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We made a mistake with Rudd, didn't we? (5 Viewers)

Do you wish Howard had won the last election?

  • Yes. Howard was the man we need for the time.

    Votes: 0 0.0%

  • Total voters
    3

zstar

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No it wouldn't make a difference.

Howard initialized the surveillance state and sewed the seeds of big brother into our lives and he passed many laws that snooped into our very freedoms. He also started taxing the crap out of people in this country.

Kevin Rudd just took those policies and expanded it and took that 30 to a 110.

Neither of them care about personal liberties, They are just playing this BS opposition game to make us think we have a choice.
 

JohnMcGee

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moll the retard said:
Oh please. Quit bitching about nothing. No-one's forcing you to work on the weekend. Any work you do then is taken voluntarily, and you will be reimbursed with perfectly decent wages.
You are worthless scum. A part of the problem: Capital and the collection of profit is more important than quality of life. Money IS quality of life.

The weekend is a core recreational institution. We, the workers, deserve more money to work on the Sabbath day when we ought to be at home enjoying car racing on TV, going to the markets with our children and enjoying picnics in Centennial Park. Anyone who is in the position where work is required, or desired, on the weekends ought to be compensated for giving up their days of relaxation and recreation. This is your core fallacy. Without weekend penalty rates and so on, so forth, the wages paid are not "perfectly reasonable" but, rather, they are crude and disgraceful. You are treating all days as a tool of the bosses to rake in more profit, in the same way you treat the proletariat as a mere instrument to make more money. You do this because you are capitalist scum.

moll the capitalist scum said:
If you don't want to work for those wages get some more human capital and a better bargaining position or find a new job. If no-one is willing to work without weekend loading, then employers will be forced to bring it back anyway. And if they are willing, then obviously they want the job more than you and hence should get it.
Oh yes moll, because workchoices made it so easy for the decent, kind working class to engage in bargaining with their bosses, to secure more money. I mean, the destruction of unfair dismissal laws and the stripping of power from unions was designed to help the workers secure better conditions, wasn't it? You spout diarrhoea from your mouth like no other, sir! You are a disgraceful cancer not only upon NCAP, but you are a burden to a better society and you ought to be treated like the awful piece of tosh that you are. Under workchoices, it was impossible for workers to secure better conditions because the ruling class could simply dispose of their "human capital" and replace the honest worker with someone less headstrong who would be able to be bullied into accepting detestable working conditions that no worker ought to be in a position to accept. Herein lies the power of unions: Unions are designed to help the headstrong worker who, despite his personal ability, lacks the power to bargain for better conditions with his boss. But workchoices found the idea of a worker being able to bargain for fair working conditions to be offensive, and instead stripped unions of their power and denied workers any chance of securing a more comfortable, better reimbursed job.

moll said:
Furthermore, have you considered that, because they are not paying 50% extra for the two days of the weekend that they can now afford to give you about 15% extra on every single day of the week?
No I have not considered that moll because quite frankly, I know of no company who would be willing to do that. Instead of paying their profits to their employees, rewarding hard work and enabling workers to lead a comfortable, well earned lifestyle, companies would rather drive their profits into the ruling classes, further inflating an already porky bourgeoisie. Rewarding workers is not in the interests of unrestrained capitalism.

moll the uneducated said:
Well in that case it's also your democratic right to be unemployment.
It's your democratic right to go to school to improve those grammar skills, Mr. cancer.

moll the newfag said:
Also, If you think I'm a right-wing facist, you evidentally haven't listened to jennyfromdablock, Sylvester and Nolan talk about politics and economics. I'm a fucking socialist compared to them.
No I've been around for quite some time and have heard every vile capitalist argument that has spewed from the mouth of Messrs Zimmerman, Schroedinger, Simon, J. and the like.
 

mirakon

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John Howard was probably reasonable at maintaining a reasonable economic growth, however this was mainly due to the mining boom rather than Howard himself. He lacked the social reform needed in Ausralia that Rudd would have provided and his unethical Workchoices would have been of severe detriment to working class families in Australia.

Nevertheless, Rudd has been somewhat overestimated. His 'Education Revolution' has struggled to bring about any true practical reform and he is not applying sufficient pressure on the State government to lift their game. In other words, he is far too soft and lacks the toughness that Howard provided.

Abbotts an idiot throught and through, enough said.

