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The Beijing Olympics (4 Viewers)

Aryanbeauty

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

anti-hypocritic said:
1.Where do you get that data?

2.I admit Chinese legal system has problems. But you must understand that the law is directly linked to one country's tradition and custom, something you think common sense may not be so common in other countries.
Communism and its repressive policy is hardly chinese custom nor tradition.

3.Wikipedia is surely a great innovation. But it is basically edited and reviewed by english-speaking people. It can not represent the view of the "whole world", especially on topics about non-science disciplines.

What I don't like is you equate the West to "the world", this is obviously not true.
Surely people can express their views on Wikipedia than banning or blocking expression of their views of filtering any information about tibetan protest for 1.3 billion chinese.

You are also enjoying those freedom such as reading wikipedia, CNN, BBC and other dissenting views NOT just your government propaganda here in australia which are not available to 1.3 billion chinese time and time again.
 

Slidey

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

anti-hypocritic said:
1.Where do you get that data?
Human rights organisations and Chinese refugees mostly. You can research it yourself if you don't believe me; I'm not going to sit here giving a reference for every criticism of China - I'd be here all day.

2.I admit Chinese legal system has problems. But you must understand that the law is directly linked to one country's tradition and custom, something you think common sense may not be so common in other countries.
I'm pretty sure communism isn't Chinese tradition; it's flaws in Chinese culture that lead to communism getting a foothold in the first place, but communism certainly isn't Chinese culture.

Anyhoo, the Chinese government actively acknowledges the widespread problems with its legal system, and "aims to fix it", much like they claim China "values freedom of speech and freedom of the press".

3.Wikipedia is surely a great innovation. But it is basically edited and reviewed by english-speaking people.
What? No. It's got versions in pretty much every language, and just as many editors from such languages.

Are you claiming the points made in wikipedia are wrong? Which ones? Most of it is simply quoting the Chinese government or reporting on trends in China, good or bad.

As I said, it seems like whenever something criticises China, it is automatically biased and incorrect to you.

It can not represent the view of the "whole world", especially on topics about non-science disciplines.
If you'd bother to read it, it actually does. It's got strict neutrality and viewpoint balance policies.

Not to mention that if you don't like wikipedia, you can check the sources at the bottom of each page. But let me guess - they're all biased?

What I don't like is you equate the West to "the world", this is obviously not true.
Oh where did I do this?
 

Dongle

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

My two cents:

Sure, it's alright to hate the government of China, but do you have any right to deprive 1.3 billion 'oppressed' people of the right to hold the Olympics? Furthermore, what about those athletes who've trained for 4 years of their lives?

Which country doesn't deploy riot police when people start burning shops, looting, and killing innocent bystanders, including both Han Chinese and Tibetans? I wouldn't trust the heavy spin any bullshit Western media would feed to me these day. You always have to takes matters of moral relativity with a grain of salt before you jump on the 'FREE TIBET' bandwagon.

Moreover, how many of you actually give a shit about the average Tibetan? Methinks it's more of a chance for moral posturing and hypocrisy. Why doesn't poverty created by corruption in Africa get more attention? FREE AFRICA FROM POVERTY AND CORRUPTION? The Tibetans may be religiously suppressed, but at least they're not starving to death in droves....

Cultural genocide? Hah. Don't make me laugh. Monastaries still exist. The culture still exists, and I don't think it's in any precarious position of being wiped out anytime soon. Practically, the Chinese government probably sees more value in giving cultural freedom to maintain ethnic appeasement, as long as there's no CIA-backed undertones of seccionism which the Dalai Lama has been giving out. You don't see the Chinese army just roll up in trucks, Nazi-style, pulling the poor Tibetans out of their houses, sending them to concentration camps, and exterminating them all, do you? Sure, a few may go to jail on unreasonable grounds, but isn't that the same for dissidents all over China? Would you feel the same overblown sympathy for dissident Chinese as well? Such is the one-dimensional, self-righteous, hypocritical morality FREE TIBET people have..... Moral high grounds are hard to find in an indifferent and immoral world these days...yet some people pretend to have one to give lip service to their self-righteous egos.

Anyway, I think Americans should all jump into the sea. Because they colonalised the poor, brave, spiritually enlightened American Indians. Same for the Israelis who just walked into the Middle East and felt like starting a country because it was their self-proclaimed Holy Land. FREE THE APACHE AND THE CHEROKEE AND THE PALESTINIANS AND ABORIGINES WHATEVER OTHER PEOPLE IN THE ENTIRE COURSE OF HUMAN HISTORY THAT HAVE BEEN INVADED AND POORLY TREATED BY ANOTHER RACE *joking* If the world actually worked like that, I would be astounded. Because every country acts in its own self-interest. Now I know some of you people would say that native people have been delivered a high standard of living and rights. But what about alcholism, gambling and whatever that's so prolific in Aboriginal and Native Indian communities? Ethnic marginalisation is bound to occur whenever one race dominates another. Get over it.

