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Shootings and Explosions in Paris (2 Viewers)

classicjimbo

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@everyone but mainly that yr 10 kid Asghar for starting it up

"Can’t we wait until we’ve resolved the body count? Until the identities of all of the victims have been determined and their families informed? Until the sirens stop wailing? Until the blood is dry?

Or must we instantly bootstrap obliquely related agendas and utterly unconnected grievances to the carnage in Paris, responding to it with an unsavory opportunism instead of a respectful grief?

...

On Saturday morning I read that Paris was going to be good for Republicans. I read that Paris was going to be good for Democrats.

I felt sick. For a few hours, even a few days, I’d like to focus on the pain of Parisians and how that magnificent city reclaims any sense of order, any semblance of safety. I’d like not to wonder if Hillary Clinton’s odds of election just ticked upward or downward or if Donald Trump’s chest-thumping bluster suddenly became more seductive.

I’d like not to be told, fewer than 18 hours after the shots rang out, how they demonstrate that Americans must crack down on illegal immigration to our own country. I read that and was galled, and not because of my feelings about immigration, but because of my feelings about the automatic, indiscriminate politicization of tragedy.

It’s such a disrespectful impulse.

And it’s such an ugly one
."

http://www.nytimes.com/2015/11/14/opinion/the-exploitation-of-paris.html?mwrsm=Facebook&_r=0
 
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mcchicken

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you can stop stupid people entering the country in the first place
well...stop more from coming in? Its not like 'well we've already got dumb people so it doesnt matter how many more we get'.
not really. build secure fences and stop the boats.
terrorism is only going to occur more frequently from now on, and will get more and more frequent as long as europe keeps its borders open
Really? Your solution to stopping a handful of terrorist attacks is to prevent millions of people from accessing the shelter and safety they are entitled to by the UDHR? Have you watched documentaries like 'Go Back to Where You Came From'? Have you seen the conditions they are forced to reside in? That is not living because that is not what life is. It's scarcely worse than human puppy mills jfc and you don't seem to be giving a fuck because... why? I am assuming you're just racist because you're not really presenting any other options. But please, do enlighten me.

The problem is not "radicalisation..." The problem is Islam...
The religion, not the people... And yeah, can't argue with that logic, just look at the Middle East at the moment...
What about all the wars and violence at the hands of Christianity? Do you not remember the Crusades?
What about all of the wars and violence and atrocities that occurred at the hands of openly Christian/non-Muslim men? Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, the near genocide of Aboriginal Australians? The problem is not Islam. Terrorist groups fighting in the name of Islam do not represent the whole religion just as the West Boro Baptist Church monkeys prancing about with their homophobic bs at funerals do not represent Christianity. Again, I am just going to assume you are blatantly racist unless you can respond to FK's question below and prove you're basing your statements on fact, not prejudice.

Can you at least explain how Islam is the problem here? Where in the Qur'an does it justify the incident that happened in Paris today?
 

wannaspoon

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I think you're just trolling for reactions from muslims at this point
He's not... The Quran calls for the preservation of the Islamic Faith by violence and for the death of those who are non believers... Those who choose to leave the faith are condemned to death if you follow the text...

I fail to see why I should be tolerant to a faith that is clearly not tolerant to anyone... I fail to see why I should be apologetic to a faith that condones violence...
 

mcchicken

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He's not... The Quran calls for the preservation of the Islamic Faith by violence and for the death of those who are non believers... Those who choose to leave the faith are condemned to death if you follow the text...

I fail to see why I should be tolerant to a faith that is clearly not tolerant to anyone... I fail to see why I should be apologetic to a faith that condones violence...
RE:

Can you at least explain how Islam is the problem here? Where in the Qur'an does it justify the incident that happened in Paris today?
 

mcchicken

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Can't argue with facts... The matter speaks for itself, there is a massive elephant in the room for the Islamic faith...

http://www.state.gov/j/ct/rls/crt/2013/224831.htm

Not a lot of "non Islamic terrorism" in those figures... Face the facts, and look at the obvious, there is a problem with Islam...
I'm not talking about violence in 2013, I am talking about the past thousand years.
Obviously in recent years there has been more conflict in the Middle East (partly due to the actions of those countries, partly due to Western non-Islamic interference), so looking at statistics for 1 year does not support your argument.
 