If Turnball was still opposition leader, would have voted for him.
 

scuba_steve2121

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yea @ john

your entire argument is based on the assumption that all companies are pure evil and that capitalism at every level doesn't work.

i know moll and i know for a fact he is a government intervention loving socialist hippie but at least he seems to have a basic understanding of capitalism unlike u.

capitalism works, even regulated capitalism is better then no capitalism at all
 
Last edited:

JohnMcGee

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i'd like you to retract the statement that my words were poorly strung together. the form of that post was exquisite.
 

moll.

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well moll you are making sense and all but... wheres my name in that list I'm as capitalist as they come, include me plz :)

also id like to point out once more right wing and fascist doesn't make sense
I've never read anything you've written in NCAP, so I have no idea where your politics lies.

And it was John who referenced right-wing and facist first, not me.
 

moll.

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You are worthless scum. A part of the problem: Capital and the collection of profit is more important than quality of life. Money IS quality of life.

The weekend is a core recreational institution. We, the workers, deserve more money to work on the Sabbath day when we ought to be at home enjoying car racing on TV, going to the markets with our children and enjoying picnics in Centennial Park. Anyone who is in the position where work is required, or desired, on the weekends ought to be compensated for giving up their days of relaxation and recreation. This is your core fallacy. Without weekend penalty rates and so on, so forth, the wages paid are not "perfectly reasonable" but, rather, they are crude and disgraceful. You are treating all days as a tool of the bosses to rake in more profit, in the same way you treat the proletariat as a mere instrument to make more money. You do this because you are capitalist scum.



Oh yes moll, because workchoices made it so easy for the decent, kind working class to engage in bargaining with their bosses, to secure more money. I mean, the destruction of unfair dismissal laws and the stripping of power from unions was designed to help the workers secure better conditions, wasn't it? You spout diarrhoea from your mouth like no other, sir! You are a disgraceful cancer not only upon NCAP, but you are a burden to a better society and you ought to be treated like the awful piece of tosh that you are. Under workchoices, it was impossible for workers to secure better conditions because the ruling class could simply dispose of their "human capital" and replace the honest worker with someone less headstrong who would be able to be bullied into accepting detestable working conditions that no worker ought to be in a position to accept. Herein lies the power of unions: Unions are designed to help the headstrong worker who, despite his personal ability, lacks the power to bargain for better conditions with his boss. But workchoices found the idea of a worker being able to bargain for fair working conditions to be offensive, and instead stripped unions of their power and denied workers any chance of securing a more comfortable, better reimbursed job.



No I have not considered that moll because quite frankly, I know of no company who would be willing to do that. Instead of paying their profits to their employees, rewarding hard work and enabling workers to lead a comfortable, well earned lifestyle, companies would rather drive their profits into the ruling classes, further inflating an already porky bourgeoisie. Rewarding workers is not in the interests of unrestrained capitalism.



It's your democratic right to go to school to improve those grammar skills, Mr. cancer.



No I've been around for quite some time and have heard every vile capitalist argument that has spewed from the mouth of Messrs Zimmerman, Schroedinger, Simon, J. and the like.
lol.
Just lol.
 

Lauchlan

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It seems that most of us have all seen through the bs of the Labor government and miss the straightforward governing style of the Howard era, where the man didn't personally reach into our lives and try to control us.

So, people of BoS, do you wish the people of Australia had seen through Rudd's bullshit and kept the greatest PM of Australia, John Howard, in office?

If so, why?

If not, justify.
You're asking me to justisfy when you didn't even when putting across your view.
First of all, GIVE EXAMPLES of so-called 'Labor gov't bs' and I will put forward an argument.
Secondly, what the hell do you mean by "straightforward governing style of the Howard era". Do you mean that its good for a PM to do absolutely nothing in attempt to benefit working families?
Thirdly, you say "control us". You really need to work on how you word and present your argument, because that is a vast exxageration and you know it.
The only thing I can justify in attempt to argue against this is:
  • How is introducing WorkChoices NOT reaching into our working lives and trying to control us by giving our employers more rights over us and taking our rights away????? Answer that!
  • How is ripping $1BILLION from the public hospital system 'straightforward governing'?????? Answer that, I have more questions but answer these satisfactorily and justify your answer, provide examples and evidence. So far you have proven you're a pretty ill-informed citizen.
 

Lauchlan

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WorkChoices was economically brilliant legislation that Howard fucked up delivery of.
Reconciliation with Aborigines for what? I haven't done anything bad to them.
Rudd fucked up the response to the recession. He had 50 billion dollars of taxpayer money to spend on whatever the fuck he wanted, outside of normal budget expenditure, AND the overwhelming popular support to do it. So what does he do? He fucking built school halls and gave the cash away in one big chunk.