Here's an extract from the Kentucky Kernel:

"What bothers me more is the self-righteous Westerners' failure to examine themselves in the same light. One cannot dispute that China has a shaky record on human rights, but one would be equally ignorant to say that the West, particularly the United States, has a human rights record to be proud of.

Currently, the United States and the rest of the "coalition forces" remain in Iraq, locked in a five-year-old war that, if presidential hopeful Sen. John McCain has his way in the election, may last another 100 years.

According to a September 2007 survey by Opinion Research Business, the estimated total number of war casualties in Iraq since the 2003 invasion exceeded 1.2 million. Reports of U.S. soldiers and mercenaries committing atrocious crimes surface regularly, yet the so-called human rights advocates don't seem to care.

One doesn't hear calls to investigate the United States' handling of the war and the staggering civilian casualties, yet riots in Tibet can raise overwhelming sympathy and finger-pointing from the West. It's safe to say that Beijing doesn't have the patent to hypocrisy.

Countries act in their self-interests. Sometimes such acts are controversial, and often one country's self-interest conflicts with others'. China is no exception, but at least it doesn't cry foul at the first news a controversy emerges in another country. The West should do the same."
 

Collin

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Dongle said:
My two cents:

Sure, it's alright to hate the government of China, but do you have any right to deprive 1.3 billion 'oppressed' people of the right to hold the Olympics? Furthermore, what about those athletes who've trained for 4 years of their lives?

Which country doesn't deploy riot police when people start burning shops, looting, and killing innocent bystanders, including both Han Chinese and Tibetans? I wouldn't trust the heavy spin any bullshit Western media would feed to me these day. You always have to takes matters of moral relativity with a grain of salt before you jump on the 'FREE TIBET' bandwagon.

Moreover, how many of you actually give a shit about the average Tibetan? Methinks it's more of a chance for moral posturing and hypocrisy. Why doesn't poverty created by corruption in Africa get more attention? FREE AFRICA FROM POVERTY AND CORRUPTION? The Tibetans may be religiously suppressed, but at least they're not starving to death in droves....

Cultural genocide? Hah. Don't make me laugh. Monastaries still exist. The culture still exists, and I don't think it's in any precarious position of being wiped out anytime soon. Practically, the Chinese government probably sees more value in giving cultural freedom to maintain ethnic appeasement, as long as there's no CIA-backed undertones of seccionism which the Dalai Lama has been giving out. You don't see the Chinese army just roll up in trucks, Nazi-style, pulling the poor Tibetans out of their houses, sending them to concentration camps, and exterminating them all, do you? Sure, a few may go to jail on unreasonable grounds, but isn't that the same for dissidents all over China? Would you feel the same overblown sympathy for dissident Chinese as well? Such is the one-dimensional, self-righteous, hypocritical morality FREE TIBET people have..... Moral high grounds are hard to find in an indifferent and immoral world these days...yet some people pretend to have one to give lip service to their self-righteous egos.

Anyway, I think Americans should all jump into the sea. Because they colonalised the poor, brave, spiritually enlightened American Indians. Same for the Israelis who just walked into the Middle East and felt like starting a country because it was their self-proclaimed Holy Land. FREE THE APACHE AND THE CHEROKEE AND THE PALESTINIANS AND ABORIGINES WHATEVER OTHER PEOPLE IN THE ENTIRE COURSE OF HUMAN HISTORY THAT HAVE BEEN INVADED AND POORLY TREATED BY ANOTHER RACE *joking* If the world actually worked like that, I would be astounded. Because every country acts in its own self-interest. Now I know some of you people would say that native people have been delivered a high standard of living and rights. But what about alcholism, gambling and whatever that's so prolific in Aboriginal and Native Indian communities? Ethnic marginalisation is bound to occur whenever one race dominates another. Get over it.

Here's an extract from the Kentucky Kernel:

"What bothers me more is the self-righteous Westerners' failure to examine themselves in the same light. One cannot dispute that China has a shaky record on human rights, but one would be equally ignorant to say that the West, particularly the United States, has a human rights record to be proud of.

Currently, the United States and the rest of the "coalition forces" remain in Iraq, locked in a five-year-old war that, if presidential hopeful Sen. John McCain has his way in the election, may last another 100 years.

According to a September 2007 survey by Opinion Research Business, the estimated total number of war casualties in Iraq since the 2003 invasion exceeded 1.2 million. Reports of U.S. soldiers and mercenaries committing atrocious crimes surface regularly, yet the so-called human rights advocates don't seem to care.

One doesn't hear calls to investigate the United States' handling of the war and the staggering civilian casualties, yet riots in Tibet can raise overwhelming sympathy and finger-pointing from the West. It's safe to say that Beijing doesn't have the patent to hypocrisy.

Countries act in their self-interests. Sometimes such acts are controversial, and often one country's self-interest conflicts with others'. China is no exception, but at least it doesn't cry foul at the first news a controversy emerges in another country. The West should do the same."
Hear hear.
 