Queenroot

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Don't forget the massive intelligence failure on the part of the French. How come many terrorists were able to carry explosives and sophisticated weapons at multiple locations without anyone's knowing?

Perhaps this sort of thing is relatively easy to carry out in the US with its retarded gun laws but in France of all places? I dunno.

These incidents are so routine now, a few weeks or months without one and you just start wondering what the next target will be..
They probably didn't give af
 

Kolmias

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Such terrible news. My thoughts go out to the families of the victims.
 

Rafy

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'Extremist mosques to be closed in France'
The French government is taking immediate steps to crackdown on radical extremists living in France.
Extremist mosques will likely be closed by the French Government, the French Minister for the Interior Bernard Cazeneuve has promised, reported Liberation, a French-language newspaper.
Using the Government's emergency powers, Mr Cazeneuve said the government would dissolve or close mosques that preached hatred. He said the process had already begun.
The president Francois Holland and the former president Sarkozy also proposed
placing all people with an "S"(State Security) file under house arrest or making them wear electronic bracelets.
Mr Sarkozy said there were 11,500 people who had the 'S' file". He told France's TF1 television that "all those who were behind the recent attacks" had an S file.
He said it would help police to "know where these people are, what they do, and assess the danger".


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/paris-a...terrorists-20151115-gkzn0z.html#ixzz3rbgW5IQ1
 

durrrrr

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Really? Your solution to stopping a handful of terrorist attacks is to prevent millions of people from accessing the shelter and safety they are entitled to by the UDHR?
Most of the migrants aren't refugees. They make it to safe countries and demand to go to welfare states like sweden and germany. They're economic migrants.

Wealthy arab states are the ones who need to take care of the genuine refugees.

Just because they're not all terrorists, doesn't mean they arent doing harm. Muslim immigrants are grossly overrepresented in violent crime statistics, especially theft, assault and sexual assault. Muslims have turned sweden into the rape capital of europe.


Have you watched documentaries like 'Go Back to Where You Came From'? Have you seen the conditions they are forced to reside in? That is not living because that is not what life is. It's scarcely worse than human puppy mills jfc and you don't seem to be giving a fuck because... why? I am assuming you're just racist because you're not really presenting any other options. But please, do enlighten me.
If we let all these people into the west, then the west will merely become third-world too. They have to improve their own countries. There is no alternative.

What about all the wars and violence at the hands of Christianity? Do you not remember the Crusades?
The crusades were a response to imperialistic muslims who had violently conquered 2/3rds of christian lands by the time the conquests had begun.


What about all of the wars and violence and atrocities that occurred at the hands of openly Christian/non-Muslim men?
Muslims have historically oppressed europeans and we have a right to resist their continued imperialism and violence.

Hitler, Stalin, Mussolini, the near genocide of Aboriginal Australians? The problem is not Islam. Terrorist groups fighting in the name of Islam do not represent the whole religion just as the West Boro Baptist Church monkeys prancing about with their homophobic bs at funerals do not represent Christianity.
The fact that your example of bad christians is people who are mean to gay people proves the moral superiority of christians. NEWS FLASH: Homosexuals are imprisoned in 30/50 muslim majority countries. These are not extremist groups, these are entire fucking countries with government policies supported by the majority.

