Cookie182]

And please don't bring up Lebanon with "Christians and Muslims" living side-by-side, its a poor excuse for an Islamic country. The nation can't decide what it is. Probably a major reason why your here right now, not there.

Edit:

Define a "normal" (non-extreme)[ muslim life which is fully Qu'ranic.]