Collin

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

romancandle said:
Should Australia boycott the Beijing Olympics because of the on going human rights violations china commits, especially cocerning Tibet and religious practices?
No.
 

chicky_pie

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

I think Australia should be cautious of China, because Kevin Rudd can speak Chinese, and there's so many fucking Chinese people coming here more than any other Asian neighbours, we'd probably end up like Taiwan. China wants to take over Australia, because we have everything what they don't have; i.e clean air.
 

dannynsw

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

chicky_pie said:
I think Australia should be cautious of China, because Kevin Rudd can speak Chinese, and there's so many fucking Chinese people coming here more than any other Asian neighbours, we'd probably end up like Taiwan. China wants to take over Australia, because we have everything what they don't have; i.e clean air.
^Possibly one of the more racist comments I have seen.^

I havn't had time to read this whole thread, and I accept that I may have missed some things in the discussion, but I will say this: Whether you think what China is doing in Tibet is right or wrong, the fact is that the Tibetan people don't like it. Riots and protests all over the world (there was a peaceful protest in Sydey recently) are evidence of this. The Chinese government WILL listen to global public opinion, and do care about international relations. If you, like me, believe what the Chinese are doing is unethical visit www.avaaz.org and sign the petition. It might not do much, but surely it's better than nothing.

Danny
 
Last edited:

Slidey

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

dannynsw said:
^Possibly one of the more racist comments I have seen.^
Sure, but does that make it inherently incorrect?
 

dannynsw

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Slidey said:
Sure, but does that make it inherently incorrect?
No, it doesn't. But I don't think insulting a whole nation is getting anyone anywhere, nor is it respectful to the majority of China's population, who I am sure do not want to "...take over Australia."
 

Slidey

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

dannynsw said:
No, it doesn't. But I don't think insulting a whole nation is getting anyone anywhere, nor is it respectful to the majority of China's population, who I am sure do not want to "...take over Australia."
Yeah people often confuse the Chinese people with the Chinese government.

Probably because the Chinese people rarely speak out against their government.
 

ippie

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Fuck man, you cant say China is shit or whatever just by posting links of wiki articles about "bad" shit the Chinese govt as done/is doing. Ok yes I do not agree with communisim, or their censorship policies.

Chinese people do so speak out against their govt. They're not like communist anymore, if you've heard. And they don't get flamed.

But for crying out loud, ALL COUNTRIES have done "bad shit". Ohhh let's boycott America for invading Iraq. Let's boycott our own govt for the stuff about the lost generation.

From what I gather, you either don't want the fucking Olympics to happen, or you have some weird shit against China.
 

Slidey

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

ippie said:
Chinese people do so speak out against their govt.
Yes. Then they get put in jail.


They're not like communist anymore, if you've heard. And they don't get flamed.
I'm glad they don't get flamed! That's important!

P.S. they are still communist. Check your facts.
 

Dongle

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Slidey said:
Yes. Then they get put in jail.




I'm glad they don't get flamed! That's important!

P.S. they are still communist. Check your facts.
I think she meant that the economy isn't communist anymore. The political and economic system I would describe China with is capitalist, authoritarian state - not some sort of 1980's Soviet agrarian state. I think it's pretty safe to say that wealth isn't just randomly distributed from the rich to the peasants. There's still some collective ownership of heavy industries by the government, but it's gradually being phased out by more efficient private ownership.
 

frankenstein

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

What a shame, shame on the world.

The olympics were created to lower/stop tension/war/bloodshed.

Welldone human kind!
 
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Re: Boycott of Olympics

frankenstein said:
What a shame, shame on the world.

The olympics were created to lower/stop tension/war/bloodshed.

Welldone human kind!
yeah but do things ever work the way they've been designed to?

Olympics = just another way for nations to compete against one another in a bid to prove their superiority in another field. The Olympics (and all world sporting events generally) are better designed to unify the nation in support for their athletes.
 
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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Well I'm not sure what the people of Tibet have up their arses so I can't comment there.
I can say however that there is 100% no point boycotting the Olympics the athletes have worked too hard and China would probably try to invade us.
Although they would probably come at as with their finest weapon a population beyond any form of control, oh wait... thats whats happening now.
 

ippie

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

Dongle said:
I think she meant that the economy isn't communist anymore. The political and economic system I would describe China with is capitalist, authoritarian state - not some sort of 1980's Soviet agrarian state. I think it's pretty safe to say that wealth isn't just randomly distributed from the rich to the peasants. There's still some collective ownership of heavy industries by the government, but it's gradually being phased out by more efficient private ownership.
Thanks Dongle.

And if you look up wiki, since you like that site so much, Slidey, it says that China's govt is "Socialist Republic".
 

mingis

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Re: Boycott of Olympics

ok..

well, i read the whole thread, and am still struggling to believe no one suggested a symbolic move.. someone got close with the banner, i think that is a good idea...

how about boycott the opening ceremony?

no, you wont cripple the economy
no, china wont be furious at us, or the rest of the western bloc, embarassed i would say.

yes, they will see we are serious, and yes they will realise this could develop further.

and yes, you can still watch it on telly.

there was no need to go so deep into the crap that got dragged into it, but answer the question.

the aim of a boycott would be to make a difference. obviously not possible in one move, but start the ball rolling.

tell me if it is stupid.
peace
 

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