Again, I am just going to assume you are blatantly racist unless you can respond to FK's question below and prove you're basing your statements on fact, not prejudice.
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
 

durrrrr

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Christians are the most persecuted religious group in the world because of muslims and yet muslims are more concerned about terrorists making islam look bad.
 

mcchicken

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Most of the migrants aren't refugees. They make it to safe countries and demand to go to welfare states like sweden and germany. They're economic migrants.
You said close the borders:
terrorism is only going to occur more frequently from now on, and will get more and more frequent as long as europe keeps its borders open
Wealthy arab states are the ones who need to take care of the genuine refugees.
If we let all these people into the west, then the west will merely become third-world too. They have to improve their own countries. There is no alternative.
I'm sure if you were one of those people living half a life, you'd be saying the exact opposite. I'm not dumb, obviously it's economically impossible for countries who take in refugees to be able to support each and every person seeking asylum - but saying alright well this ain't my problem doesn't help either. It's a horrible, messy situation with the only answer being peace, and the journey towards it will be long and arduous but that doesn't mean there is nothing we can do in the mean time, however major or minor those actions may be.

The fact that your example of bad christians is people who are mean to gay people proves the moral superiority of christians. NEWS FLASH: Homosexuals are imprisoned in 30/50 muslim majority countries. These are not extremist groups, these are entire fucking countries with government policies supported by the majority.
Mate I could not care less about the moral superiority of Christianity. Both religions preach peace and love, and both religions preach bigotry (sexism, homophobia, racism, you name it). It was illegal to be gay in western countries not 40 years ago which isn't a very long time IMO, and the fact that we still don't have marriage equality in Australia proves to me that all countries are capable of bigot government policies supported by, what, 42%? That's not far off from 51% unfortunately.

Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Muslims are not a race
Calm your farm - you think being a bigot is any better than being a racist?
 

hayabusaboston

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So I think its kinda like this maybe. Who knows.
Matrix. Anyone in it can turn into agent at any time, by "forcible coercion" shall we say of the Agent program.
Radicalism. Anyone in any religion can turn radical at any time.
Islamic radicalism in particular has demonstrated itself to be of particular concern.
ie people who follow islam can be treated with particular concern.


I mean is it racist/inhumane/bigotry to create security measures/be wary of something that has PROVEN itself to be a concern?

After all in the Matrix, you had to be wary of everyone. Thats not discriminating against the whole world, thats simply preparing yourself for the possibility of encountering a very real, very well known danger.

To put into simpler words so I am not screamed at for being horrendous racist bigot pig, you dont know who can be an agent, likewise you dont know who can be a radical. The radicals that cause damage "tend to be" islamic according to statistics. Therefore there is nothing wrong with being prepared for the possibility that any muslim can be a radical. Being prepared is not being discriminatory.


Im like confused here, I dont know how much detail I have to go into before the typical people who disagree with me actually understand what I say hah. Instead of disregarding me completely based of superficial understanding of my comments.

I wonder what wild interpretations and ridiculous judgements will come from Kiraken et al. Lel.

I'd like to add, this applies to any radical groups/criminals/dangers in the world. Its a pretty fundamental instinct of self preservation so you'd have to be a complete tool to ignore/deny it. AN EXAMPLE TO SOFTEN THE WORDS, you must always be prepared for the possibility that a christian priest is a pedophile. Stats show it to be a real problem.


#imjustusinglogicalthinkinghere
#nekminnitkirakensayspseudointellectualbullshit
#kiradontgeddit
 
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hayabusaboston

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What I struggle to understand is how muslims and left wing can label right wing and critical thinkers as "racists and bigots" when we are simply laying down the facts and statistics and why x is a problem and here is list y of possible solutions. What the fuck is racist/bigoted about that? Its no argument whatsoever and makes any intelligent person want to punch you in the face

YOURE A RACIST
YOURE A BIGOT

*punches face*

its plain wrong tbh, SURE THERE ARE MASSIVE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE WHO ARE NATURALLY SIMPLY PREJUDICED AGAINST MUSLIMS and a bunch of other groups, they arent the intelligent ones. Right wing has plenty of retards too. Those prejudiced peasants can go burn in hell.

But what you cannot do

is call racist and bigot

on the person/s who is/are doing nothing more than laying down the truth.

That is ignorance and stupidity at its finest.
 

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