Just let the adults discuss this one, Jimmy.
John Howard - the greatest PM...... NO WAY.
He did horribly with Work Choices. Wow that really makes him look good. Great argument there.
And you are obviously ignorant like many other Australians. If one generation pretends they didn't do anything, we, as the next, need to make them (in theory, us) accountable. Its the power of words and policy. Rudd wasn't asking you to apoligise to every Aborigine you see. He was asking you to show a shread of moral fibre. Obviously you're as pathetic as people with racist/sexist/ignorant opinions.
Rudd generally did well with the recession, compared to other countries. Stop winging you baby.
 

thongetsu

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WorkChoices was economically brilliant legislation that Howard fucked up delivery of.
Reconciliation with Aborigines for what? I haven't done anything bad to them.
Rudd fucked up the response to the recession. He had 50 billion dollars of taxpayer money to spend on whatever the fuck he wanted, outside of normal budget expenditure, AND the overwhelming popular support to do it. So what does he do? He fucking built school halls and gave the cash away in one big chunk.

Just let the adults discuss this one, Jimmy.
Your ancestors have done the aboriginal wrong.
If Rudd hadn't spent 50 billion dollars of tax payer money we would be in a recession and a myriad of jobs would be lost. In economics, it is good to spend during a recession to create stimulation for the economy. What would you spend 50 billion dollars if not school infrastructure?

How about the adults get a fucken life, Douche.
 

Lauchlan

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your ancestors have done the aboriginal wrong.
If rudd hadn't spent 50 billion dollars of tax payer money we would be in a recession and a myriad of jobs would be lost. In economics, it is good to spend during a recession to create stimulation for the economy. What would you spend 50 billion dollars if not school infrastructure?

How about the adults get a fucken life, douche.
hear hear!
 

Lauchlan

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so its high economic freedom and little social freedom vs. little economic freedom and little social freedom?

obviously Howard is terrible, but how could you not have wanted him to win with knowledge of Rudd's time as prime minister?
i dont want him if it were tony abbott v. john howard. thats how much i dislike his policy and political failure.
 

scuba_steve2121

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Your ancestors have done the aboriginal wrong.
If Rudd hadn't spent 50 billion dollars of tax payer money we would be in a recession and a myriad of jobs would be lost. In economics, it is good to spend during a recession to create stimulation for the economy. What would you spend 50 billion dollars if not school infrastructure?

How about the adults get a fucken life, Douche.
read an Austrian school economics textbook please
 

aussie-boy

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your name is a bit of a misnomer isn't it?
Nope, my family has lived here since the mid 1800s... white people are allowed to support Asian language teaching as well

So why does Rudd allow him to remain a key minister.
I wouldnt be surprised if he got dumped in a post-election cabinet reshuffle, as a way of getting rid of a shit policy and shit minister at the same time

Nice made up statistic. Its probably got some truth to it, but most Australians polled actually oppose a compulsory filter because they know it won't work.
Simply wrong. Hungry beast survey found 86% of Australians in favour of a compulsory filter; most online surveys are unreliable because they are answered by people comfortable with going beyond checking email etc

---

ETS was hollow symbolism which gave the coal industry almost all of their current output in free permits.

Woefully mismanaged. Schools with 17 kids who already had a library were getting a second one built instead of a hall like they requested.

At a mind boggling cost, several times the quote for what the private sector would do it for.

Half our kids don't know the difference between there/they're/their ~priorities~

It's not health care reform. It's ripping funds out of the states and redistributing them in the exact same way.

It was done months ago, he still hasn't released it. How can you tell it's revolutionary?

Jesus Christ you're ignorant.

My trot girlfriend: "Every time I see Rudd on TV talking to foreign diplomats I feel embarrassed that this gimp is representing Australia. He's so insipid and plastic."
The ETS is a far right policy - it disregards any solution involving tangible regulation. It's a bit retarted that you should label me a "labor member" when I support it.

You're a complete fool... do you not realise that the alternative to wasteful Gov spending is 0 spending at all? Do you seriously think so many public infrastructure improvements would have been done by a Howard/Costello Gov?

And how can you deny that its healthcare reform? These policies are a direct result on the latest inter-generational report which shows spending to be completely unsustainable... something MUST be done - Abbott has 0 alternatives.

Finally, substantial bits of the Henry review have been leaked, and they are quite groundbreaking... you obviously have no idea on this thing
 

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